Another pedigree and litter to consider - German Shepherd Dog Forums
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post #1 of 9 (permalink) Old 04-08-2017, 12:58 PM Thread Starter
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Another pedigree and litter to consider

Hi everyone, I'm once again looking for input on this pedigree. I'm somewhat concerned about the line breeding just from what I've learned here and there, and would love to have an idea from others as to why it would be done on this pedigree. As I've mentioned before, I'm looking for a dog to develop into medium drive, social but aloof, off-switch, biddable in nature.

Litter from Ibon Jipo-me and Marley von Wendelin

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post #2 of 9 (permalink) Old 04-08-2017, 07:46 PM
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Line breeding itself is not a bad thing. This of course should go without saying that I'm assuming it's done by a good breeder. A good breeder will use linebreeding to try and produce traits for a particular breeding on a consistent basis.

I'm new to German shepherds but I'll give you an example from my experience with hunting dogs. Say I had a cur who produced a bitch that had a great nose and was gamey enough to stay with a big hog. I could take her and linebreed her back to her grandsire in an attempt to get these traits on a regular basis. When done right you get the strengths you're looking for. When done wrong by the wrong person you can end up highlighting weaknesses instead. So it comes down to breeder.

Now in this particular pedigree I don't know. I'm not familiar with GSD but you could ask the breeder what traits they were looking for and what type of dogs they produce. And as far as what you're looking for in regards to the med drive aloof dog, again your best bet is to ask the breeder. They should know more about their dogs than someone on a forum. If they don't that's a pretty big red flag IMO. But I'm sure someone with more experience can chime in on the dogs in question.
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post #3 of 9 (permalink) Old 04-08-2017, 08:12 PM
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femfa "Hi everyone, I'm once again looking for input on this pedigree."

what happened to the other litter ? was there news on the x ray?

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post #4 of 9 (permalink) Old 04-08-2017, 08:14 PM
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go to the breeder and ask THEM for some hardball answers .

see if they know. make them earn their fees

for my taste that is quite a bit of Grim Pohranicni Straze
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post #5 of 9 (permalink) Old 04-08-2017, 10:33 PM
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Femfa, I was in line to have a Marley pup and due to unforeseen circumstances I got a pup from Marley's full sister and Cert (Hasso). I know of Ibon but that's about it. I can tell you that in my opinion Christina knows what she's doing. Christina is very approachable and will answer your questions! Put yourself at ease and just ask what you need to ask. If you look at Marley's side of the line there are some pretty great dogs there. There is quite a bit of footage of Ibon on YouTube. I am very happy with my Wendelin dog but my dog is what I was looking for. Like I said, Christina knows her stuff and if she tells you she can accommodate your requirements then based on my experience you can take it to the bank!
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post #6 of 9 (permalink) Old 04-08-2017, 11:37 PM Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by carmspack View Post
femfa "Hi everyone, I'm once again looking for input on this pedigree."

what happened to the other litter ? was there news on the x ray?
No news on the x-ray. As excited as I was for the litter, my partner was becoming anxious about whether or not we would be getting a pup (ie. if no female was born, if females born ended up having too high of drive, etc). This dog is for both of us, and while I'm exceptionally passionate regarding IPO and obedience, it's something he's just putting his toes in and I wasn't going to force him to choose the litter that only I wanted. With the passing of his WGSL recently, we decided that this summer would be a good time to add a working line GSD to our family... being without a dog feels like a home without a heart to us. We know it's not something to rush and that careful consideration is important, which is why I'm keen to ask for input from experienced members such as yourself.

I did call Wendelin and asked Christina her about her line breeding, her goals, what to expect, flaws, etc. I was very impressed with her responses. I, too, was very concerned about the Grim line breeding and did PM another member because I took note of it and also that Gero was in the line - a dog that I have found, based on reviews/comments from others, to be quite the civil dog. I emphasized the importance of having a dog who was social and environmentally sound, and that I'm not interested in getting over my head in terms of drive. She informed me that she felt confident that many of the females from this litter would be pack driven, biddable, with moderate drives that could match my goals without over powering me. She was quite upfront and very honest about her own dogs and how she works to balance, but that genetics can be difficult at times to predict perfectly. Christina also mentioned that if I were to get a male from this line, however, that I would likely end up with too much dog.

I like having the ability to ask for unbiased reviews of pedigrees so that when I do contact a breeder, I have an idea of what their responses should be around and what to bring up should it be neglected in conversation. It gives me a bit more of a confident edge... I can research all I want, but the breeders and individuals who have had the opportunity to see these dogs work or what they produce and share that knowledge is paramount for a newbie like me.

And it wasn't line breeding in general that I was concerned about, it was the line breeding on Grim that made me wonder if I were to get a dog from this litter if it would be too much for me.

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post #7 of 9 (permalink) Old 04-09-2017, 01:40 AM
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femfa said " many of the females from this litter would be pack driven, biddable, with moderate drives " and then "if I were to get a male from this line, however, that I would likely end up with too much dog."

In my experience this has never been a gender divide.
That is a very broad generalization .
Statements like that can help sell females .
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post #8 of 9 (permalink) Old 04-09-2017, 03:57 AM
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Femfa, maybe the right question to ask would be for a recommendation on a breeder that meets your needs. Why roll the dice and take a chance of getting too much dog?

I mean if that ended up being the case what would you do? It may not be good for you or the dog. I'd say find a breeder that's known to produce the type of dog you're after.
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post #9 of 9 (permalink) Old 04-09-2017, 12:36 PM Thread Starter
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Another pedigree and litter to consider

Thanks for you input Carm, I appreciate it and will definitely take it into consideration. And Gooseman, I've actually been looking at breeders for about a year now before making any decisions and just this summer we were able to move forward. So I've been trying to talk with breeders I feel confident in who have a good reputation from here on this forum and elsewhere. If I ended up with too much dog, it would be a conversation for the breeder and I to sit down and have. If it were best to take the dog back then that's what I would do, especially considering first right of refusal.

The idea is that if any litter were to produce too much dog, we would simply skip on it. The point is to end up with a dog from a breeding who will meet our needs based on the assessment of the breeder. I'm not an expert in pedigrees, which is why I post them here. A breeder can have a range of dogs within a litter and within their breedings, but they should fit an archetype of sorts. So I'm just hoping to get guidelines on what to expect from each litter.

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