Fake Service dogs, ADA, legit working dogs. - German Shepherd Dog Forums
Reply
 
LinkBack Thread Tools
post #1 of 94 (permalink) Old 08-06-2013, 03:22 PM Thread Starter
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2013
Location: The most beautiful place to starve to death.
Posts: 220
Fake Service dogs, ADA, legit working dogs.

As times change, policy will sometimes need to be modified to prevent loopholes and abuse. The nearest city to me is a very popular tourist town near Glacier National Park. Over the years, you would see a few Canadian tourists with papered dogs that were out of control yet allowed into stores, dining establishments and other areas where regular dogs are not allowed.

It seems that every year, more and more people are getting "papers" for their dogs so they can stay in motels, hotels and other places that do not allow dogs. They are abusing the ADA law that allows disabled people to bring their dogs with them for help.

A quick search showed me that you can get an emotional support dog certificate for about 40 bucks online. You can even buy vests and other official looking markings for your dog.

Well, this just isn't right. I understand that there are times that an emotional support dog is beneficial to it's handler. But, this is being abused.

The laws are not clear on who can get a service dog and where they can go. It is wide open for interp. and that is good for the truly disabled but, a loophole for selfish people who just want to take fido into eat with them and don't want to pay cargo fees for a crated dog.

The air industry has pretty good regulations on service animals but in the real world, it can be abused with no reprimand.

What can we do to protect the status of working dogs and keep a good relationship with business owners, the public and people with real disabilities and need a working dog?

Is this a problem in your area? Do you see unmarked lap dogs barking in areas where they are not allowed? It directly interferes with working dogs and their mission.

How can we stop this?

My GSD is smarter than your honor student.
ODINsFREKI is offline  
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
post #2 of 94 (permalink) Old 08-06-2013, 03:53 PM
Master Member
 
Cschmidt88's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2010
Location: Anderson, CA
Posts: 658
I think a lot of it is undereducated employees as well. For example, even if they can get a certificate online that says "Emotional Support Animal", ESAs do not have public access rights like Service Dogs do.
Please Don't Pet Me

I honestly would have no issue with proof of training from a certified (in general dog training). Some counties you have to provide this in order to register your dog as a SD. I wouldn't mind having to get a license for your SD through county that way.

We can follow the laws, and educate wherever it's welcome. Some may get involved with the government to discuss laws.

And yes, I see a lot of fake SDs.

Dakonic German Shepherds

To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
Cschmidt88 is offline  
post #3 of 94 (permalink) Old 08-06-2013, 04:01 PM
Knighted Member
 
Gretchen's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2011
Location: California's Central Coast
Posts: 3,325
I agree, this issue has come up a few times on this website. I wrote something like this too. What go me going was our former breeder who also did dog training, wanted to make our dog a service dog for my adult daughter, she has mild cerebral palsy. He had no qualifications that I knew of, and did not mention specific tasks for the dog. Plus, my daughter being very independent and capable felt insulted that she needed "help". Someone in our training group was able to buy a "service dog in training" vest for her dog that I felt was somewhat aggressive.

My husband's niece got some fake papers saying her Ridgeback mix dog was a service dog so she did not need to quarantine it when traveling back and forth between the USA and Costa Rica - shameful. Fortunately in my immediate area I do not see much abuse of this.

My daughter told me a story about someone in her painting class bringing a small dog in, saying it was her emotional support dog. Normally no dogs are allowed on campus. Being a fun, laid back class, the instructor said it was OK. The dog went up to a student and peed on his leg, how embarrassing! The person with emotional support dog never came back to class after that.
Gretchen is offline  
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
post #4 of 94 (permalink) Old 08-06-2013, 05:01 PM
Elite Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2006
Posts: 1,610
how do you stop it? simple, well mannered dogs are allowed in public places, ones that aren't, aren't. Any dog disrupting anything are immediately tossed along with their owners, papers or not. That is the law now and it's probably the only law we need. Then nobody will fake papers because there will be no need. and maybe more people would be a better dog owner like people in other countries because they will be expected to have a well mannered dog when out and about and if not, they get to sit at home.
crackem is offline  
post #5 of 94 (permalink) Old 08-06-2013, 09:59 PM
Crowned Member
 
Xeph's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2005
Location: New Castle, PA
Posts: 5,846
Send a message via AIM to Xeph Send a message via Yahoo to Xeph
The easiest way to stop is is TURN FAKERS IN!!! People turn a blind eye. Some have admitted it in threads because "it's not hurting anybody". Really? Then why are people complaining!

TURN IN THE FAKERS!

Quote:
I honestly would have no issue with proof of training from a certified (in general dog training)
I do, since many handlers (in the USA) owner train.

I owner train.

Jackie and the
To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
(and one cat)

Strauss: The Patriarch
Wesson: The Grand Champion
Mikasa: The Hellbeast
Soul Eater: The Moon and Stars Dog
Xeph is offline  
post #6 of 94 (permalink) Old 08-06-2013, 10:10 PM
Elite Member
 
marbury's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2012
Location: WA
Posts: 1,287
There's no real place to 'turn them in', though. And many disabilities are invisible; I reckon I'd make a butt of myself pretty quick if I tried 'turning in' half the people I thought were abusing the ADA laws.
Now if the animal clearly could not even pass a CGC I will call them on it, and loudly. My first question is usually "what organization trained your service animal?". Since I have experience with the dogs that leave Maxwell for Canine Companions for Independence I feel I have at least some idea of what I should be seeing. That's gotten folks to shut up and play nice before.

I was on a flight where a woman attempted to sneak on her yorkie and was caught. I thought the attendant handled it very well; he very politely said that the captain needed to see the note she brought from her psychologist to waive the fees. She bumbled and hemmed and hawed about forgetting it at home. He apologized for the regulations but insisted that she come with him to pay the additional $125 for having a dog in the cabin. She left with minor fuss and came back on red as a beet, having been the cause of our twenty minute flight delay.

The BASIC OBEDIENCE class I was in (and I mean BASIC, like getting your pup to recognize his name and how to sit down on command) had a pit mix dog with a "SERVICE DOG" vest on. I had to face-palm. No 'training' patch or anything.

And if I had a dollar for every 'service dog' that came into the clinic where I work that is fear aggressive, a biter, or so bouncing-off-the-wall-crazy that it's impossible to get anything accomplished I could take a vacation to California. If they were ever legitimately trained their owners made sure that it didn't stick.


To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
marbury is offline  
post #7 of 94 (permalink) Old 08-06-2013, 10:17 PM
Member
 
Join Date: Feb 2013
Posts: 194
2 problems

1. enforcement- basically non-existant

2. legality of questioning service dog handler. very few specific things can be asked, anymore your setting yourself up for a lawsuit if the person is legitimate if your an establishment owner.
skier16 is offline  
post #8 of 94 (permalink) Old 08-06-2013, 10:27 PM
Crowned Member
 
Xeph's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2005
Location: New Castle, PA
Posts: 5,846
Send a message via AIM to Xeph Send a message via Yahoo to Xeph
Turn them into the manager of the place of business is what I meant, Marbury

Jackie and the
To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
(and one cat)

Strauss: The Patriarch
Wesson: The Grand Champion
Mikasa: The Hellbeast
Soul Eater: The Moon and Stars Dog
Xeph is offline  
post #9 of 94 (permalink) Old 08-06-2013, 10:39 PM
Elite Member
 
marbury's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2012
Location: WA
Posts: 1,287
Quote:
Originally Posted by Xeph View Post
Turn them into the manager of the place of business is what I meant, Marbury
Even then... what happens next? When I worked at Starbucks people would try and bring in purse dogs all the time. Other customers would complain, and we would go talk to them. But if they say "it's my service dog" we had no legal ability to force them to produce documents as such, even though we were food service. So yes, it might embarrass them into behaving better, but it could also mean that we just embarrassed or alienated a customer who has a legitimate reason for having a service animal with them at our store. Ouch!

I would be happy if there was less dialogue about such matters at dog parks and such. People talk to each other and laugh about how you can 'get your dog in free' by 'just saying he's your service dog'. It's legitimate advice now. I find that disgusting.


To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
marbury is offline  
post #10 of 94 (permalink) Old 08-06-2013, 10:47 PM
Crowned Member
 
Xeph's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2005
Location: New Castle, PA
Posts: 5,846
Send a message via AIM to Xeph Send a message via Yahoo to Xeph
Quote:
But if they say "it's my service dog" we had no legal ability to force them to produce documents as such
You can't force them to produce documents, but you may ask what tasks the dog does to mitigate their disability.

Emotional support is not a task. Bye bye.

Jackie and the
To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
(and one cat)

Strauss: The Patriarch
Wesson: The Grand Champion
Mikasa: The Hellbeast
Soul Eater: The Moon and Stars Dog
Xeph is offline  
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
Reply

Quick Reply
Message:
Options

Register Now



In order to be able to post messages on the German Shepherd Dog Forums forums, you must first register.
Please enter your desired user name, your email address and other required details in the form below.

User Name:
Password
Please enter a password for your user account. Note that passwords are case-sensitive.

Password:


Confirm Password:
Email Address
Please enter a valid email address for yourself.

Email Address:
OR

Log-in










Thread Tools
Show Printable Version Show Printable Version
Email this Page Email this Page



Posting Rules  
You may post new threads
You may post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are On

 
For the best viewing experience please update your browser to Google Chrome