Somehow my bought from a random family dog is a treasure - Page 5 - German Shepherd Dog Forums
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post #41 of 65 (permalink) Old 09-13-2019, 11:14 AM
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Jenny, I didn't know that about Rumor. That's quite a surprise!

Selzer, I fully understand and share your frustration. Just this week, someone advertised on our community message board, hoping to find a bitch to breed their mastiff mix to before they have him neutered!

As for crossing the different bloodlines, back when I bought Star, it was because I was hoping the GSD could maybe still become one breed again, and here was a puppy which had some of the best of both ASL and GSL blood, plus a nice, non-roached topline, super bone and a nice temperament.

I soon realized there was no way she would make it in either the German or the American show ring. The differences were just too great. Plus, anyone whose dogs were doing well in the ASL ring had a pro handler to show them, which meant spending big bucks on showing.

I still had some hope of getting some puppies from her that could be shown, but the results of her OFA exam squashed that dream, too.

Edit: here is the dog Rumor was bred to, an ASL/GSL cross. So, sometimes it can work. http://www.pedigreedatabase.com/germ...-rain-v-kenlyn

Last edited by Sunsilver; 09-13-2019 at 11:17 AM.
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post #42 of 65 (permalink) Old 09-13-2019, 11:41 AM
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Jenny, I didn't know that about Rumor. That's quite a surprise!

Selzer, I fully understand and share your frustration. Just this week, someone advertised on our community message board, hoping to find a bitch to breed their mastiff mix to before they have him neutered! [IMG class=inlineimg]/forum/images/smilies/mad.gif[/IMG]

As for crossing the different bloodlines, back when I bought Star, it was because I was hoping the GSD could maybe still become one breed again, and here was a puppy which had some of the best of both ASL and GSL blood, plus a nice, non-roached topline, super bone and a nice temperament.

I soon realized there was no way she would make it in either the German or the American show ring. The differences were just too great. Plus, anyone whose dogs were doing well in the ASL ring had a pro handler to show them, which meant spending big bucks on showing.

I still had some hope of getting some puppies from her that could be shown, but the results of her OFA exam squashed that dream, too. [IMG class=inlineimg]/forum/images/Germanshepherds_2016/smilies/tango_face_sad.png[/IMG]

Edit: here is the dog Rumor was bred to, an ASL/GSL cross. So, sometimes it can work. http://www.pedigreedatabase.com/germ...-rain-v-kenlyn
The breeder has a few dogs with mixed lines- from Mailo a wgsl. Mailo is my females sire. My females breeder has asl and wgsl and has on occasion has mixed the lines and produced really nice dogs. Megabucks has wgsl farther down in his lines. It is not that uncommon then one would think. I have seen nice wgsl and working lines. There was a poster here that had working lines and als. It has to be done right and I know very reputable breeders who do this. I would think they are able see what the need or have or want to bring in. Sometimes it works really well and others maybe not like all breedings.


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Last edited by Jenny720; 09-13-2019 at 11:56 AM.
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post #43 of 65 (permalink) Old 09-13-2019, 11:47 AM
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I scoff at the term “accidental litter.” In all my years of owning intact dogs, I’ve never once had an accidental litter. Or a planned one for that matter. Before Lyka’s spay, we had both Lyka and Crios intact. Never an issue. Floki, who is not intact, still tries to hump both Lyka and Seiran. Lyka puts him right in his place, and I do for Seiran.

Crios’s breeder, and I use that term very very loosely, has used the “accidental litter” every heat cycle with her GSD. She has friends or family members post the litters on Facebook so no one knows it the same female, and still pumping out litter after litter of GSD/Husky mixes.

Accidental litters = BYB or I WAS TOO LAZY TO WATCH AND/OR KEEP THEM SEPARATED. The large majority being the first.

People are going to believe what they want to hear when it comes to purchasing a puppy. And just because the breeder cries when handing over a pup DOES NOT mean it was accidental, it means the breeder is putting on a show for you.

I’m with @selzer on this one.
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post #44 of 65 (permalink) Old 09-13-2019, 11:57 AM
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Yes and works real well!
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post #45 of 65 (permalink) Old 09-13-2019, 12:10 PM
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Many years ago I had a bunch of dogs. One of my girls was in heat. I left for work and being diligent I secured both females inside the dog run which was double fence, with a roof and a latched door with a clip on it. I left the unneutered male in my securely fenced yard with my Dane for company. I left all the dogs water and all had shelter, shade and water.
At some point AC showed up and saw the two dogs loose in the yard. He figured they had somehow escaped so unlatched the dog run and put them inside. And the only response I got from AC was that the water bucket was empty when he arrived so he needed to put them in the run for access to water.
I believe oops litters happen. I just don't believe they happen at the rather alarming rate that irresponsible owners would have people believe.
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post #46 of 65 (permalink) Old 09-13-2019, 12:21 PM
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Wow, I hope AC got an earfull from you!!

I have seen nice ASL/GSL crosses, and I've also seen ones that inherited the worst features of both lines. Mailo obviously favours the American side of his pedigree, which is why he's done well in the ASL show ring. He'd never make it in the German ring, though.
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post #47 of 65 (permalink) Old 09-13-2019, 03:52 PM
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Huh? Mailo is all wgsl and from Germany.

http://www.pedigreedatabase.com/germ...#user-comments

I’m sure I would imagine stucture vaire a bit in a litter like that as it does normally.


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Last edited by Jenny720; 09-13-2019 at 04:05 PM.
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post #48 of 65 (permalink) Old 09-13-2019, 04:33 PM Thread Starter
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Many years ago I had a bunch of dogs. One of my girls was in heat. I left for work and being diligent I secured both females inside the dog run which was double fence, with a roof and a latched door with a clip on it. I left the unneutered male in my securely fenced yard with my Dane for company. I left all the dogs water and all had shelter, shade and water.
At some point AC showed up and saw the two dogs loose in the yard. He figured they had somehow escaped so unlatched the dog run and put them inside. And the only response I got from AC was that the water bucket was empty when he arrived so he needed to put them in the run for access to water.
I believe oops litters happen. I just don't believe they happen at the rather alarming rate that irresponsible owners would have people believe.
Thank you for this post. This is exactly why I believe in SOME accidental litters. Yes frankly, most of them are lies. But I’ve also known people who have been in similar situations to that.

I also know without a doubt that the family I got my dog from wasn’t a breeder. We’ve now become friends with them and have mutual friends through them and they have not bred the dogs again. I think it was so hard on them and upsetting to try to find good homes that it actually fueled them to become really great dog owners.
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post #49 of 65 (permalink) Old 09-13-2019, 06:30 PM
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The breeder has a few dogs with mixed lines- from Mailo a wgsl. Mailo is my females sire. My females breeder has asl and wgsl and has on occasion has mixed the lines and produced really nice dogs. Megabucks has wgsl farther down in his lines. It is not that uncommon then one would think. I have seen nice wgsl and working lines. There was a poster here that had working lines and als. It has to be done right and I know very reputable breeders who do this. I would think they are able see what the need or have or want to bring in. Sometimes it works really well and others maybe not like all breedings.
My girls (litter mates) are ASL (pet lines) x wgwl. They were purposely bred, not for some planned outcome just that the dams owner wanted a pup from her and the sire was available. If you listen to what some folks say about this type of breeding my girls should be nutters, but that’s not been case.
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post #50 of 65 (permalink) Old 09-13-2019, 07:58 PM
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Thank you for this post. This is exactly why I believe in SOME accidental litters. Yes frankly, most of them are lies. But I’ve also known people who have been in similar situations to that.

I also know without a doubt that the family I got my dog from wasn’t a breeder. We’ve now become friends with them and have mutual friends through them and they have not bred the dogs again. I think it was so hard on them and upsetting to try to find good homes that it actually fueled them to become really great dog owners.
Except that I opted for a spay abort and choked on the massive vet bill. I learned. I trust no one and nothing with my dogs well being. No fence, latch, lock, door or expert is as safe for my dogs as my own eyes and my love for them.
I believe that we all make mistakes. I believe that it's the only way we can learn. It isn't about making mistakes, it's what we learn from them, what we take away. Sadly a good many dog owners learn that puppies=$$, so even if the first litter was a legit accident they learn the wrong lesson. I hope that the folks your girl came from remain sincere in their plan for no more litters.
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