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post #11 of 64 (permalink) Old 07-11-2008, 04:00 PM
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Re: AKC & a can of worms

Quote:
Originally Posted By: DianaM agile as a ferret on crack
Wow - the mental picture that conjures up made me laugh out loud. I needed that!
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post #12 of 64 (permalink) Old 07-11-2008, 04:45 PM
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Re: AKC & a can of worms

a breeder judge in Amer was telling me of a Can judge who put up a female whose tail curled around to her back. I aksed him if that judge forget he was judging gsd's and thought this was the husky ring...

A lot of judges try out for many breeds, without really having a solid foundation for any particular breed. They don't really know the standard, and they judge by handler, or what teythink is pretty, or what they remember Rin Tin Tin looked like when they were a child.
Most show folks dislike all breed shows, because they feel that most of the judges wouldn't know a pure gsd much less one that conforms to the standard.

For example, people will call anything with pricked ears a gsd mix.

Now it's a shame on the breeders who, instead of avoiding those judges,( lowering entries and forcing the clubs to hire a decent judge) show their junk that they couldn't get passed by anyone else.


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post #13 of 64 (permalink) Old 07-11-2008, 04:49 PM
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Re: AKC & a can of worms

And please don't get me started on temperment. I've handled for some folks, and taken some squirrelly dogs into the ring, sight unseen.

I almost broke my neck, and I wish I had been warned. I couldn't even grab the leash w/o the dog jumping in fright. Forget showing the bite. This was not due to rough handling. Everytime a took a step back or a round her she spooked.

If I was the owner, I'd have that girl spayed.


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post #14 of 64 (permalink) Old 07-11-2008, 06:20 PM Thread Starter
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Re: AKC & a can of worms

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Originally Posted By: chasethedoga breeder judge in Amer was telling me of a Can judge who put up a female whose tail curled around to her back. I aksed him if that judge forget he was judging gsd's and thought this was the husky ring...
You wouldn't believe how bad this problem is in the collie ring here in south Florida. You'd swear you were watching miscolored Akitas (except my collie). There are also a lot of Belgians that have the curled tail, too but not many GSDs.

DOTE Club - competitive training in Broward County:

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post #15 of 64 (permalink) Old 07-12-2008, 12:09 AM
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Re: AKC & a can of worms

The Westminster GSD you're talking about is a bitch. Her name is Geneva, and she is retired now :-) I've met her, and she's quite sound and sweet, shows well, and is very even keel in temperament. I wouldn't doubt that she DID get zapped, as she's not known to shy from a judge.

I personally don't care for any of the PDB dogs posted...too straight in front and no turn of stifle.

http://www.pedigreedatabase.com/gsd/...ee/398433.html - This is a rather nice showline male that I'd love to be holding the lead of

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post #16 of 64 (permalink) Old 07-12-2008, 11:48 PM
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Re: AKC & a can of worms

Im sure all the dogs and all the judges in SV shows are absolutely perfect....

JMC

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post #17 of 64 (permalink) Old 07-13-2008, 12:05 AM
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Re: AKC & a can of worms

Just as bad, sadly. Those sieger show videos were painful. Conformation shows as a whole just don't do any good for many breeds. Yes, there needs to be a physical standard to be met but ability and brains need to come first. Sleeve-feeding gaining ratings of "TSB pronounced.." oh yeah. Of the German showlines, I hate seeing cowhocks and east-west stances. Ridiculously prevalent, too. And the backs/croups/toplines.

Cherri, does the dachshund standard all ALL colors as acceptable? I've seen pieds and merles and tans and speckleds and chocolate-banana-splits and I was wondering if all are accepted. If so, that's pretty neat and good on them for not minding much about color.

Renji - 6 y/o M GSD x chow rescue


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post #18 of 64 (permalink) Old 07-13-2008, 08:34 AM
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Re: AKC & a can of worms

Sigh. I have seen some niiiiice Kirschental dogs here. I tend to like dogs with the heaviest bone-- just my preference, bordering on "coarse."

Balancing out how bad it is when the AKC show judges sway the way the AKC standard is interpreted, is that working dog judges get planefare paid for to come over from Europe, accomodations paid for here-- and end up being VERY generous to the host club's dogs with ratings. Judges are people. There is crookedness in the show world for sure. But I think one can find a show dog with ideal nerves and drive level (exempting the extreme) if one looks. Too bad the looking is not so simple as it once was. But very nice when we find dogs with reliable minds and good structure in the same body.

Many of the Dachsunds here incidentally, probably nobody in USA would want. No only no newfangled colors, but they have still got the original temperament: Assertive, domineering tyrants with wills of iron, hearts of gold, kisses for their fave people, big dog barks, and more actual true aggression and fire than is seen in the most spunky Dachsies in USA. Okay.. not everyone wants one like that. but I can't help admire them. Longer legs and often wirecoats in the wild-boar colors.. nice!

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post #19 of 64 (permalink) Old 07-13-2008, 09:09 AM
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Re: AKC & a can of worms

Yes, there are some out there, like Caisson kennels. Temperment is the easiest thing to lose and the hardest to get back. I guess that's why I don't have any females and don't breed, because I just have't met one yet who had good bone, and solid nerves that I'd want to show/breed with.


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post #20 of 64 (permalink) Old 07-13-2008, 12:08 PM
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Re: AKC & a can of worms

I don't disagree that there are temperament problems which either go unnoticed by judges (not much of a judge in my opinion who can't see it) or is just overlooked in the AKC or CKC rings. There are many good and sound dogs out there though, unfortunately it's the bad ones who are remembered and cause for all the hoopla.

But I have seen some atrocious judging in SV style shows, at least in my area, by judges brought in from Germany. A number of us used to enter a dog or two to support the local club and just have a day out with GSD's, no matter the bloodlines. One year my dog who is now 12 was entered in one of the young male classes, can't remember which but under 2 years. He was placed behind the dog who won the class. The dog who won did not have his mouth examined as he attempted to escape the judge, kept his tail glued to his belly - he may have had testicles under there, who knew? And he backed behind the handler on the gun test. Class winner.

Funny thing is, his owner entered him hoping for just this type of display as she had been attempting to return this dog to the breeder because he was unsound, and the breeder had refused to acknowledge the problems. His owner figured if she put him out there for others to see she'd at least have witnesses to his fear and lack of nerve. She ended up with a class win, go figure.

And yes, my Canadian bred dog and the others in the class were gun sure, steady on their exams and clean and balanced in their movement, by no means were any of them more extreme than German bred dogs in the class (many people have asked over the years if my dog had German lines). Overall, a pretty souring experience when obvious spooks are given the wins in the SV style ring.
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