Please offer a critique... - German Shepherd Dog Forums
 
LinkBack Thread Tools
post #1 of 8 (permalink) Old 12-11-2011, 11:21 PM Thread Starter
Crowned Member
 
wildo's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2006
Location: Indiana
Posts: 5,616
Please offer a critique...

I've wondered about Gretchen's structure since I've gotten her. I constantly try to spot differences between her and Pimg whenever I see them in the same positions. But I'm not really sure about Pimg's conformation either. All I can tell is that Gretchen is "somehow different" than Pimg.

Please offer a critique if you can. Note- she is a foster dog. I'm curious of her conformation only- I'm already well aware of her amazingly sweet temperament!









She doesn't have any kind of "stay" command to speak of, so a stacked pic is just not going to happen. At least, not without some help...

Willy
RATCHX3 High Jinks vom Neuanfang - Gotchya Day: 1/23/2013 DN, SG, SR, CA
Inspire Spark to Ignition! (Ignite) Gotchya Day: 10/8/2016
C-ATCH Pimg - RATO, UJJ (x2), DJX, HIT, CA, CGC, High in Games, Reserve High in Standard- CPE Nationals 2014
wildo is offline  
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
post #2 of 8 (permalink) Old 12-11-2011, 11:34 PM Thread Starter
Crowned Member
 
wildo's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2006
Location: Indiana
Posts: 5,616
In case it matters:
Height: 21"
Length: 23"
Weight: 56.4lbs

Willy
RATCHX3 High Jinks vom Neuanfang - Gotchya Day: 1/23/2013 DN, SG, SR, CA
Inspire Spark to Ignition! (Ignite) Gotchya Day: 10/8/2016
C-ATCH Pimg - RATO, UJJ (x2), DJX, HIT, CA, CGC, High in Games, Reserve High in Standard- CPE Nationals 2014
wildo is offline  
post #3 of 8 (permalink) Old 12-12-2011, 12:07 AM
Crowned Member
 
Join Date: Feb 2011
Location: ontario -
Posts: 13,884
to help illustrate structure of the pictures you posted above # 1 and 3 are helpful. can you include this one in a lineup In my opinion, she sure is drop dead beautiful!
Click this bar to view the full image.
carmspack is offline  
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
post #4 of 8 (permalink) Old 12-12-2011, 12:50 AM
Knighted Member
 
Zisso's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2009
Location: Baker City, OR
Posts: 3,199
I am not the one to critique at all, but wanted to say that she is Stunning!! How old is she again?

Nadia - GSD -DOB 12-29-07
Zisso - GSD- DOB 9-16-07
Pepe & Kiki`my sweet kitties

Zisso is my heart~Nadia is my Love~My kitties bring me everything in between~Together they bring me Joy!
Zisso is offline  
post #5 of 8 (permalink) Old 12-12-2011, 07:53 AM Thread Starter
Crowned Member
 
wildo's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2006
Location: Indiana
Posts: 5,616
She is two-ish.

Willy
RATCHX3 High Jinks vom Neuanfang - Gotchya Day: 1/23/2013 DN, SG, SR, CA
Inspire Spark to Ignition! (Ignite) Gotchya Day: 10/8/2016
C-ATCH Pimg - RATO, UJJ (x2), DJX, HIT, CA, CGC, High in Games, Reserve High in Standard- CPE Nationals 2014
wildo is offline  
post #6 of 8 (permalink) Old 12-12-2011, 09:12 AM
Banned
 
Join Date: Jul 2010
Location: MassaCHEWsetts
Posts: 5,219
She looks happy and healthy and fit. Maybe slightly down on her pasterns(maybe not). Hard to tell conformation without something close to a stack. You have done a fantastic job with her.
PaddyD is offline  
post #7 of 8 (permalink) Old 12-12-2011, 05:44 PM
Crowned Member
 
Join Date: Feb 2011
Location: ontario -
Posts: 13,884
finally some time to do this justice.

conformation is best seen in motion , which is why in judging you have dogs being run around so that the judge can see side movement at different speeds , see shoulders opening , reach , movement or torque in the back , whether dog is travelling true or crabbing, drive of the rear going under and pushing off , sickle or restricted, toe dragging. Then the judge wants to see coming and going , elbows in or out , paddling with front, rear knit and purl .
The side view shows the conformation , the movement comfirms .

This little lucky dog , rescued and given a best shot at a new life -- for conformation. I thought I would take advantage of the opportunity because Wildo is always asking about a dog for agility .

Gretchen here shows long foot , open toes , poor padding , long pastern with poor ligament so that when she lands she collapses fully right to the joint . Somewhat more than the 20 to 23 degrees . Compare THE ILLUSTRATED STANDARD OF THE GERMAN SHEPHERD DOG My experience with American show bred dogs is that rather than having a shoulder which opens and allows the leg to depart , shoulder and elbow stretched out , the elbow remains close to body but there is an appearance of extension because there is an exaggeration of the leg length through a longer pastern which is not stable. It is an optical illusion. It is very taxing for a dog needing to do distance (duration) , run on uneven ground , and change direction quickly as a herding dog would be required to do. Bad feet , same . CARPAL SUBLUXATION and WEAK PASTERNS — TWO DIFFERENT CONDITIONS by Fred Lanting . For agility this would be damaging, injury prone , painful for jumping and landing as there is no shock absorption in the pastern nor the foot.

here you can see the development of the breed --

Vzreja nemških ovčarjev - PSARNA GRECS You can see the first glimmer of this longer weaker pastern in the era 1970-1980 with **** Adeloga, and then continuing to become rather common, Gundo, Canto Arminius, Uran Wildsteiger Land, Eiko Kirschental, Fanto Hirschel , Zamb Wienerau, Lasso Neuen Berg Ursus and Larus --- watched it 5 or 6 times -- then watch it again to see the dramatic changes in heads.


Click this bar to view the full image.
here you can see the dog in a pace - the croup higher than the wither so she is running down hill , more impact on those pasterns. The rear can't get in underneath her to thrust her forward . Not balanced . Too much in front , lacking in the rear.

Click this bar to view the full image.
and here she is in a joyful romp , relaxed , which I am so happy to see for her. Conformation though shows that the rear cannot propel her forward enough. The front is too long and is drawn in under the body and twists away from the center to the opposite side , outside . Tiring after a while . There is no period of suspension .
This is a picture of a dog that really interests me , for her accomplishments and the value of her pedigree , owned by forum member , Kessy Waldwinkel

This dog in not exaggerated in any way , totally balanced , great physical condition -- syncopated in motion moves like a little machine . This is balance .

For agility you want a dog balanced , even if lacking in front and rear the balance is important .

thought I had the time - still did it with multiple distractions - bits and pieces hope it is of interest

Carmen
Carmspack Working German Shepherd Dogs

Last edited by carmspack; 12-12-2011 at 05:46 PM.
carmspack is offline  
post #8 of 8 (permalink) Old 12-13-2011, 09:17 AM Thread Starter
Crowned Member
 
wildo's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2006
Location: Indiana
Posts: 5,616
This was such a helpful reply Carmen- thanks so much for taking the time! I had a crazy busy day yesterday and didn't get a chance to jump on the forums much at all. My day today is looking the same but I wanted to take a moment to say thanks.

I think it's important to learn from Gretchen, she seems to be a good example of what you might get from a typical BYB. I knew from looking at her that her conformation wasn't "right" but I didn't know how to be specific. I think your response will be very helpful for people, in general, to be able to better spot what to look for in a balanced dog. And I definitely understand that you were being critical of her conformation, not her progress. That is exactly what I asked for, and I am glad to know it. Thanks again!

Willy
RATCHX3 High Jinks vom Neuanfang - Gotchya Day: 1/23/2013 DN, SG, SR, CA
Inspire Spark to Ignition! (Ignite) Gotchya Day: 10/8/2016
C-ATCH Pimg - RATO, UJJ (x2), DJX, HIT, CA, CGC, High in Games, Reserve High in Standard- CPE Nationals 2014
wildo is offline  
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
Reply

Quick Reply
Message:
Options

Register Now



In order to be able to post messages on the German Shepherd Dog Forums forums, you must first register.
Please enter your desired user name, your email address and other required details in the form below.

User Name:
Password
Please enter a password for your user account. Note that passwords are case-sensitive.

Password:


Confirm Password:
Email Address
Please enter a valid email address for yourself.

Email Address:
OR

Log-in










Thread Tools
Show Printable Version Show Printable Version
Email this Page Email this Page



Posting Rules  
You may post new threads
You may post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are On

 
For the best viewing experience please update your browser to Google Chrome