Becoming a breeder the right way....I hope - Page 3 - German Shepherd Dog Forums
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post #21 of 42 (permalink) Old 05-24-2016, 04:28 PM
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I have no reason to be here other than to try and help you. If I said anything wrong in your opinion I apologize. Again, I wish you the best of luck in all you do!

Signing off!
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post #22 of 42 (permalink) Old 05-24-2016, 04:54 PM
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OP, you seem to have a good attitude, even when people aren't being kind to you. I applaud you for trying to learn, finding a mentor, commiting to health clearances and titles. Is it as thorough and knowledgable as some people? Who knows, I am ot a breeder. Probably not since you aren't a breeder yet, either. But I see that you are trying.... I read posts every day on Facebook of people who just breed their dog because they and their neighbors like the dog so much.

I hope that the most experienced breeders out there are kind & willing to answer your questions and offer guidance without making you feel terrible when you make rookie mistakes (which it seems to me all rookies at anything are bound to make)

Good luck to you.
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post #23 of 42 (permalink) Old 05-24-2016, 05:27 PM
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Originally Posted by Thecowboysgirl View Post
OP, you seem to have a good attitude, even when people aren't being kind to you. I applaud you for trying to learn, finding a mentor, commiting to health clearances and titles. Is it as thorough and knowledgable as some people? Who knows, I am ot a breeder. Probably not since you aren't a breeder yet, either. But I see that you are trying.... I read posts every day on Facebook of people who just breed their dog because they and their neighbors like the dog so much.

I hope that the most experienced breeders out there are kind & willing to answer your questions and offer guidance without making you feel terrible when you make rookie mistakes (which it seems to me all rookies at anything are bound to make)

Good luck to you.
OP I applaud you for wanting to breed German Shepherds. I hope that you learn what you will need to know to be a professional quality breeder and you will share that information with the rest of us who have shared information with you.

Brutal honesty is not unkind in any way, it is the very best medicine for a common illness!
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post #24 of 42 (permalink) Old 05-24-2016, 05:33 PM
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Originally Posted by Castlemaid View Post
Let's not start with the attacks and petty bickering between members. I've deleted one post so far.

So, Cubano - what has the training you have been doing so far thaught you about drives, and dogs? Because the goal of training and titling dogs is to learn about them and become better dog people along the way - the training isn't for the dogs' benefit, but ours.
I would love to hear the answer to this question! As it is THE question IMO! From that we can assist, without that we are shooting in the dark!
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post #25 of 42 (permalink) Old 05-24-2016, 06:27 PM
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Your mentor is retired and breeding dogs and has been doing this for 50 years or so. Without names, tell us a little about him. What lines does he focus on? What venues does he participate in? Has he gone with you to any shows, trials, seminars, club meetings?

If he has been doing this for 50 years, then he has a lot of contacts. He is not going to be doing this for another 50 years, so now is the time to get out and about with this guy and meet the people he is working with and learn from him some of the politics in your area. There are things a breeder can tell you that books can't, things about the people in your area. They can help you avoid some problem people and help you connect with people that can help you learn.

It sounds like you are farther along on the path to become a dog breeder than many who jump right in. Be careful not to put all your eggs in one basket.

Saying that, I am surprised that you are starting your program with bitches that seem to be from two different lines, GSL and WL, correct me if I am wrong. The reasons this can be problematic is that, for newbies, it is tough enough to study and learn the pedigrees (the dogs, what they produce, etc., who produces well with whom, and who to avoid), with just one line of dogs. And the two groups do not share fanciers, which means, while you can do IPO with both bitches, clubs, breeders, etc -- well two different groups of people. Some of them will totally discount you if you are breeding other lines, and breeding the lines together -- GSD world political suicide. This is important because you want to find the best stud dogs to complement your bitches, and if people peg you as a working line person or as a show line person, they might not want to do business with you.

And they're right in a way, because instead of focusing on one line, and learning what you can about those dogs, you are doing two and that's like a crash course on both. Breeding on a foundation of crash courses is kind of a train wreck. You need two mentors -- one for each line you are planning on breeding with.

First getting yourself established in one line, the venues that that line tends to favor, the people who follow that line, you can always branch out later on, usually for a purpose.

Keep learning. The breed needs people who are willing to learn and work hard.

To best help their customers, breeders need to learn as much as possible on the following:

Genetics and Bloodlines.
Health and diseases common in the breed
Nutrition
Whelping and Raising a litter
Behavior and Training
The GSD community in your area
Dog law and business

As a breeder, your puppy buyers will consult you on these things, and if you cannot help them out, then one of the main benefits of going the breeder route in getting their new companion is gone.

The good news is that there is a LOT of on the job training. Puppy buyers will bring up questions that stump you eleven years later. But, that is no reason not to put the effort in to learning as much as possible.

Good luck.

Heidi Ho, Odie
Joy-Joy, Bear Cub, Hepsi-Pepsi
Cujo2, Karma Chameleon
Ramona the Pest, Kojak -- who loves you baby?
Tiny Tinnie, Susie's Uzzi, Kaiah -- The Baby Monster.
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post #26 of 42 (permalink) Old 05-24-2016, 07:18 PM
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how to be a breeder 101


just like a credentialed course , minimum 5 years prior experience of ownership


this is not a turn-key type of enterprise. I had more than a few wanting to get
a-bunch-of-dogs as a start up . yup- NOPE

go out and participate with your dog in any venue , and don't be ashamed to fail
there is more to be learned through failure - the dog wasn't quite good enough - find
out why --
the dog bumbled along in work - find out why - how did you fix it - did that reveal
deficiencies that you will first of all recognize, then avoid . Were the failures on your
part - not working the dog correctly - how will you change that . You develop a feel
for dogs.
You will have a hard time selling dogs to working people if you can't gain their confidence
in what you know in what you can do.
If your venue is show - same thing get out their and have your dog judged against others of the
same group - whether that be WGSL or ASL .


The reality is that the idea of a GSD is long gone.
The reality is that there are three distinct genetic drifts which haven't shared
a common ancestor for 40 (or more) years.


What is your idea of an ideal GSD . Show us a specimen from any era .


I just added a beautiful American bred GSD in the Good Conformation folder https://www.germanshepherds.com/forum...ml#post7896825


Have a look at it .

Carmen

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post #27 of 42 (permalink) Old 05-24-2016, 07:25 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by carmspack View Post
how to be a breeder 101


just like a credentialed course , minimum 5 years prior experience of ownership


this is not a turn-key type of enterprise. I had more than a few wanting to get
a-bunch-of-dogs as a start up . yup- NOPE

go out and participate with your dog in any venue , and don't be ashamed to fail
there is more to be learned through failure - the dog wasn't quite good enough - find
out why --
the dog bumbled along in work - find out why - how did you fix it - did that reveal
deficiencies that you will first of all recognize, then avoid . Were the failures on your
part - not working the dog correctly - how will you change that . You develop a feel
for dogs.
You will have a hard time selling dogs to working people if you can't gain their confidence
in what you know in what you can do.
If your venue is show - same thing get out their and have your dog judged against others of the
same group - whether that be WGSL or ASL .


The reality is that the idea of a GSD is long gone.
The reality is that there are three distinct genetic drifts which haven't shared
a common ancestor for 40 (or more) years.


What is your idea of an ideal GSD . Show us a specimen from any era .


I just added a beautiful American bred GSD in the Good Conformation folder https://www.germanshepherds.com/forum...ml#post7896825


Have a look at it .
Carmen's right. You can't just read and research, you have to do. You have to become known in a venue by doing with your dog. And yes, we learn more from our failures than when things go like clockwork.

Heidi Ho, Odie
Joy-Joy, Bear Cub, Hepsi-Pepsi
Cujo2, Karma Chameleon
Ramona the Pest, Kojak -- who loves you baby?
Tiny Tinnie, Susie's Uzzi, Kaiah -- The Baby Monster.
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post #28 of 42 (permalink) Old 05-24-2016, 07:37 PM
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Originally Posted by selzer View Post
Carmen's right. You can't just read and research, you have to do. You have to become known in a venue by doing with your dog. And yes, we learn more from our failures than when things go like clockwork.
I love serious dedicated GSD owners. Carmen if I could I would reach out and shake your hand. It hurts me to see what people are doing to the breed, it hurts me deep in my heart! The way the whole thread started was like a knife in my heart twisting and turning which led me to ask the question and make the statements I did. Which I was lhbclbhlb for doing because some were offended. TY Carmen for sharing this with the OP. TY for loving the breed... TY TY TY you also Slezer you get it and I'm so glad to see it.

I was so hoping the response to my question was
1.
2
3
4
5
6
7
But it wasn't and went down hill from there!
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post #29 of 42 (permalink) Old 06-27-2016, 12:22 PM
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Do you people really think that laughing at and ridiculing those who come here for information is the best way to educate future breeders? You do realize that people will go ahead with their plans anyway, even if you try to make them feel 3 inches tall, right? Why not respectfully impart your knowledge and wisdom, or gently lead them to sources of knowledge instead of being snarky and rude?

OP I commend your efforts to learn from a breeder and to health test and title your dogs. I suggest diversifying your experiences and learn from as many different sources and breeders as you can.

Our breed needs educated, serious, and dedicated breeders. They are all too rare among the backyard breeders who put their GSD with their neighbors' because they want to make some cash from the litter.

We need to encourage the next generation of people who want to improve the breed.

Sent from my SM-G900V using Tapatalk
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post #30 of 42 (permalink) Old 06-27-2016, 05:47 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Honeybee1999 View Post
Do you people really think that laughing at and ridiculing those who come here for information is the best way to educate future breeders? You do realize that people will go ahead with their plans anyway, even if you try to make them feel 3 inches tall, right? Why not respectfully impart your knowledge and wisdom, or gently lead them to sources of knowledge instead of being snarky and rude?

OP I commend your efforts to learn from a breeder and to health test and title your dogs. I suggest diversifying your experiences and learn from as many different sources and breeders as you can.

Our breed needs educated, serious, and dedicated breeders. They are all too rare among the backyard breeders who put their GSD with their neighbors' because they want to make some cash from the litter.

We need to encourage the next generation of people who want to improve the breed.

Sent from my SM-G900V using Tapatalk
Melissa, some kindly admistrators and moderators came onto this post weeks ago, and cleaned up some of the typical unhelpful attitudes that are going to happen when this topic comes up.

What is left, what you are commenting on, is about the most polite and informative answers one can hope for, and you are trying to smack us around? We that have posted have experience with what this guy wants, and are spending a lot of time and thought in giving him suggestions.

I can only believe that you are wanting to stir the pot because you have nothing better to do today.

Heidi Ho, Odie
Joy-Joy, Bear Cub, Hepsi-Pepsi
Cujo2, Karma Chameleon
Ramona the Pest, Kojak -- who loves you baby?
Tiny Tinnie, Susie's Uzzi, Kaiah -- The Baby Monster.
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