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-   -   Seems shut down on promg (http://www.germanshepherds.com/forum/training-theory-methods/435665-seems-shut-down-promg.html)

Sri 04-09-2014 04:42 AM

Seems shut down on promg
 
Hi everyone
Last night I decided to add the prong for general obedience work. I have not needed to use this till now in class or at home, but there are times when his response is not prompt, and i wanted to correct for this.

Anyway his response was unenthusiastic, i could not get him to look at me either sitting in front or walking next to me. Whereas he was always enthusiastic and happy while maintaining eye contact for several steps. He also started to itch often and I released him when this itching got very bad.


I am not sure how to proceed from here. He is 13 months old, btw. I do use the prong on walks. Any advice?



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Sri 04-09-2014 05:15 AM

I should clarify that I have used it on walks and have no problem with engagement. He will look up at me often when walking next to me and will maintain eye contact for several steps, slow or fast.

Also i do use a lot play element while walking to keep him engaged. I release him to go sniff or give him the whole length of leash once in a while. Is this okay? Or should I expect him to stay close to me without all the play?




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David Winners 04-09-2014 06:54 AM

Could you post some video?

Sri 04-09-2014 06:55 AM

Will try.


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Baillif 04-09-2014 07:17 AM

The itchy thing is normal. You will see less and less of it as time goes by. The unenthusiastic thing happens too with some dogs at first. When you first start to layer prong pressure they're like dude this sucks and are confused. To a certain degree you can make it better by teaching them to give in easily to pressure by marking it and rewarding when they give in like in those Michael Ellis YouTube videos.

You might also try bringing them up with your own enthusiasm.

My personal favorite though is to use retrieve play. Prey activity blows stress off a dog really quickly. Ask for 2-3 behaviors and when you get them mark and reward with retrieves. So for example teaching sits. Say sit, quickly give upward leash pressure, dog sits, say free excitedly while moving the dog out of the position so you can reset. Repeat sit command and start all over one more time. At the end of the third sit instead of saying free mark with a yes, then pull the retrieve toy out of a pocket throw it and drop the leash and let the pup have a retrieve or two.

If your dog doesn't know retrieves yet I'd work on that first and build value for it so that you could use it as a tool, as well as just a game you can play with the dog in general.

Bobby25104 04-09-2014 07:26 AM

Persistence is the key with prong collars. Some dogs take differently to the use of them. I haven seen dogs start negative to the use of them but with persistent training they get used to them as a tool and progress nicely. Also when the dog does well with out little correction lots of praise. I have been using a prong collar for 3 months now on my 10 month gsd. Every day I take a half hour to work with him on obedience. Than after that if he performs well he gets to play with his favorite toy.

Baillif 04-09-2014 07:29 AM

Right the other thing is to stick with it. Even without rewards if you stick to your guns and just used praise within 2-3 days of training they learn to escape pressure and that makes them happy by itself.

jafo220 04-09-2014 07:47 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sri (Post 5348129)
Hi everyone
Last night I decided to add the prong for general obedience work. I have not needed to use this till now in class or at home, but there are times when his response is not prompt, and i wanted to correct for this.

Anyway his response was unenthusiastic, i could not get him to look at me either sitting in front or walking next to me. Whereas he was always enthusiastic and happy while maintaining eye contact for several steps. He also started to itch often and I released him when this itching got very bad.


I am not sure how to proceed from here. He is 13 months old, btw. I do use the prong on walks. Any advice?



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I just started with Cruz on a prong. He is highly dog reactive. He just turned 15 months. He has shown much the same reactions. He also does a little itching also. Nothing severe.

The difference with yours to mine is I've noticed he has developed a threshold point he has with the prong. Nothing extreme. He will go to a point out on lead as far as his pain tolerance will allow and back off on his own. He also gets plenty of praise when he heels correctly. No treating. The best thing is he no longer pulls and he, like yours makes good eye contact. We do abrupt turn arounds to keep him paying attention too.

I don't allow any sniffing. But thats me. I look at that as a beginning of him taking over on a walk. So for me, not letting him sniff, keeps me in control of the walk. But again, thats my personal opinion, not advice.

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Sri 04-09-2014 12:14 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by David Winners (Post 5348225)
Could you post some video?


I'm having trouble with training and videoing at the same. Will ask a friend to video me. ...

MaggieRoseLee 04-09-2014 02:47 PM

Since you don't want to ruin all the great work you've done to get his enthusiasm and happiness going for obedience... I'd hold off on using the prong until you find a good trainer to use it in conjunction with.


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