Kind of curious... - German Shepherd Dog Forums
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post #1 of 8 (permalink) Old 05-06-2017, 11:44 PM Thread Starter
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Kind of curious...

Occasionally I sit around and will look at my dogs pedigree just for fun, especially after reading topics on here, And today as I was looking into it I got pretty deep into the generations and found a lot of her pedigree on dad's side had pretty nice titles further back, like Sch3 which I thought was cool, but closer generations didnt seem to have gotten anything. I didn't look much into mom's side, but it got me wondering;

Why would a breeder choose not to compete/trial their dogs? I know it takes a lot of time and money, but in my mind it's pretty worth it to prove your dog especially if you're going to breed. And this wasn't just one breeder, it was a few different ones all in dad's line which is probably what got me so curious.

Just some late night thoughts I suppose.
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post #2 of 8 (permalink) Old 05-07-2017, 08:47 AM
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Not sure. My dogs have more 3s on the males side, 1s and 2s on the females. I suspect the females take time off to breed, while the males can keep on working.

And then in Germany if you want the "pink papers" you have to trial. In the states, it is not a requirement and I suspect it costs too much in time and money for some breeders.

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post #3 of 8 (permalink) Old 05-07-2017, 09:17 AM
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Many breeders pick really nice titled males with a lot of drive but when choosing females care more about the dogs behind her and whether or not she is stable temperament wise.

Even if you haven't titled a dog you learn a lot about the dog in training. The titles themselves are largely meaningless to me as I learn everything I need to know about a dog as I am training it. Watching an actual trial, while it yields important information, does not give you as complete a picture as training the dog will. As long as you don't have rose colored glasses on when it comes to your dogs you know what you have before it ever steps onto a trial field.

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post #4 of 8 (permalink) Old 05-07-2017, 10:37 AM
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Trials keep breeders honest. Trials can be stressful and some dogs don't handle that stress whether it comes from the environment or from their nervous freaked out handler. There are many breeders (and I am not saying all who don't title) don't want to put their dogs under the scrutiny of others or have them judged. Buyers can also be fickle and one must have a lot of confidence in one's breeding stock to put them out there for all to see.

And, the biggest reason is that in the USA breeders don't have to do Jack with their dogs other than make puppies, and buyers will still come. Doing it right is expensive and takes time and when breeders can still sell puppies, many don't feel the need to deal with the hassles.

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post #5 of 8 (permalink) Old 05-07-2017, 10:50 AM
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SOOO true, unfortunately!
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post #6 of 8 (permalink) Old 05-07-2017, 04:48 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ThroughYska'sEyes View Post
Occasionally I sit around and will look at my dogs pedigree just for fun, especially after reading topics on here, And today as I was looking into it I got pretty deep into the generations and found a lot of her pedigree on dad's side had pretty nice titles further back, like Sch3 which I thought was cool, but closer generations didnt seem to have gotten anything. I didn't look much into mom's side, but it got me wondering;

Why would a breeder choose not to compete/trial their dogs? I know it takes a lot of time and money, but in my mind it's pretty worth it to prove your dog especially if you're going to breed. And this wasn't just one breeder, it was a few different ones all in dad's line which is probably what got me so curious.

Just some late night thoughts I suppose.
A lot of people don't bother titling and/or health testing because it cuts into their bottom line. They usually have excuses ready, like "conformation is more about politics than it is the dogs", or "it costs too much to show" or "they come from champion/titled lines, so I know they are good dogs". Also, a lot of people who want to buy a dog simply don't do any homework beyond "who around me has puppies for sale?", and are happy to buy pups who are "from champion lines", even if those champions are five (or more) generations back.

Frankly, when I see someone touting how great their dogs are, and how they are suitable for "X, Y, or Z", but my rescued mutt with an iffy (at best) temperament has more real titles that all their dogs combined, let's just say that I tend to be very skeptical of their breeding program.

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post #7 of 8 (permalink) Old 05-07-2017, 05:07 PM
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Championship lines don't necessarily mean squat. Storm my nerve bag female malinois has a total of 3 world IPO titles at the 3 and 5 or so national IPO titles at level 3 within 3 generations. Most of her siblings turned out rather nice and her dad is a total stud but she is a crapper.

When I mean I know what I have just by training it's because I'm evaluating a bunch of different things. How does the dog respond to pressure from me? How does the dog respond to change of decoy? Will the dog play with a stranger? How does the dog respond to a change of training field? The sound of the gun? A whip? Strangers coming to the house? Will the dog still bite when strict rules of engagement and disengagement are applied? Is he cooperating with you and honest about it or is he looking for an opportunity to do things his way? I've seen people put blinders on for a dog but if you're honest with yourself and you've seen a bunch of nice world level dogs, you know.

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post #8 of 8 (permalink) Old 05-07-2017, 06:57 PM Thread Starter
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Ah that's what I figured! Makes A lot of sense, And I definitely think health testing is far more important then titling, but was genuinely curious why some breeders just opted out of it. But that all makes a tone of sense!

Obviously my dog isn't a standard colour and neither was her father so I knew they wouldn't have any conformation titles and I was actually SUPER surprised when I did see DDR lines further back. I've owned A shepherd before but never really cared about pedigree or titling until we got Alyska who was actually AKC registered then I got curious even though she was bought as just a pet and we only really cared about temperament and health testing.

But with that being said, I decided to start working towards competing her this summer now that I have the time and she's gone through extensive obedience plus she'll be coming to 2 and be health tested so it'll all be a good time to really just work it.
I don't think we'll do IPO or anything of the sort, mostly because I don't feel she's suited for it (thought I could be wrong). But I think we may work towards some obiedence and agility classes and see how she does!
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