puppy obedience for IPO - German Shepherd Dog Forums
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post #1 of 34 (permalink) Old 05-31-2018, 11:18 AM Thread Starter
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puppy obedience for IPO

So Luna is 3 months on the first, she has sit down to around 80% down is still working and recall is well at a goose egg now before she would come now she looks at me and will ignore me. she walks on a leash fine she is starting to pull a little so i want to start teaching heel. My question i have been told do not make lesson long around 2 to 3 mins long is what i do them at right now, but how man do i do, also can i switch up the training one lesson is downing 2 mins switch to sitting, then switch to following? i am struggling i feel like i am lost in a HUGE sea. also i was told to minimize her play time with my other dog because she will start putting that before me, which yes i have seen.
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post #2 of 34 (permalink) Old 05-31-2018, 11:43 AM
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I'm not sure if you have a specific question, or just looking for advice in general? At three months old, you want to build focus and make everything into a game, and not really think of formal obedience and formal training sessions.

Reward all eye contact. Reward each time your pup comes to your side in the basic position on her own, without being asked. Always have treats on your to reward the correct behaviours - catch them as they occur, and praise and reward. Your pup will think she is the smartest, bestest, most amazing pup ever!

Think more in terms of engagement training more so than formal recall. When you recall her, make it part of play - at three months, every recall should result in a furious game of tug with you. Manage her and set her up to succeed. Make it so that all her choices are the right choices, then she won't even think of not doing what you asked of her. If she is not coming to you when you call her, you are being way too boring, so make yourself more interesting. Run the other way and have her chase you!

Are you with a club?

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post #3 of 34 (permalink) Old 05-31-2018, 12:39 PM Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Castlemaid View Post
I'm not sure if you have a specific question, or just looking for advice in general? At three months old, you want to build focus and make everything into a game, and not really think of formal obedience and formal training sessions.

Reward all eye contact. Reward each time your pup comes to your side in the basic position on her own, without being asked. Always have treats on your to reward the correct behaviours - catch them as they occur, and praise and reward. Your pup will think she is the smartest, bestest, most amazing pup ever!

Think more in terms of engagement training more so than formal recall. When you recall her, make it part of play - at three months, every recall should result in a furious game of tug with you. Manage her and set her up to succeed. Make it so that all her choices are the right choices, then she won't even think of not doing what you asked of her. If she is not coming to you when you call her, you are being way too boring, so make yourself more interesting. Run the other way and have her chase you!

Are you with a club?
No you answered my main question as well as some other indirectly. Technically no i am not part of a club but i did meet a guy who is part of one and he said when Luna gets older he never did say a exact age to start bringing her around, on the 9th of June she will have her rabies shot and be allowed to join, but he said to wait til she is more mature to actually bring her not sure what that is. My other main question is should i limit her playing with my other dog? he guy did a informal evaluation on her and he said her food drive wasnt massive (mind you she has been in the car with me all day and she never been to this guys house and one of his dog got loose and went to say hi to her and she acted like the dog was attacking her he wasnt but she lost her stuff over it) after she calm down he did a very basic evaluation on her he did like her drive with the flirt ball but said her food drive wasnt as high as he hoped. for me if i have a treat she will follow me around til the end of time. i guess i am looking for what i should be doing with a 3 month old and what she should know as a 3 month old.
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post #4 of 34 (permalink) Old 05-31-2018, 12:44 PM
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When I start recall with puppies I do it from just a few feet away and call as I am running backwards. When they get to me they get party style praise. I never, ever call a puppy to take it inside, crate, etc. It is always fun. The only downside to teaching this way that I have seen is that most of my dogs use me to stop on the recall. Lol. When I was training Sabi I had bruises on my stomach from her front feet, but she came like a bullet and dropped to a sit directly in front of me every time.
I also use two different commands, Here-which is a formal recall, and Come-which means follow me/come near me. Both are different then Close-which means keep doing what you are doing but do it within a few feet of me.
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post #5 of 34 (permalink) Old 05-31-2018, 12:55 PM
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A mistake a lot of people do is put too much obedience on a young dog, hoping to impress the club members - Obedience can come later. What makes for an impressive dog is self-confidence, engagement, focus, and rag and food drive. That is what you should be working on.

Pup does perfect at home but falls apart at another place is a concern. Work on building her confidence up, and taking her out and about and playing, playing, playing with her in all sorts of new environments. Forget formal obedience, build her up so that everything is a major adventure, and she is the best, bravest, most capable adventuring pup ever! Nothing, NOTHING is as rewarding as playing with you! You want her to have eyes only for you, play only with you, look to you for all her needs. You want her strutting around like she owns the world, and she can't do wrong, and she knows it!

About your other dog, YES! She is already not into you all that much (but you can change that), so do separate and limit her time with your other dog. What I did with Gryffon and previous pup I had is for the first year, I kept the new pup separated from my older dog all the time - take one dog with me to work, leave the other one home. Keep them separated through crates, baby-gates, x-pens in and about the house. I allowed one or two supervised play sessions together with my older dog a day. I did take them for daily leash walks together, and I did not count that as play time, more like "mind your manners even with you buddy there time". No rough-housing in the house, period! Lots and lots one-on-one engagement time.

A lot of people will say that they never went to those extremes, and their IPO dog turned out just fine, and it well may be so. But with a puppy that already seems to need more focus and engagement work, I would not risk her becoming "doggy" and if IPO is your goal, I would work out a plan where she has very limited contact with your other dog.
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post #6 of 34 (permalink) Old 05-31-2018, 01:24 PM Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Castlemaid View Post
A mistake a lot of people do is put too much obedience on a young dog, hoping to impress the club members - Obedience can come later. What makes for an impressive dog is self-confidence, engagement, focus, and rag and food drive. That is what you should be working on.

Pup does perfect at home but falls apart at another place is a concern. Work on building her confidence up, and taking her out and about and playing, playing, playing with her in all sorts of new environments. Forget formal obedience, build her up so that everything is a major adventure, and she is the best, bravest, most capable adventuring pup ever! Nothing, NOTHING is as rewarding as playing with you! You want her to have eyes only for you, play only with you, look to you for all her needs. You want her strutting around like she owns the world, and she can't do wrong, and she knows it!

About your other dog, YES! She is already not into you all that much (but you can change that), so do separate and limit her time with your other dog. What I did with Gryffon and previous pup I had is for the first year, I kept the new pup separated from my older dog all the time - take one dog with me to work, leave the other one home. Keep them separated through crates, baby-gates, x-pens in and about the house. I allowed one or two supervised play sessions together with my older dog a day. I did take them for daily leash walks together, and I did not count that as play time, more like "mind your manners even with you buddy there time". No rough-housing in the house, period! Lots and lots one-on-one engagement time.

A lot of people will say that they never went to those extremes, and their IPO dog turned out just fine, and it well may be so. But with a puppy that already seems to need more focus and engagement work, I would not risk her becoming "doggy" and if IPO is your goal, I would work out a plan where she has very limited contact with your other dog.
Ok, sadly i do have to say she isnt in to me as much as my last GSD who was always at my side. My daily routine is wife gets up around 630 am and feeds both of them, lets them play for 15 to 20 mins then re crates them both, i get up around 730am and let Luna out first to go pee then put her away to let the other one out, let them play for 10 mins and take luna to work with me, she is in the crate in the car with me and almost every stop i let her out and we do some basic training in a parking lot with noise around, she does well for the most part with that. i get home around 5 pm and i will crate Luna up while i go to take a shower, come out out our golden out to bathroom and do some play with her, she loves her bird, all while Luna is spazzing out in the crate because she wants to play, sometime i relent and let her out. After Angels play time its training with Luna, sit, down, recall and following. then its crate time for a bit and we let the golden free roam for a bit. After about 1 hr in the crate i let her out to just roam around in the house and play tug with her (she does love that) do sit and down with her, haven't started stay (i do have her make eye contact before letting her out of the crate or to eat.) by this time it is around 8pm. wife will play with her playing fetch or just petting her, we let angel and luna play til around 9pm depending on how they r playing sometime i give them a time out. we go to bed around 10pm to 11pm before we let them out and they r both good all night. we also stop letting Luna have water after 9pm. on my days off she is crated whenever i cant have eyes on her for whatever reason, i do several training session thru out the day with her, again sit, down and follow. i keep the sesion between 2 to 3 mins long. we also go on small walks up and down the street, other tidbits is sometime i will do no training all day and let her be her.
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post #7 of 34 (permalink) Old 05-31-2018, 01:35 PM
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Focus and position...short short short

Focus from basic and focus from front

restrained recalls/puppy recalls

Sit - plaitz - stand - a game like simon says - ddo with treats and a clicker....

in front - plaitz to sit - be toe to toe

basic position - focus

heeling way down the road
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post #8 of 34 (permalink) Old 05-31-2018, 01:44 PM Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by wolfstraum View Post
Focus and position...short short short

Focus from basic and focus from front

restrained recalls/puppy recalls

Sit - plaitz - stand - a game like simon says - ddo with treats and a clicker....

in front - plaitz to sit - be toe to toe

basic position - focus

heeling way down the road
When i have her sit before i give her a treat i say "watch me" and look for eye contact before i give the treat. Restrained recall that needs two people right, when the wife is home we will go to the side walk and call her between the both of us.

I should stop having her sit next to me on the left then?

How do i get her toe to toe with me do i move or have her move?

It is entirely normal for a 3 month old not to be all into you right? i had this issue with our golden but by 4 to 5 months old she was ALL about you in a creepy way, she would give you the thousand yard stare when it was training time she was DAILED in. Having her do eye contact is focusing on me correct?
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post #9 of 34 (permalink) Old 05-31-2018, 01:53 PM
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You can start teaching rhythm and muscle memory for heeling at this age. Right side, don't worry about position. They are just learning to move with a nice consistent rhythm that will hold over once you move them to your left and start formal heeling. You can also work on spins (right spin with right hand, left spin with left hand), correct stand to down (elbows down first or at the minimum going down totally square), backing to prepare for the kick back stand, tuck sits, cookie toss recalls and things like this. Very short sessions.

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post #10 of 34 (permalink) Old 05-31-2018, 02:14 PM Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by Castlemaid View Post
A mistake a lot of people do is put too much obedience on a young dog, hoping to impress the club members - Obedience can come later. What makes for an impressive dog is self-confidence, engagement, focus, and rag and food drive. That is what you should be working on.

Pup does perfect at home but falls apart at another place is a concern. Work on building her confidence up, and taking her out and about and playing, playing, playing with her in all sorts of new environments. Forget formal obedience, build her up so that everything is a major adventure, and she is the best, bravest, most capable adventuring pup ever! Nothing, NOTHING is as rewarding as playing with you! You want her to have eyes only for you, play only with you, look to you for all her needs. You want her strutting around like she owns the world, and she can't do wrong, and she knows it!

About your other dog, YES! She is already not into you all that much (but you can change that), so do separate and limit her time with your other dog. What I did with Gryffon and previous pup I had is for the first year, I kept the new pup separated from my older dog all the time - take one dog with me to work, leave the other one home. Keep them separated through crates, baby-gates, x-pens in and about the house. I allowed one or two supervised play sessions together with my older dog a day. I did take them for daily leash walks together, and I did not count that as play time, more like "mind your manners even with you buddy there time". No rough-housing in the house, period! Lots and lots one-on-one engagement time.

A lot of people will say that they never went to those extremes, and their IPO dog turned out just fine, and it well may be so. But with a puppy that already seems to need more focus and engagement work, I would not risk her becoming "doggy" and if IPO is your goal, I would work out a plan where she has very limited contact with your other dog.
I should have also stated she was going thru her fear phase, so she was jumpy-ish. currently she is over her (issue).
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