Scheduled shots for 7 weeks old puppy - German Shepherd Dog Forums
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post #1 of 12 (permalink) Old 01-29-2018, 04:08 PM Thread Starter
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Scheduled shots for 7 weeks old puppy

On the day we got our 7 weeks puppy, we had him checked by a vet and were told that he needs a series of vaccine/shots in the upcoming weeks. He just received his first vaccin on 1-19-18 and needs more in mid Feb as per what we were told. The vet sold us $35 pills to "deworm" him and was eager to get him on their $90/m puppy wellness plan. Feeling that they were spending more time pushing us to buy products/services than the time they invested in the exam, i declined the plan and i'm now looking for what's best to do next. My questions are:

-- Can someone recommend a Vet in San Bruno, Millbrae, Burilingame California area that really care about the animal First?
-- Do we need to go through a Vet to get his next vaccine or like the pills we got, we can just buy it and do it ourselves?
-- We will need pet medication like for flea prevention, deworming etc., is there a Trusted online store to buy this type of medication from?
-- Is a stool sample analysis needed?

Thank you!
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post #2 of 12 (permalink) Old 01-29-2018, 09:48 PM
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Except for the rabies vaccine, the others can be done at home. Drs Foster & Smith is an excellent online store. These links are to articles on their website in answer to some of your questions:

https://www.drsfostersmith.com/pic/a...m?articleid=85

https://www.drsfostersmith.com/pic/a...cleid=84&d=155

https://www.drsfostersmith.com/pic/a...5&category=182

This article reviews vets in your area:

https://www.yelp.com/search?cflt=vet...an+Bruno%2C+CA


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post #3 of 12 (permalink) Old 01-30-2018, 07:21 AM
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Hi Cody 2k and WELCOME!

What BIG city are you fairly close to for vet recommendations?

If you do these vaccinations yourself, OR even if a vet administers them, Please make sure that they do not contain Thimerosal:

Per Dogs Naturally Magazine:
"Thimerosal is a mercury-based preservative which is nearly 50% mercury by weight. Thimerosal is a very inflammatory neurotoxin and genetic mutator and Pittman Moore Animal Pharmaceutical Company warned against its safety “even in dog serum” to Eli Lilly Company in 1935. Pittman Moore found that over 50% of vaccinated dogs suffered inflammatory reactions to Thimerosal.
These safety issues were raised in Congressional testimony several times and the correspondence from Pittman Moore to Eli Lilly is a part of Congressional Hearings testimony on the dangers of mercury in vaccines. Despite this, Thimerosal is still used as a preservative in a staggering number of vaccinations for both humans and dogs."

"If vaccinating your dog for rabies, make sure you see the label of the vaccine and that the vaccine is thimerosal free."

Per Dr. Dodds:
*"MLV vaccines (modified live virus) use a modified, but weakened, form of the live microorganism. When the virus is injected into the body, it multiplies many-fold and stimulates the immune system’s production of antibodies, creating an immune response that protects the body against future exposure to the disease. "

*"Killed vaccines use an inactivated “ dead” form of the virus (previously live microorganisms that have been killed with chemicals or heat), along with an adjuvant (a substance added to a vaccine to enhance its effectiveness without itself causing an immune response).
For dogs: Killed vaccines include all rabies vaccines, canine leptospirosis, Lyme, canine influenza, injectable bordetella, injectable coronavirus (not recommended by 2011 AAHA* Canine Vaccine Guidelines) and diamondback rattlesnake toxoid (does not protect equally against all types of rattlesnakes, including Mohave green variety). "
So please make very sure of what you are injecting into your pup.



Vaccinations should be separated instead of giving a "Combo Cocktail" with multiple (5 to 7) viruses/bacteria's in it. It would be like you going into Walgreens and getting a flu shot, a pneumonia shot, a meningitis shot, a chicken pox shot, and a whooping cough shot ALL at one time!!!!!


Per Dr. Dodds: Research the particular "risks" in your area for certain diseases before throwing ALL of those at your pup. Then make an informed decision on which ones will be beneficial.

Dr. Jean Dodds - Vaccine Researcher

2016 Vaccination Protocol:
9 - 10 weeks of age

Distemper + Parvovirus, MLV
e.g. Merck Nobivac (Intervet Progard) Puppy DPV


14 – 15 weeks of age
Distemper + Parvovirus, MLV


18 weeks of age
Parvovirus only, MLV

Note: New research states that last puppy parvovirus vaccine should be at 18 weeks old.


20 weeks or older, if allowable by law
Rabies – give 3-4 weeks apart from other vaccines

Mercury-free (thimerosol-free, TF)

1 year old
Distemper + Parvovirus, MLV
This is an optional booster or titer. If the client intends not to booster after this optional booster or intends to retest titers in another three years, this optional booster at puberty is wise.


1 year old
Rabies – give 3-4 weeks apart from other vaccines


Dogs should be tittered each year BEFORE a vaccination is given. If titer is sufficient for such as Parvo or Distemper, a vaccination should not be given.


Articles
Vets On Vaccines - Dogs Naturally Magazine
Leptospirosis Vaccines adverse reaction, Dr. Jordan DVM
Frequently Asked Questions about Titers and Vaccination Protocol by Dr. Dodds
Puppy and Kitten Vaccinations: Timing is critical
Rabies: The Science & the Current Law
Vaccines: When too much of a good thing turns bad
Vaccines: When too much of a good thing turns bad (Part 2)
Avoid Unnecessary Vaccines with Titer Tests (Part 3)

Response: Immune-Mediated Thrombocytopenia Report and Article
Q&A with Dr. Dodds: Is the puppy’s severe physical reaction due to a routine vaccine?
Q&A with Dr. Dodds: What should I do to protect my adult dogs during a parvovirus outbreak?
To Vaccinate or Not to Vaccinate for Infectious Canine Hepatitis?
Q&A with Dr. Dodds: I had a dog who had a bad reaction to the rabies vaccine and now I am concerned about giving it to my other dogs. What should I do?
Q&A with Dr. Dodds: Kennel Cough Complex Vaccines
Yes or No to Snake Vaccines?
Canine Influenza H3N8 Article - Dr. Dodds’ Additions
Clinical Approaches to Managing and Treating Adverse Vaccine Reactions
Dr. Schultz on Lyme Vaccine
Dr. Schultz Update on Leptospirosis Vaccines (2012)
More on Vaccine Titer Testing
Q&A with Dr. Dodds: Newborns and immunity from mothers
Mercury-Induced Inflammation: Yet Another Example of ASIA Syndrome
Canine Non-Core Vaccines
Snapshot of Leptospirosis Strains and Vaccines
Puppy Vaccination Schedule and Socialization: Can they go together?
Kennel Cough Complex: A complicated phrase for the canine common cold
A Pilot Study: Dose Vaccines for Small Dogs
More on Vaccinations & Small Dog Vaccine Study
Canine Influenza H3N2 Outbreak
Immune Disorders and Vaccines
Know Your Bordetella Vaccine

Canine NON-Core Vaccines: Dr. Jean Dodds' Pet Health Resource Blog | Search results for: core vaccines
"Dr. Dodds considers infectious canine hepatitis (adenovirus-1), canine adenovirus-2, bordetella, canine influenza, canine coronavirus, leptospirosis, and Lyme regional and situational. Please research the prevalence in your area, and discuss it with your veterinarian."

The Purdue Vaccination Studies and Auto-antibodies by Catherine O’Driscoll on April 26, 2011 The Purdue Vaccination Studies and Auto-antibodies - Dogs Naturally Magazine
Taking The Risk Out Of Puppy Shots by Dogs Naturally on July 12, 2011
Taking The Risk Out Of Puppy Shots - Dogs Naturally Magazine
Protecting Your Puppy From Disease:
Protecting Your Puppy From Disease - Dogs Naturally Magazine
There is also a 4 part video series on vaccinations by Dr. Ron Schultz and Dr. Karen Becker at www.mercolahealtypets.com

Dr. Ron Schultz's (Vaccine Research) study results:
Minimum Duration of Immunity for Canine Vaccines:
Distemper- 7 years by challenge/15 years by serology
Parvovirus – 7 years by challenge/ 7 years by serology
Adenovirus – 7 years by challenge/ 9 years by serology
Canine rabies – 3 years by challenge/ 7 years by serology
Dr. Schultz concludes: “Vaccines for diseases like distemper and canine parvovirus, once administered to adult animals, provide lifetime immunity.”



Hope this helps,
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post #4 of 12 (permalink) Old 01-31-2018, 08:07 PM Thread Starter
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Thank you very much for the wealth of information! Really pleased to be part of this forums cause like you, i only want to do the best for him. I'll look into the options listed below and post again if i have any other questions. Thanks again for your time!
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post #5 of 12 (permalink) Old 01-31-2018, 08:48 PM
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Originally Posted by Cody2k View Post
Thank you very much for the wealth of information! Really pleased to be part of this forums cause like you, i only want to do the best for him. I'll look into the options listed below and post again if i have any other questions. Thanks again for your time!
......
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post #6 of 12 (permalink) Old 01-31-2018, 09:11 PM
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The puppy plan is actually really good. You pay less and I believe deworming meds are almost free if I recall AND you can deworm as much as you need to until worms are gone. However, it depends on what your vet gives in the package. You do save in the long run. What if you have to do 3 rounds of deworming at $35 a pop, well, now you're over the price of the puppy plan when you could've done the plan and saved on the meds

I'd say yes to the stool sample. Use that until you know your pup is free of bugs
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post #7 of 12 (permalink) Old 02-02-2018, 12:38 PM Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by Armistice View Post
The puppy plan is actually really good. You pay less and I believe deworming meds are almost free if I recall AND you can deworm as much as you need to until worms are gone. However, it depends on what your vet gives in the package. You do save in the long run. What if you have to do 3 rounds of deworming at $35 a pop, well, now you're over the price of the puppy plan when you could've done the plan and saved on the meds

I'd say yes to the stool sample. Use that until you know your pup is free of bugs

Sorry if i missed it but what is the puppy plan you are referring to? thx!
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post #8 of 12 (permalink) Old 02-02-2018, 02:22 PM
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Oh, Mine was more, wow. I thought mine was $90

$130 for Puppy program. Puppy exams, 4-1 Vacc (#3-4 depending on age) [I don't know what the numbers mean] for Leptospira Bacterin and Coronavirus, rabies vacc, 2 stool samples (any more is full price), deworming meds, discount on sputer if done by 6mos

I guess in the end, for us, it may be a wash. Most people would save the heaps with the sputer bills, but we're waiting. At the time, we weren't too versed on fixing GSD's and made our decision to wait at a later time after we started the prog

Looking at average sputer prices are all over from $200 up over $500! Geez

In my defense, I thought the puppy plan was a good deal (brand new dog owners just trying to be good owners), but now looking back, it prob wasn't as good as I thought
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post #9 of 12 (permalink) Old 02-02-2018, 03:26 PM
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If that puppy plan was being pushed by Banfield or VCA, I would walk away. That's a common sales practice with them, and you can read about their corporate business model here:
https://www.bloomberg.com/news/featu...ns-to-your-pet

One way to find a great vet that is reasonable and gets good results is to ask your local breed rescue who they use -- they probably won't mind telling you, even if your puppy didn't come from them, as most of us love sending business to the people who've saved so many dogs' lives for us. You can also ask your local police K9 team which vet their dogs visit. Sometimes this method will reveal a special one that really enjoys the breed and knows its issues well.

I would also try to find a vet that follows the AAHA vaccination guidelines. Not all do, but they're the gold standard: evidence-based, peer-reviewed, and updated periodically as new information comes to light. They're fairly conservative (eventually getting adult dogs on a 3-year booster schedule, avoiding annual vaccines), and based on well documented effectiveness, not clinic profits.

Instead of a "puppy plan" for shots and deworming, I would put that money into a good pet insurance plan from a company like Healthy Paws or Trupanion that covers emergency, big-ticket bills. You can cover the small stuff like shots and let the insurance company handle the multi-thousand dollar bills, in case of a bad accident or illness.

Paying $90 per month (!) for a few rounds of dewormer and a few shots kind of seems like a rip-off to me anyway. Three puppy-sized doses of Pancur liquid probably costs the vet well under $5 -- maybe even $2 -- for deworming. Even if you don't want to fool with the cheap liquid, you can buy the convenient little packets of granules like these OTC -- even the highest dose packet is around $12 for 3 doses (for a 40# dog):
https://www.valleyvet.com/ct_detail....nacur%20canine

Last edited by Magwart; 02-02-2018 at 03:32 PM.
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post #10 of 12 (permalink) Old 02-02-2018, 03:45 PM
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Originally Posted by Armistice View Post
Looking at average sputer prices are all over from $200 up over $500! Geez
Paying $500 for an uncomplicated neuter is madness...even at California prices. If there's a retained testicle that they have to open the dog up and hunt for, sure -- but otherwise it's a super-quick surgery on males.

Here's an example of high-volume speuter clinic pricing in your general region (inland empire): Spay/Neuter Prices » Ontario Spay and Neuter (there are probably dozens of these kinds of places in So Cal).
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