Reversible sedation? (Non GSD) - German Shepherd Dog Forums
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post #1 of 24 (permalink) Old 04-27-2010, 10:23 AM Thread Starter
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Reversible sedation? (Non GSD)

I took Riley for a vet visit a couple weeks ago and thought we'd try to get his nails clipped while we were there. (He has serious issues with nail trimming.) There were three of us - the vet, a tech and myself - and we couldn't do it. He went into a total panic and was so stressed that we decided not to push it. She suggested making another appointment and we'd do a reversible sedation; knock him out, clip his nails and wake him up.
My hands were a little too full at the time and I didn't think to ask exactly what she planned to use, but I'm guessing (from what some other people have told me) that it would probably be Domitor.

Do any of you know anything, or have any experience with this? I'm really hesitant to do it. I don't like the idea of sedating him unless it's an absolute LAST resort.

And what REALLY put me off is the fact that she didn't mention doing any bloodwork prior to the sedation. Riley's never had a full blood workup and sure, he appears to be healthy, but how can you know for sure without running the bloodwork?
Would that be as risky and irresponsible as it seems to me? Or am I being paranoid and overly-cautious?

I called another vet to see if his nail issues are something they'd be willing to deal with and the woman I spoke to said that if a vet suggested sedation without bloodwork, she'd run like he[ck]. She said they do not do that and would be more than happy to give his nails a try and see if they can get them done. She wants me to bring him in, as many times as I possibly can, before the actual appointment and wants me to bring some hot dog or chicken or something with me. She wants him to see the exam room, meet the vet, get all kinds of attention and great treats, and then leave. They'd like to start building a foundation with him before they actually DO anything. (Not sure that will help with Riley, but I figure it certainly can't hurt.)

I'm really leaning towards trying this approach first. The more I think about it, the more my gut is telling me to avoid the sedation. It's also telling me that I just lost faith in my current vet.

What would you think about it?

Deni
Owned by:
Gunner - GSD - 7 years
Riley - Golden Retriever - 2 1/2 years
Jake - (aka Demon kitty) Gray & white tabby
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post #2 of 24 (permalink) Old 04-27-2010, 10:29 AM
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I have seen domitor/antisedan used many times without trouble. But it still scares the bejesus out of me.
They are very quiet, shallow breathing...... just makes me nervous.
What about propofol if it is an absolute neccessity?

Best thing is to start working on touching paws, holding paws, holding a nail, etc. Very slowly work up to trimming one nail. Dremel might be another option as that does not pinch the nail, and virtually guarantees no quicking.
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post #3 of 24 (permalink) Old 04-27-2010, 11:08 AM Thread Starter
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I'll have to do some checking on the propofol - I'm not familiar with that, either. She did mention that she wants him completely unaware of what's going on, so something like Ace would be out.

It just concerns me that she wouldn't have suggested pre-sedation bloodwork.

We've been working on his nails here at home for about a year now. We work on it virtually every single day - might have missed a couple days during our move - but other than that, we've been diligent. We're making a little bit of progress, but not enough to have kept up with them and now they're long and really need a good trimming.
He's so afraid of it that, in all this time, we've only made a little progress. I can handle his feet, touch his nails... I can even trim the hair on his feet once in a while... but the minute he sees or feels clippers, look out!

I do want to try a dremel, but we need to make more progress with being able to trim the hair on his feet, first. He has those Golden "grinch feet" and I'm afraid that long hair might get wound up in the dremel.

Deni
Owned by:
Gunner - GSD - 7 years
Riley - Golden Retriever - 2 1/2 years
Jake - (aka Demon kitty) Gray & white tabby
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post #4 of 24 (permalink) Old 04-27-2010, 11:12 AM
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Do any of you know anything, or have any experience with this?
We have had to use it with my last dog for different things but I wouldn't feel comfortable using it to get his nails trimmed. Plus you would have to use it so often to keep them trimmed

What about Acepromazine, have you ever tried it?

Heidi wouldn't let anyone near her ears and we had to remove sutures after surgery and I didn't want her sedated all the time with the Domitor. Maybe you could ask the vet if that would be an option.

Acepromazine

Michaela

Olivia von Jagenstadt "Nikki" 11/21/2009


Heidi Mouse 02/10/1995 - 02/21/2009

Last edited by Heidigsd; 04-27-2010 at 11:13 AM. Reason: Never mind...just saw your post about the Ace
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post #5 of 24 (permalink) Old 04-27-2010, 11:23 AM Thread Starter
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We have had to use it with my last dog for different things but I wouldn't feel comfortable using it to get his nails trimmed. Plus you would have to use it so often to keep them trimmed

What about Acepromazine, have you ever tried it?

Heidi wouldn't let anyone near her ears and we had to remove sutures after surgery and I didn't want her sedated all the time with the Domitor. Maybe you could ask the vet if that would be an option.

Acepromazine

Michaela
I did ask her about Ace, because I know someone else who uses that for nail trimmings, and she said 'absolutely not.'

She said the problem with Ace is that it can actually make a dog more hyper-aware of what's happening, they just can't respond, physically. She feels that it could really backfire with Riley and mess him up even worse.

I just hate to think about how badly our previous vet techs must have hurt him to make him this terrified of having his nails done. (I can't let myself think about it, since there's nothing I can do that won't land me in jail.)

Deni
Owned by:
Gunner - GSD - 7 years
Riley - Golden Retriever - 2 1/2 years
Jake - (aka Demon kitty) Gray & white tabby
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post #6 of 24 (permalink) Old 04-27-2010, 11:49 AM
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Ace is like making them drunk.... and you never know if they will be a mean drunk or a funny one!
Few things as dangerous (and upsetting to the dog) as trying to hold down a mean, drunk, terrified, dog.

Propofol is an anesthetic, not sedative. They bounce back really well as long as they have body fat. Greyhounds etc. don't do as well if I remember correctly.
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post #7 of 24 (permalink) Old 04-27-2010, 12:06 PM
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I did ask her about Ace, because I know someone else who uses that for nail trimmings, and she said 'absolutely not.'
I posted about the Ace before I saw your post...sorry. I hope you can figure out a solution for your boy

Michaela

Olivia von Jagenstadt "Nikki" 11/21/2009


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post #8 of 24 (permalink) Old 04-27-2010, 12:15 PM
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I had Gianna sedated to get her rear shaved when we were trying to get rid of her horrible hotspots. I stayed with her the entire time. They came in and gave her a shot, I asked how long it takes to take effect, and they said "not long". I pet her and talked soothingly to her as she began to get drowsy. I helped her lay down and she closed her eyes. I continued petting her as the vet and tech shaved, cleaned, and doctored the hotpots. She breathed slow, jsut a little slower than when she sleeps, but not scarily so. After we were done, another shot was given and I pet her and talked to her as she woke up. She was a little out of it but able to walk out of there slowly.

I asked for her to be out during this procedure because of how traumatized she got at the vet before when we tried to shave the area without anything. It made brushing or even touchign her rear a anxious thing. I didn't want any more trauma associated with it. So anywho that is my experience. Only you can decide what you feel is right for your dog.

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post #9 of 24 (permalink) Old 04-27-2010, 12:38 PM Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by gsdlove212 View Post
I had Gianna sedated to get her rear shaved when we were trying to get rid of her horrible hotspots. I stayed with her the entire time. They came in and gave her a shot, I asked how long it takes to take effect, and they said "not long". I pet her and talked soothingly to her as she began to get drowsy. I helped her lay down and she closed her eyes. I continued petting her as the vet and tech shaved, cleaned, and doctored the hotpots. She breathed slow, jsut a little slower than when she sleeps, but not scarily so. After we were done, another shot was given and I pet her and talked to her as she woke up. She was a little out of it but able to walk out of there slowly.

I asked for her to be out during this procedure because of how traumatized she got at the vet before when we tried to shave the area without anything. It made brushing or even touchign her rear a anxious thing. I didn't want any more trauma associated with it. So anywho that is my experience. Only you can decide what you feel is right for your dog.
I do like the fact that it would just completely remove the stress for him. He really panics and I just hate to see him going through that.

Did they do bloodwork ahead of time, or did they just do the sedation without it?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Heidigsd
I hope you can figure out a solution for your boy
Yeah, me too! I wish he'd just get over it and stop being such a neurotic little nutball, but I don't see that happening.

Deni
Owned by:
Gunner - GSD - 7 years
Riley - Golden Retriever - 2 1/2 years
Jake - (aka Demon kitty) Gray & white tabby
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post #10 of 24 (permalink) Old 04-27-2010, 01:17 PM
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I am just know starting to try to dremel Dakota nails... they need it bad. But so far I am getting him comfortable with everything and clicking and treats for small stuff like me touching the turned off dremel to his nails, adn me holding his toes....so far so good. Natalie, on the board gave me a link to a website that tell you step by step how to introduce it and how to actually dremel. She has dobbies, but I know she shaid for dogs with long hair, to use stocking with a little hole for the nail to poke out of....that way the nail is isolated and your pup is beautiful. lol

-Kira

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Dakota "Koda" GSD 02/20/2008
Chloe Calico 9/21/2007

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