Help he bites!! - German Shepherd Dog Forums
 
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post #1 of 10 (permalink) Old 10-20-2009, 01:58 AM Thread Starter
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Help he bites!!

I have a problem. I do not know how to properly correct Kaid, since I want him to compete in schutzhund, and I am afraid to make a mistake be correcting him wrong. I have read that you can mess up a dog that is for schutzhund if you correct improperly. But I have some issues that are starting to get out of hand. He is biting me and those puppy teeth hurt and it is NOT cute be any means!!!! At first he did it in play (i found out that the person that he came from encouraged him to play with his hands) and when he did mouth or nip me I gave him a firm no while his mouth was on me and would then give him his chew followed by praise. Well he is starting to get worse. He has gotten to where if I get down on the ground he will jump up and nip at my face. And my automatic reaction is to pop him, but I do not want to hit him. So I tell him no and go through the same routine that I do when he bites my fingers.

Now when he nips and bites if I tell him no he stops but not for long at all and sometimes immediately starts back( he is also nipping the backs of my legs as I walk.

But the big upset came yesterday. I was outside finally getting some pictures of my cute fuzzy shark and I was trying to get him to stack for me...well when I grabbed is back leg to move it back he turned and put his teeth on me. I said NO and still had his leg when I said no i applied a little pressure(squeezed) where my hand was. Kaid lost it he then bit down hard and was fussing...I open his mouth off of my hand and in a reaction rolled and pinned him. I let him up when he broke eye contact.


I do not know if this was the right thing to do but it was how I reacted. So any advice on how I could better handle these kind of situations in the future with out hurting his confidence? Or damaging my pup mentally?

Kaid der Dieb Meines Herzens CGC
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post #2 of 10 (permalink) Old 10-20-2009, 03:14 AM
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Re: Help he bites!!

My puppy (he's 10 months now) was raised with schutzhund in mind and I never really corrected him for biting, which he did... a lot. Every time he wanted to bite me, I traded him for a toy, which worked... sometimes. If he was really focused on me, I would usually squeek a toy or throw a ball to divert his attention. I never verbally or physically corrected him for biting. Okay, maybe sometimes I gave him a no here and there if it got out of hand, but very rarely and it was only because his teeth were so sharp at that age.

My dog to this day has no good stack photos, he is just too fidgety and he will still mouth me out of play although it is much softer now... Although I could get some of him if I really wanted to.

I would be easy on your guy and let him be a puppy, I wouldn't worry too much about stacking, especially a drivey puppy. It will come in time lol. Try to trade him for toys when he is biting instead of correcting him... good luck, schutzhund puppies are fun xD I still have puppy marks on my arms haha!


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post #3 of 10 (permalink) Old 10-20-2009, 08:28 AM
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Re: Help he bites!!

I can't really comment on the biting since Nikon was never very mouthy, but as for the stacking...that will take time, especially placing the rear. Most puppies that I try to stack for the first time whirl around or fold into a sit the first time I touch their rear, like "WHAT was that?!" I am no expert on placing the perfect stack, but Nikon is *easy* to stack because he understands what it is. He holds still and does not get upset over someone touching his rear. It's like everything else though, it will take time to get the puppy socialized to that. It's easiest to get a good puppy stack when someone else is stacking and you are standing in front of your puppy, holding his attention (so he holds still, stands straight, and focuses on you rather than what you are doing to his hind end). If you don't plan to show the puppy, I wouldn't worry about it too much. You don't want stacking to be a negative experience at first or the dog will not look right/good in your photos b/c the ears will go down, shoulders hunched, tail tucked, etc.
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post #4 of 10 (permalink) Old 10-20-2009, 08:41 AM
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Re: Help he bites!!

How old is Kaid? My shark is 5 months old and the biting is getting less. I don't imagine I could get a picture of him stacked either. I wouldn't even try.

Sometimes restraint and "no' do influence him long enough for me to get him going in a different direction. Mine loves to bite and tug and if you get "down in the weeds" with him, so to speak, he will be loving the rip your clothes opportunity.

I work on positively shaped behaviors. He is learning stand with marker training. He sometimes walks into a stack and that is marked and rewarded. They will grow up, keep working with hands on him without a big goal in mind.

When I have had to work with show dogs I placed them on a table. They are often not quite as sure up there and may accept the stacking. I am not sure my guy would be impressed. He is better for grooming on the table, but most of that he had to learn to allow handling. You might try a table if you want, but if you make the activity onerous he will learn to resent it.

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post #5 of 10 (permalink) Old 10-20-2009, 08:59 AM Thread Starter
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Re: Help he bites!!

Kaid is 15 weeks... and I have stacked him up on my grooming table armed with treats. And I relise that a good stack will come with time, that is not my worry.

To be more clear...I am trying a new training method (new to me)with Kaid. In the dogs that I have owned and trained prior to Kaid I was a very "physical" trainer where I would roll my dog for agressive behavior, and lead pops for failure to comply...I did alot of research on training since I was getting a GSD for a purpose(schutzhund) and relize that I was and have not been a great leader to my past dogs (pit and boxer) I was still in high school when I got the first of the two and no they are not really "damaged" because of my methods but I do think that my relationships would have been better had I done things differently. So now armed with a clicker I am using lots of positive reenforcement and trying to modivate and build confidence in my little guy.

I need help on how to better understand my puppy/dog so that I can be a leader that he WANTS to follow and is not forced to, as with my other to.

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post #6 of 10 (permalink) Old 10-20-2009, 11:23 AM
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Re: Help he bites!!

He will work for you because it works for him. You have all the good things he wants out of life- His food, his toys, and affection. Not necessarily in that order. It depends on what your dog wants.

You are fun and exciting and he can get none of those things from anywhere else, and this is how you can create a handler focused dog. He's young, but many people use NILIF. And it doesn't have to do with any physical force. My dog wants something? He can have it when he does what I ask, but I will show him what I want so he's not confused.

With my Schutzhund dogs, I choose to not physically correct until they are older (around 7-8 months) unless it is dangerous behavior. I will non-reward, ignore, time out, and use loud noises to deter unwanted behavior in puppies. I use the crate if I need a break from teeth and mayhem. I also trade for toys.

With the jumping in your face...you leave. You SQUEAL, and leave. Playing is done. He has hurt you, and you don't want to play anymore. I like to Pout, and put my back to my puppy and refuse to engage him. Put him away, and try again later. It also sounds like excess energy. So before you play with him, wear him out a little. It might bring the obnoxious behavior to a more managable level.

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post #7 of 10 (permalink) Old 10-20-2009, 11:49 PM
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Re: Help he bites!!

Quote:
Originally Posted By: KaidsmomKaid is 15 weeks... and I have stacked him up on my grooming table armed with treats. And I relise that a good stack will come with time, that is not my worry.

To be more clear...I am trying a new training method (new to me)with Kaid. In the dogs that I have owned and trained prior to Kaid I was a very "physical" trainer where I would roll my dog for agressive behavior, and lead pops for failure to comply...I did alot of research on training since I was getting a GSD for a purpose(schutzhund) and relize that I was and have not been a great leader to my past dogs (pit and boxer) I was still in high school when I got the first of the two and no they are not really "damaged" because of my methods but I do think that my relationships would have been better had I done things differently. So now armed with a clicker I am using lots of positive reenforcement and trying to modivate and build confidence in my little guy.

I need help on how to better understand my puppy/dog so that I can be a leader that he WANTS to follow and is not forced to, as with my other to.
If the pup understands no and still bites a lite reprimand is in order your pack leader I to train positive reinforcement and I also redirect. The pup should understand boundaries and leadership and who is in charge.
Your pup is young teach and use commonsense visit the Schutzhund club they should be able to help/show you stuff to raise your pup in a Schutzhund way.

Re

Scheiber's Tarkeus Bad Joke Rott Schutzhund III RIP.
Echo Vom Camdenerland GSD Schutzhund II RIP.
Jett Vom Triton GSD Next Big Thing Schutzhund III

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post #8 of 10 (permalink) Old 10-22-2009, 07:49 PM
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Re: Help he bites!!

Get Michael Ellis' DVDs from Leerburg. He has some of the best explanation and demonstration of marker training! I love the information and though I knew the basics, watching the videos really cleaned up my act. The dogs took off in their learning curve.

Carla and The Pack
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post #9 of 10 (permalink) Old 10-22-2009, 08:24 PM
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Re: Help he bites!!

The DVD is The Power of Training Dogs with Food. Awesome. The dogs here think training is the best thing ever. The sit and bark at the door to the training room to get a chance for a quick, fun session. They are all quick, fun sessions also. I do use compulsion some but it is so subtle the dogs never feel they have been "corrected", only sense they have been given clear information.

The second DVD is How to PLay Tug with Your Dog....awaiting its arrival. I hope the competitive heeling is released soon also.

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post #10 of 10 (permalink) Old 10-26-2009, 09:37 PM
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Re: Help he bites!!

15 weeks?? ahh..he's just in his prime for this behavior..if you want to be serious about schH then i wouldnt try to correct the behavior, just redirect with a toy. heck, start takeing him to the club you are planning on joining and get him started, its never too early or too late. this is, if you are serious.

my PSA club trainer is expecting a litter of pups out of one of his breedings and as soon as those pups are weened, they will be started. imprinting and evaluations will be done when they come out of the woumb...im expecting them to come out of the woumb biteing..

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