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Old 12-09-2012, 09:42 PM   #91 (permalink)
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I've been pushed into the world of dog training out of necessity. Our Jake is a hellion on wheels because I let my husband follow the 'alpha' and 'dominance' type training with him even though I never liked it.
Can you be a bit more specific please? I'm not sure what it means to "follow the 'alpha' and 'dominance' type training" Can you tell us the specific method being used?
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Old 12-10-2012, 02:21 AM   #92 (permalink)
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She probably just wants a belly rub

It's amazing to see how far behind America is with dog behaviour compared to the UK.

How is that again?
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Old 05-03-2014, 03:21 PM   #93 (permalink)
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This topic is WRONG. Do not try to establish dominance over your dog. Instead, establish a wonderful bond with him or her. He or she will learn to trust you. You must set limits on his or her behavior for the dog's own good. But don't be an ARSE who thinks that a primate with tools and command over all of the resources must establish dominance over his dog. Anyone who suggests as much to you doesn't understand dogs, or wolves, or what makes for a good, lasting bond between a person and a dog, and the last thing you would want to do is rely on such a person for any guidance about how to teach your dog.
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Old 05-03-2014, 07:17 PM   #94 (permalink)
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This topic is WRONG. Do not try to establish dominance over your dog. Instead, establish a wonderful bond with him or her. He or she will learn to trust you. You must set limits on his or her behavior for the dog's own good. But don't be an ARSE who thinks that a primate with tools and command over all of the resources must establish dominance over his dog. Anyone who suggests as much to you doesn't understand dogs, or wolves, or what makes for a good, lasting bond between a person and a dog, and the last thing you would want to do is rely on such a person for any guidance about how to teach your dog.
Wondering Zola22, did you read anything beyond the title of the thread? The article is about, as you say, establishing "a good lasting bond between a person and a dog."
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Old 05-03-2014, 07:20 PM   #95 (permalink)
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Topics aren't wrong, they are worth discussing or not worth discussing. This one is pretty old though. And yet, probably worth discussing again.
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Old 05-03-2014, 08:20 PM   #96 (permalink)
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Experts have definitively concluded that our old assumptions about wolf behavior are erroneously drawn from the observation of WOLVES IN CAPTIVITY, who, in this unnatural state, exhibit exaggerated displays of dominance and submission. But wolves in nature exist in extraordinarily loyal family groups: The father and mother remain together until one or the other dies. They have cubs and care together for the cubs. When one generation grows up, they help their parents to care for the next generation of cubs. They do not eat before the cubs. On the contrary, the father (and the mother if she can, and the older cubs) come back to the den and regurgitate their food so that the youngest can eat, and they eat first. The young always remain loyal and defer to their parents, even when the parents enter their declining years. They are extraordinarily loyal and devoted family units. That is how wolves in the wild actually behave. It is a fact, confirmed by observation.

Dogs are like this too, except that they have literally learned to regard their human caretaker as their adoptive PARENT, even though they recognize that this adoptive PARENT belongs to a different species, a distinctly primate species.

Dogs, like wolves, thrive in loyal families that look after one another. They always regard their caretaker as a parent.

Just as a good parent will not spoil his or her children but rather will give them the structure, guidance and sometimes the discipline that a child requires in order to be raised well, so too a good adoptive parent will treat his or her dog this way.

The biggest difference is that dogs require INSTANTANEOUS instruction: You cannot tell a dog what he did in the past that was wrong, or what you want him to do the next time around. You have to catch him in the act and say, NO. More important, you have to catch him in the act of doing the right thing and reward him in that very moment with "YES," "GOOD BOY", etc. Eventually your dog will learn what you want him to do, and if he loves and trusts you he will do it. In the meantime do not let him practice bad habits.
And for God's sake do not develop fantasies about how you must dominate him or else he will dominate you.

This is all pretty well established now. It's a pity so many people still follow discredited theories about dominance and submission. It doesn't usually work, it leads to terrified, unhappy dogs, and it ruins the kind of bond that you should WANT to have with your dog!

I can confirm the above not only from what I have learned from learned books, but above all from what I have observed in my own dogs!
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Old 05-03-2014, 08:38 PM   #97 (permalink)
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Wondering Zola22, did you read anything beyond the title of the thread? The article is about, as you say, establishing "a good lasting bond between a person and a dog."
So I log on to see if I can delete my account and find this thread, which I have read in it's entirety. Avid Lou Castle follower, even if the e collar didn't work. I agree with the theory and the methods. Since I have a fluid, multi dog household and a severely problematic mess of a dog besides, I use most of these methods daily and without ever thinking about it and all things considered I have a relatively peaceful house. I'm going to guess and say it's working well.
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Old 05-03-2014, 09:28 PM   #98 (permalink)
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Experts have definitively concluded that our old assumptions about wolf behavior are erroneously drawn from the observation of WOLVES IN CAPTIVITY, who, in this unnatural state, exhibit exaggerated displays of dominance and submission.

Zolla22 might I suggest that you actually read the article instead of assuming what it says? You might be surprised.
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Old 05-03-2014, 09:29 PM   #99 (permalink)
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So I log on to see if I can delete my account and find this thread, which I have read in it's entirety. Avid Lou Castle follower, even if the e collar didn't work. I agree with the theory and the methods.
Thanks for the vote Sabis mom. I've never had anyone who didn't succeed with the Ecollar if they were following my methods. I've had a few who had problems and I discovered that they weren't following the protocols correctly. Feel free to contact me privately or better yet, send me an email. Happy to help if you're interested.
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