Recall around wildlife - Page 2 - German Shepherd Dog Forums
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post #11 of 27 (permalink) Old 10-30-2018, 11:47 AM Thread Starter
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This is all awesome feedback, you guys definitely have me thinking.

I'm definitely interested in learning more about using the E collar, but like thecowboysgirl brought up, I'm very nervous about accidentally creating a negative association with the wrong thing. After he got attacked, he would panic if he saw even an on leash dog far away in the distance, he wouldn't allow strangers to pet him, and no matter where he went, he'd be shaking violently. It took so, so much to make him feel safer in the world and be able to interact with dogs and people without issue, and I'm very protective of keeping it that way!

I would definitely want assistance from an experienced trainer, I'm glad to hear it can be done. But that leads to another question... if I went that route, how would I go about training him with the meaning of the E collar in the first place, when his recall is solid everywhere else? He's regularly around horses, cows, goats, chickens, deer, etc. He knows to never chase any of them. The only critter he chases is a squirrel, and he'll still call off those every time. He's also recalled perfectly every other time we've seen a coyote, where it was slightly further away and neither approaching us or running for its life, so I'm not sure a decoy would make a difference, but I like the idea! I wish I could recreate the exact scenario more easily... close encounter, things get tense, animal flees. My curiosity is peaked by the idea of practicing him waiting for instruction while I actively engage with something the same way I did with the coyote, like heartandsoul mentioned. I wouldn't want to bring that energy to any place he's already nervous, but maybe in a very controlled environment? I work in law enforcement, I could definitely pick the brains of some of our more experienced k9 handlers or their trainer about that, since it's a huge part of their training. Would an E collar trainer simply have a session where they explain to me how to use it properly for him, or I would be paying someone to accompany me on hikes until we happen to come across a coyote to chase? Sorry for so many questions, this aspect of training is new to me and I'm very interested in whether or not it could work for him!

As far as what motivates him... I would LOVE any suggestions for an irresistible treat option. The only treat he'll eat is freeze dried beef heart, and even then he's bored about it. He loves his toys, but he's indifferent to tug and fetch. All he wants to do is play his version of "tag". I did use that form of play when teaching him recall and "leave it" initially, but the instant we go on a hike he couldn't care less about any of his toys. All he cares about is squirrels, playing with my other dog, and stressing me out by climbing trees like a leopard. I was toying with the idea of feeding him raw and ordered him some raw beef liver to see if he was at all interested before investing in switching him over... he gave it a couple nibbles and then just left it to rot. I've never heard of the food chase, I'll look that up now!

I can't tell you all enough how much I appreciate the help and the brainstorming! I was feeling so discouraged and this is giving me a lot more hope that there are options that don't take away our off leash freedom!
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post #12 of 27 (permalink) Old 10-30-2018, 12:24 PM
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The trainer will show you how and make sure the dog knows the ecollar corrections are coming from you and that starts on leash with commands when correction needed and with even slight distractions. The trainer will go on a hike if that’s what you want but it all starts on a leash. That is as what i wanted to make sure my timing was right and the he knew the correction was coming from me- that’s the entire foundation which transfers right over to off leash. My dogs love hot dogs they can be greasy I find Hebrew nationals are the least greasiest or mozzarella sticks cut up. What ever game they like is the reward they will get. Max is fetch with ball -Luna will prefer treats or a tug game.


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Last edited by Jenny720; 10-30-2018 at 12:27 PM.
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post #13 of 27 (permalink) Old 10-30-2018, 12:54 PM
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OP, IF he enjoyed the chase, no treat can beat it. At least that is in my dogs' case. Your dog maybe completely normal as long long as you stay calm but that is tough after that experience. You could try taking him out on a long line (for you as well) and see how he does. Maybe leave the other dog home and test that guy by himself as well. Pack dynamics can change everything though. And they will never forget this one experience.

Last edited by wolfy dog; 10-30-2018 at 12:57 PM.
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post #14 of 27 (permalink) Old 10-30-2018, 02:04 PM
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I have the Dogtra and it works great; has many levels of stimulation and a long range. The Ecollar gave them the freedom to be off leash. Whenever they smell a deer or see deer or any critter, they come back to me without me having to recall. I am not sure if they are 'collar-smart' so I don't want to test them on wild life without the Ecollars.
I am considering buying an e collar, do you mind share how many hours does your dogstra last with normal use after one full charge? I can't seem to find this info on their website. Which series is yours? Thanks so much!
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post #15 of 27 (permalink) Old 10-30-2018, 02:22 PM
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I am considering buying an e collar, do you mind share how many hours does your dogstra last with normal use after one full charge? I can't seem to find this info on their website. Which series is yours? Thanks so much!
No clue how long a charge lasts. At least 4 hours. But you don't want to have them wear it that long as it can cause pressure sores. Mine have the longer prongs to reach the skin. Series 300 (discontinued) and the 200.
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post #16 of 27 (permalink) Old 10-30-2018, 04:46 PM
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I use Dogtra 1900 on my shepherds, and my boy does have the longer contact points. His are the 1/2 inch I think. I don't charge mine often. I use them on walks and turn off when done and I wouldn't even say I charge weekly. If you forget to turn it off and let it sit overnight it's a big drain.

OP, I was in the exact same boat as you with my one dog who also had a perfect recall 99.99% of the time.

I had to teach him about the stim even though he hadn't disobeyed a recall because he wouldn't, the only exception being deer. And like you with the coyotes we just don't encounter them regularly and sometimes they are active, sometimes not. sometimes I swear they hide out on my land when the surrounding land is being hunted and no one hunts here.

Anyway I did him a little different than I have done most others because of how good his recall was to begin with. PM me if you want me to try and explain it to you.

Hopefully you could find a trainer that has fixed wildlife chasing with an e collar.
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post #17 of 27 (permalink) Old 10-30-2018, 04:49 PM
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Originally Posted by wolfy dog View Post
OP, IF he enjoyed the chase, no treat can beat it. At least that is in my dogs' case. Your dog maybe completely normal as long long as you stay calm but that is tough after that experience. You could try taking him out on a long line (for you as well) and see how he does. Maybe leave the other dog home and test that guy by himself as well. Pack dynamics can change everything though. And they will never forget this one experience.
The dog DID call off though. OP did not lose sight of the dog, correct? He just didn't call off as fast as you wanted him to.

I agree cookies won't trump a chase with most dogs. But it never hurts to make yourself more rewarding or get the dog to take rewards, even just to lessen the stress of learning e collar if you get to that
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post #18 of 27 (permalink) Old 10-30-2018, 05:32 PM
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No clue how long a charge lasts. At least 4 hours. But you don't want to have them wear it that long as it can cause pressure sores. Mine have the longer prongs to reach the skin. Series 300 (discontinued) and the 200.
Thanks so much for the info! And yeah just considering for cases like hiking in the country for several days without a re-charge station.
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post #19 of 27 (permalink) Old 10-30-2018, 06:54 PM
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Thanks so much for the info! And yeah just considering for cases like hiking in the country for several days without a re-charge station.
We have a Dogtra ncp2300 and Educator ET300. Both will make it through an extended camping/hiking weekend as we use it, but I think we get more battery "milage" out of the ET300. The ET300 has been a great collar at a reasonable price point.
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post #20 of 27 (permalink) Old 10-31-2018, 03:52 PM
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I learned this from a K9 officer who has a cadaver dog who's on a long leash or walking free when working. She's a take home dog so she gets lax sometimes.


He continuously calls her in a monotone but loud voice. So literally continuous without break until he sees a change like she turns her head. When she does, he initiates the recall. I've seen him do it, it's annoying. But it works.


Have done it with my dog with some success. One time she took off and I didn't have a good hold on the leash and this worked to stop her chasing. But most of my success with recalls off the leash have been attributed to having hot dogs ready. I only give her hot dogs for recalls. Her recall rate with hot dogs in hand are at like the high 90 % range when we are at parks, dog parks, and hiking.
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