Odd question. - German Shepherd Dog Forums
Reply
 
LinkBack Thread Tools
post #1 of 13 (permalink) Old 06-17-2013, 12:27 AM Thread Starter
New Member
 
DuncanIdaho's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2013
Location: Louisiana
Posts: 20
Odd question.

Let me begin by saying that I had a lab a few years ago and we trained her to have a soft mouth with water balloons. She was a hunting dog.

I plan on doing Schutzhund with my GSD puppy. My friend has his litter mate who is getting very nippy. I explained to him the water balloon technique we used on our lab. He asked me why I couldn't do that with duncan- also nippy.

So the question is can you have a Schutzhund dog that has a soft mouth?I'm guessing no but my friend had me thinking about it. Any input?

Casey & Arayna

Duncan Idaho 3-28-2013
DuncanIdaho is offline  
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
post #2 of 13 (permalink) Old 06-17-2013, 08:34 AM
Crowned Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2007
Location: Grand Rapids, MI
Posts: 19,496
Are you asking about the lab or the GSD puppy? I think as far as Schutzhund goes, if the genes are there, they are there and a goo club/helper can tap into that regardless of what other training you are doing in other contexts. I have a mixed breed dog (possibly some lab) that naturally has a *very* soft mouth like a lab, he could carry raw eggs, but you can tap into a different side of him and getting him tugging with a grip like any GSD. However he can't do Schutzhund, there's a lot more to it than just the biting. He's a softer dog that avoids any form of conflict or stress and Schutzhund is all about training a dog to persevere through different types of pressure and conflict.
Liesje is offline  
post #3 of 13 (permalink) Old 06-17-2013, 09:04 AM
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2011
Posts: 203
I would not do it. distract the nippy puppy onto something else. When I raise a puppy I always have a towel with me for them to bite at instead of my legs :-)

Yes a helper will be able to get the dog to bite, but you can damage the dog's intentions to strike with power. Could he overcome this with good training? Maybe, but why risk it. If you intend to do IPO then let him bite.....


Just my 2 cents

Frank
schh3fh2 is offline  
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
post #4 of 13 (permalink) Old 06-17-2013, 09:38 AM
Administrator & LOTR Addict
 
lhczth's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2000
Location: Bloomington, IN, USA
Posts: 18,717
I agree with Frank. Just redirect the puppy to another object.

Lisa Clark

To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.

SG1 Deja IPO3 AWD1 KKL1 B/HOT, SG Elena IPO1 KKL CGC B/HOT, LB (the ugly little sable) IPO2 KKL B/HOT, Jarka (up and coming) BHOT, and gone but not forgotten,
Vala SchH3 AWD1 FH2 CGC B/HOT, Donovan IPO1 TR2 AD, Nike SchH1 OB1 TR3 AD CGC HOT, Treue SchH3 CD CGC HOT



lhczth is offline  
post #5 of 13 (permalink) Old 06-17-2013, 10:07 AM
Administrator & Alpha Bitch of the Wild Bunch
 
Chris Wild's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2001
Location: Michigan, USA
Posts: 13,602
I also agree with Frank. Redirect him to a toy so that he learns that it is ok to use his mouth, but also that there are some boundaries.


To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
Chris Wild is offline  
post #6 of 13 (permalink) Old 06-17-2013, 01:21 PM
Elite Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2013
Posts: 1,553
Quote:
can you have a Schutzhund dog that has a soft mouth?
Take the retrieve of the dumbbell for example. The dogs are not destroying it or chewing it. They carry it in the back of there mouth and I am presuming that is regarded as a soft mouth.

I can get my dog(LabXboxer) to hold my arm with a soft mouth. When he is biting a tug I can spin him around in the air and he won't let go. To me he can do both with no problem.

I would love to hear more about your water balloon training. Is that standard practice for gun dogs??
MadLab is offline  
post #7 of 13 (permalink) Old 06-17-2013, 01:36 PM
Administrator & Alpha Bitch of the Wild Bunch
 
Chris Wild's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2001
Location: Michigan, USA
Posts: 13,602
Quote:
Originally Posted by MadLab View Post
Take the retrieve of the dumbbell for example. The dogs are not destroying it or chewing it. They carry it in the back of there mouth and I am presuming that is regarded as a soft mouth.
This is incorrect. A "soft mouth" dumbbell hold is a sure way to lose points in any venue. The dog must hold the dumbbell firmly. No, they aren't chewing it or destroying it (or else they also lose a lot of points) but they are not holding it lightly either.

Also, it is best held in the front of the mouth, on the premolars right behind the canines, rather than in the back of the mouth. This provides the most secure hold.

Basically there is nothing in SchH/IPO that allows for anything less than a very firm grip when the dog holds anything in his mouth, be it dumbbell or sleeve.


To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
Chris Wild is offline  
post #8 of 13 (permalink) Old 06-17-2013, 09:11 PM Thread Starter
New Member
 
DuncanIdaho's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2013
Location: Louisiana
Posts: 20
I'm not concerned with the nipping. Its not as bad as his sisters. I was more asking for my friend because he asked me. I figured that a "soft mouth" would be bad for a sport based on strength of bite. I was more thinking it'd be good training for the sister since she is just going to be a family pet.

I'm from south Louisiana and I know a lot of people who use water balloons. Basically they use the ball drive to get them to fetch it and the dogs get upset when it bust so they don't mouth it as hard.

Casey & Arayna

Duncan Idaho 3-28-2013
DuncanIdaho is offline  
post #9 of 13 (permalink) Old 06-17-2013, 10:49 PM
Crowned Member
 
Catu's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2007
Location: Valdivia, Chile
Posts: 4,772
Still the water balloons technique is perfect for retrieving because the dog , in both cases, is retrieving a dead object. I don't think it will translate well enough on a puppy mind from balloons to pants because legs are live preys. Puppy will kill the counteracting leg with a dead grip while thinking of retrieving it later with the softer of mouths

If not, you can believe one of our members and premium breeder

Diabla Boroluz, my Daemon; IPO-A1, RH-T A
Akela de Poputchik, my Direwolf; IPO-2, Kkl1
Calais vom Adler Stein; IPO-A1, Kkl1
Catu is offline  
post #10 of 13 (permalink) Old 06-26-2013, 05:46 PM
Crowned Member
 
hunterisgreat's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2011
Location: Charleston, SC
Posts: 3,788
Soft mouth in a lab is a genetic trait. That's why they are poor at bite sports. A good lab is a bad bite dog, and vice versa. A lab can be trained to do everything in IPO but they will always struggle with the grip

Hunter, CWDC UScA Helper
Beschützer des Jägers v.d. Sportwaffen
Katya v. Hügelblick
SG Aska v. Ketscher Wald
Yōkai v.d. Sportwaffen
Arya v. Allrothaus
hunterisgreat is offline  
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
Reply

Quick Reply
Message:
Options

Register Now



In order to be able to post messages on the German Shepherd Dog Forums forums, you must first register.
Please enter your desired user name, your email address and other required details in the form below.

User Name:
Password
Please enter a password for your user account. Note that passwords are case-sensitive.

Password:


Confirm Password:
Email Address
Please enter a valid email address for yourself.

Email Address:
OR

Log-in










Thread Tools
Show Printable Version Show Printable Version
Email this Page Email this Page



Posting Rules  
You may post new threads
You may post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are On

 
For the best viewing experience please update your browser to Google Chrome