Hard Surface Tracking - Page 3 - German Shepherd Dog Forums
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post #21 of 82 (permalink) Old 10-21-2019, 09:01 PM
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I have done something similar, but used RO (or distilled) water and soaked my just worn socks in it. Scent in a bottle. Need to do this more. You inspire me. I have a small pressure sprayer, but need to wait until we don't have 50+mph wind gusts. Loved by a Dutch

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post #22 of 82 (permalink) Old 10-21-2019, 10:33 PM
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I've never had difficulty on VST or hard surfaces.. My dogs have just naturally continued to trail.. Even the pup at 12wks was working hard surfaces.. I am not sure if it is us as humans that have the issue more then the dog
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post #23 of 82 (permalink) Old 10-22-2019, 09:44 AM
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Hmmm...where would one go to learn hard surface tracking? I had to pull my guy from IGP due to grass allergies but he loves to track. This is something he could do!




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post #24 of 82 (permalink) Old 10-22-2019, 11:41 AM
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If you know how to teach a dog to track on grass you can teach them to track on hard surfaces... I really think it is the unban that has the issue, lol.

Hydrating the area first is the new fad, and has some science behind it as odor is hydrophilic and gives moisture to dogs nose. Using bare or socked feet can deposit a bit more odor... But if your dog already knows how to follow odor, and they are loyal to it, they will follow it over any surface... As to IGP, the slow FST track will require a bit more finesse, but the theory is the same
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post #25 of 82 (permalink) Old 10-22-2019, 11:33 PM Thread Starter
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I trail, the distinction being not a FST, however, I've never had difficulty with dogs on VST or hard surfaces.. They have just naturally followed the odor wherever it was laid... Even my newest who is now 14mos old, worked hard surfaces as young as 12wks old...
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I've never had difficulty on VST or hard surfaces.. My dogs have just naturally continued to trail.. Even the pup at 12wks was working hard surfaces.. I am not sure if it is us as humans that have the issue more then the dog
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If you know how to teach a dog to track on grass you can teach them to track on hard surfaces... I really think it is the unban that has the issue, lol.

Hydrating the area first is the new fad, and has some science behind it as odor is hydrophilic and gives moisture to dogs nose. Using bare or socked feet can deposit a bit more odor... But if your dog already knows how to follow odor, and they are loyal to it, they will follow it over any surface... As to IGP, the slow FST track will require a bit more finesse, but the theory is the same

Yeah, trailing is different. Generally they are gathering scent from everything, not just ground scent. When Kimber is doing building searches or open field searches, she is more trailing. It's awesome to watch. She hits the edges of the scent cone and it looks like she ran into a wall.

The reason a lot of police dog trainers are going to tracking over trailing is because the speed. Trailing is generally faster. Tracking is slower and more methodical. Since they are generally tracking to danger, they don't want to rush into a bad situation or a bad bite.

There are a lot of similarities, to grass tracking, but some differences. The water is a newer fad. Not super new, but... The reason it works is the surface tension of the water. It suspends the skin graphs and such to the surface making it easier for the dog to pick up. Also and in my opinion equally important is that it lets the handler know where the track is. Otherwise how do you know if your dog is on it, or if it's just smelling the roses? The water and food are only for the beginning stages. It gets faded out.

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post #26 of 82 (permalink) Old 10-22-2019, 11:46 PM Thread Starter
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Hmmm...where would one go to learn hard surface tracking? I had to pull my guy from IGP due to grass allergies but he loves to track. This is something he could do!
Seminars are happening all over. There are also some good books on it. If you're on Instagram, then look at @TK9fire. They basically walk through then steps of this puppy learning it.

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post #27 of 82 (permalink) Old 10-23-2019, 10:02 AM
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The reason a lot of police dog trainers are going to tracking over trailing is because the speed. Trailing is generally faster. Tracking is slower and more methodical. Since they are generally tracking to danger, they don't want to rush into a bad situation or a bad bite.
Before I heard this on the Controlled Aggression podcast, "tracking to danger" I hadn't ever crossed my mind. There has to be a balance between finding your target before they escape and not rushing headlong into a bad situation. Can't be easy to find that sweet spot.

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post #28 of 82 (permalink) Old 10-23-2019, 08:14 PM
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Agreed on the slower aspect of tracking vs Trailing... As well as why water is used for suspension of odor. My point was just that if a dog follows odor, hard surfaces are not really a problem.. There are intricacies that occur due to odor skating across the surface at times, as well as the bldgs and obstacles creating eddies and odor distortion, but if a dog is loyal to odor, they will follow it to its conclusion. Regardless of surface
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post #29 of 82 (permalink) Old 10-23-2019, 08:30 PM
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I thought the track must be laid down by someone the dog doesn’t know so they don’t follow their owner’s scent to the start of the trail the owner has set down. If a stranger lays down a scent or walks a track, the dog doesn’t automatically go to it by recognition.
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post #30 of 82 (permalink) Old 10-23-2019, 09:47 PM
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Yep! If the handlerays the dogs track, then basically the dog should turn around and look at them expecting their reward... As a SAR K9 handler I never Kay my dogs tracks.. Ever.. I know some people who have, and honestly, they consistently have trouble with their dog on odor.

I've even gotten into trouble telling my dog to ignore the hot track (I have 3 Trailing dogs, so sometimes an end of one trail is the beginning of the next trail for the next dog. Having someone get back to the next end spot if they don't have a car means they walk, basically laying a fresher trail, albeit not directly next to the aged trail about to be run, but still near the start of the track) and run the aged I track I want run... Not a good practice as I want my dog to always find their target odors freshest track.. So I run a lot of aged to hot tracks to help correct my mistakes..
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