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post #1 of 13 (permalink) Old 10-02-2009, 12:47 PM Thread Starter
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Pregnancy xrays question

I know we can have Kaynya xrayed after 45 days to see how many pups are in there but what I can't seem to find (or remember) is if there is a reason NOT to wait until later.

I was thinking of doing it the end of Week 8 - around 60 days. The vet I use allows me to hold her for the xray so it won't be stressful.
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post #2 of 13 (permalink) Old 10-02-2009, 12:59 PM
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Re: Pregnancy xrays question

I do mine at 55 days, my girl always seems to whelp at 60 days...

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post #3 of 13 (permalink) Old 10-02-2009, 01:36 PM
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Re: Pregnancy xrays question

Lauri I do ours a week before the bitch is due to whelp. I feel that waiting will give their bones a chance to calcify and you would be able to see them better.
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post #4 of 13 (permalink) Old 10-02-2009, 01:52 PM
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Re: Pregnancy xrays question

May I throw out a question to the breeders about this? In your experience, how accurate is it for counting puppies?

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post #5 of 13 (permalink) Old 10-02-2009, 01:59 PM
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Re: Pregnancy xrays question

Pretty darn accurate, although if they are a lot of pups a couple can be missed if they are hiding...

I wanted to clarify my above post... I x-ray at 55 days from the first breeding...

Totally OT, I just found out that a pup from my '06 litter, that I bred for the owner, is pregnant. Ultrasound showed 10!! YIKES! She was bred twice and her 1st breeding was done at 7.9 progesterone...

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post #6 of 13 (permalink) Old 10-02-2009, 02:29 PM
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Re: Pregnancy xrays question

yep, pretty accurate. large litters might be off as some might be hidden, but my vets only been off my 1 and only 1 time, lol.

i xray whichever saturday is before their due date. sometimes it's a week, sometimes it's 2 days. my vet is almost 2 hrs away so saturday's work for me, lol

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post #7 of 13 (permalink) Old 10-02-2009, 02:47 PM
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Re: Pregnancy xrays question

For my own female I used Whelpwise and didn't x-ray (not convinced that exposure is good for the pups). I monitored fetal heartbeats so I was able to not only count, but know pups were ok during labor.
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post #8 of 13 (permalink) Old 10-02-2009, 02:59 PM
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Re: Pregnancy xrays question

I agree, I think the longer you wait to do the x-ray the better, i did mine @ 54days and it showed 0 pups, Next time I will wait and not do it any earlier than the 56th day. I think a week before is a good idea.
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post #9 of 13 (permalink) Old 10-03-2009, 12:12 AM
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Re: Pregnancy xrays question

Counting hasn't been that accurate for me. Arwen's first litter they said six maybe eight, there were ten. Arwen's second litter they said eight maybe ten, there were fourteen. Babs' litter they said six, at seven I thought we were done, but there was eight and I lost it.

Jenna's litter I took a picture and posted it. Vet said nine, maybe more. There were ten. So that was pretty close.

The x-ray tells me she is pregnant and an idea of how many pups. I am not sure until after its all over with and then some. in her first litter, Arwen had six puppies all in a row between 1 am and 5 am, and then had a tiny one that did not make it about 7am. Ok, we're done then. Nope two hours later an eigth pup, so we're done. Nope two hours later a ninth pup. So the ninth pup was born at 11AM. At six PM the vet came over, checked the pups and palpated Arwen and did not find anything puppyish, but wasn't saying not either. At nine PM I finally decided to crash on the couch in plain view of the whelping box. At one AM I got up to check them, counted and there was another one. I checked the full sized wettish pup and it was a girl, my second girl! That is why Babsy is Babs Sweet Surprise.

The most important thing is if your bitch is running a fever the next day or so, go in and get her x-rayed to ensure that she did not retain a puppy as that could kill her.

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post #10 of 13 (permalink) Old 10-03-2009, 09:50 AM
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Re: Pregnancy xrays question

Quote:
Originally Posted By: GS MomFor my own female I used Whelpwise and didn't x-ray (not convinced that exposure is good for the pups). I monitored fetal heartbeats so I was able to not only count, but know pups were ok during labor.
If I were to breed that's probably the route I'd take. Nice to know about that service!
The thing is while the dose is small and so is the risk, you are delivering it to the whole body of a very rapidly growing (and therefore more radiosensitive) animal. So I'm glad the original question was asked because if you're going to do it, you might as well do it when you can get the best information.
I wonder how much training vets get in radiobiology?

The problem in assessing whether this is harmful or not is the long term data that would need to be collected to determine late effects. It seems pretty clear that there are no immediate effects at such doses but really you don't even know that. Do the pup's blood counts drop for a day or two after exposure? Who knows? But in order to determine the effects on the health of dogs exposed to ionizing radiation in utero you'd have to follow them out their whole lives and see if there are increases in cancers, cataracts, or other long term effects of exposure against an unradiated population. Anybody know if such a study has been done?
That's the problem with ionizing radiation exposure- effects can be many years out and making the connection can be difficult.
We operate under a principle called ALARA- it stands for As Low As Reasonably Achievable. If there is an alternate method for counting pups that is as accurate or better, under ALARA I would not irradiate a litter, no matter how small the dose.
JMHO

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