No Drive?! - Page 3 - German Shepherd Dog Forums
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post #21 of 54 (permalink) Old 06-24-2008, 08:44 AM
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Re: No Drive?!

If there is any issue with drive at all, I would NOT feed the dog. If he eats his meal while training, great. He works for his food. Hunger can help increase a dogs prey drive to his genetic limit. Yes, I know the ball or tug is not a real rabbit, but drive is a primal thing and a hungry canine chases prey harder in the wild.

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post #22 of 54 (permalink) Old 06-24-2008, 08:55 AM
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Re: No Drive?!

Just because a dog lacks prey drive (which may or many not truly be the case since it's obvious from the advice of Craig's trainer that the work done with the dog thus far has not been conducive to brining out drive), doesn't mean he lacks food drive.

Just as some dogs need to be really hungry to work well for food, other dogs need to NOT be hungry, or only somewhat hungry, or they get too high in drive, hectic and snappy for the food and they can't work well. It depends on the individual dog, which is why I suggested to experiment with different types of training treats, and experiment with feeding him before, not feeding him before, feeding him a small amount before, etc.. to figure out what works best for that individual dog.


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post #23 of 54 (permalink) Old 06-24-2008, 09:02 AM
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Re: No Drive?!

Quote:
Originally Posted By: ZeusGSDHunger can help increase a dogs prey drive to his genetic limit.
I was only referring to prey drive, not food drive. From what he just described, the dog has good food drive.

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post #24 of 54 (permalink) Old 06-24-2008, 01:50 PM Thread Starter
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Re: No Drive?!

He definitly trains best when he's hungry. I bought the rubber ball and attached a rope on to it and he seems to enjoy it although he always bites the rope and not the ball. I think food will be my best bet because when I had the ball out as well as food he was so much more interested in the food than the ball.

I went down to the gsd club tonight and was astounded at how much drive and motivation those young dogs(1.2 years I think) have! They go absolutely crazy to get the ball and if I didn't know any better would think they were being viscious to its handler. The one is quite out of control and occasionaly bites her handler but that's just because the handler doesn't have the ability to smack it when it does bite.
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post #25 of 54 (permalink) Old 06-24-2008, 01:54 PM
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Re: No Drive?!

He will learn to target better. His desire for the ball will increase as well with time as long as you make proper movement and motivation.

John
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post #26 of 54 (permalink) Old 06-24-2008, 02:12 PM
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Re: No Drive?!

Quote:
Originally Posted By: Craig88 They go absolutely crazy to get the ball and if I didn't know any better would think they were being viscious to its handler. The one is quite out of control and occasionaly bites her handler but that's just because the handler doesn't have the ability to smack it when it does bite.
This is what a dog working in drive should look like. The occasional bite to the handler does happen, though most often because the handler is slow, dog isn't being careful or hasn't learned proper targeting, or both.

No reason to smack the dog for it though.


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post #27 of 54 (permalink) Old 06-24-2008, 02:27 PM
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Re: No Drive?!

Look for other things your dog might be interested in. For example, my GSD has no time for tug. Actually failed SCH training because he would just walk away and lay down.

Focus on what your dog likes, swimming, running, chasing, whatever works.
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post #28 of 54 (permalink) Old 06-24-2008, 02:39 PM Thread Starter
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Re: No Drive?!

[quote]Originally Posted By: Chris Wild
Quote:
Originally Posted by Craig88
No reason to smack the dog for it though.
They seem to think it is and I think the likes of Robbie de Jong have told her the dog needs a smack because it thinks it is the boss in certain circumstances. It bit her quite hard tonight after she outed its toy and everyone says it will become a real problem as the dog gets older if she doesn't put her foot down now.
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post #29 of 54 (permalink) Old 06-24-2008, 02:51 PM
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Re: No Drive?!

[quote]Originally Posted By: Craig88
Quote:
Originally Posted By: Chris Wild
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Originally Posted by Craig88
No reason to smack the dog for it though.
They seem to think it is and I think the likes of Robbie de Jong have told her the dog needs a smack because it thinks it is the boss in certain circumstances. It bit her quite hard tonight after she outed its toy and everyone says it will become a real problem as the dog gets older if she doesn't put her foot down now.
Time and time again I've seen the outcome of this sort of attitude, and very often it only escalates the behavior and leads to true handler aggression because the dog has come to expect a physical confrontation from the handler, and that's exactly what happens. Self fulfilling prophecy.

Training is supposed to be a partnership between dog and handler, not a confrontation or a master/slave relationship. Most often when that relationship gets off kilter, it's not the dog, it's the handler. Dogs only learn what we teach them, and too often handlers teach their dogs to show this sort of behavior, and then inadvertently reinforce and encourage the behavior by their reactions to it.


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post #30 of 54 (permalink) Old 06-24-2008, 03:08 PM
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Re: No Drive?!

Quote:
Originally Posted By: Chris WildTraining is supposed to be a partnership between dog and handler, not a confrontation or a master/slave relationship.


Mind if I borrow this?
I have an acquaintance that I'm having a "discussion" regarding the whole alpha roll 'thing' and perhaps what you just said might make her understand what I'm trying to say.

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