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-   -   How did you teach your dog "NO" or "Stop that!"Basically to quit the current behavior (http://www.germanshepherds.com/forum/training-theory-methods/380113-how-did-you-teach-your-dog-no-stop-basically-quit-current-behavior.html)

VTGirlT 12-11-2013 10:57 PM

How did you teach your dog "NO" or "Stop that!"Basically to quit the current behavior
 
How did you guys teach your dog "No" or "stop that!" or whatever you used to let your dog to stop the current behavior?

It seems like the most essential thing a dog should know. And Zelda knows it sometimes like for when her nose is on the counter and i say "no" she will stop, or if she is reaching on the table to grab something she will usually listen to me when i say "no".

But for example, when Zelda is being mouthy, such as when i am brushing her or clipping her nails.. redirection use to work with an antler, but she continuously mouths the clipper or brush and my hands, arm, upper arm. And puts quite a bit of pressure, but doesn't leave marks so clearly she has good bite inhibition. But i still do not appreciate it and don't know how to make it clear to her that i do not want her teeth on me.

She also does those "mouth hugs" when she is super excited like when people come home. I have asked people to put their hands up and not give her attention when she does this. Which does not seem to be helping. And neither does asking her to sit. She is just so amped and truly believes in her "mouth hugs" (love that term!)

Also when she is frustrated she snaps the air or will mouth me. (which i stated before)
I usually ignore it or redirect her to a toy if that isnt working, or to put that energy into playing tug. Which helps in the moment, but she still does it later..

So Zelda is a mouthy girl.. She is the first GSD i have ever owned or have lived with. So perhaps it is partially that i am not use to this behavior? Is this something i should just get over, that Zelda is mouthy? (i know i have posted sometimes on here about it, it just seems to be a whole different situation or level everytime)

I just have always had dogs (Family, friends, shelter) know what "no" means, like i didn't have to teach it to them directly, obviously i did indirectly (or the owners), its almost they knew by the tone and energy i had. But Zelda either doesn't respect it or doesn't get it when i say "no"? Or both?

*I also wanted to say that i am doing an attempt at NILIF and she gets the exercise that her hips can take. She works for everything. I stopped the on leash in house because that seemed to get her more worked up. She counter surfs a lot less and i have bought a trash can that is pet proof, yay! In general she listens to me.. i tell her kennel and she goes in, she sits, waits, down, up, looks, shakes, over there for me, etc. (Oh and i want to add, sometimes like when i am holding her dinner and tell her to sit and wait she will complain about it with whines and rooing,etc. she still does what i ask just with verbal complaining) but the "no" is what we clearly need to work on!!

Packen 12-11-2013 11:24 PM

Best to teach and proof an easier command than NO. This way when there is time to say NO, you give the known command like "down" or "sit" or "kennel" or "place" or "focus" or "heel" etc etc.

What I mean to say is that it is waay easier to teach what the dog can do versus what the dog cannot do.

Merciel 12-12-2013 01:03 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Packen (Post 4659249)
What I mean to say is that it is waay easier to teach what the dog can do versus what the dog cannot do.

yep

Figure out what you do want her to do and then mark/reinforce that.

For example, for nail clipping, you might teach her to give you one paw at a time and stand still until you're done. My dogs do this for foot wiping when they come in from walks (I have not taught them to do it for nail clipping because I take them to the groomer for that -- I'm just a wimp about clipping Pongu's nails because they're solid black and I don't want to quick him -- but the same principles should apply).

With mouthing, I will give a verbal "NO," sometimes accompanied by me withdrawing all attention and interaction, depending on the severity of the transgression. Other times I'll lean forward a little to crowd into their space, which gets them to back off (and usually sit).

If my dogs were still puppies then I'd redirect them to approved bitey objects, but they're not so I don't. I think that varies by dog, though. Some dogs might benefit from being redirected. Mine don't seem to have any interest in it so I don't do that with them.

Mts678 12-12-2013 01:10 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Merciel (Post 4659513)
yep

Figure out what you do want her to do and then mark/reinforce that.

For example, for nail clipping, you might teach her to give you one paw at a time and stand still until you're done. My dogs do this for foot wiping when they come in from walks (I have not taught them to do it for nail clipping because I take them to the groomer for that -- I'm just a wimp about clipping Pongu's nails because they're solid black and I don't want to quick him -- but the same principles should apply).

With mouthing, I will give a verbal "NO," sometimes accompanied by me withdrawing all attention and interaction, depending on the severity of the transgression. Other times I'll lean forward a little to crowd into their space, which gets them to back off (and usually sit).

If my dogs were still puppies then I'd redirect them to approved bitey objects, but they're not so I don't. I think that varies by dog, though. Some dogs might benefit from being redirected. Mine don't seem to have any interest in it so I don't do that with them.

I'd love for my girl to hand me her paws for foot wiping. She just gets super mouthy when it's paw wiping time! So difficult!


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David Winners 12-12-2013 03:04 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mts678 (Post 4659537)
I'd love for my girl to hand me her paws for foot wiping. She just gets super mouthy when it's paw wiping time! So difficult!


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David Winners

MadLab 12-12-2013 08:05 AM

Quote:

Best to teach and proof an easier command than NO. This way when there is time to say NO, you give the known command like "down" or "sit" or "kennel" or "place" or "focus" or "heel" etc etc.
So what's the correction if the dog doesn't comply with your wishes??

Quote:

For example, for nail clipping, you might teach her to give you one paw at a time and stand still until you're done.
Getting a dog to give the paw for nail clipping would be an achievement.

I would think this is more stressful as the dog can escape easier or resist. Fact is dogs don't like their nails cut.

What I do is teach the dogs to be on their sides and have them used to being turned over and inspected and treated if necessary and have ears cleaned and nails cut. This can be different with different dogs. Some will resist and need to be introduced to it slowly.

To get a dog used to having nails cut I will start by rubbing the dogs nails and then scratch them a bit and stretch the foot and leg so over time it becomes desensitized to touch there. Also have the clipper noise as that can also shock the dog. Same with a hair clippers or a scissors for cutting hair.

Quote:

But Zelda either doesn't respect it or doesn't get it when i say "no"? Or both?
If a dog doesn't know what no means I will hold it by the chin and give it a slap on the nose and say no. It is crude but it works. I will use this if a dog is intent on biting something after I say off. I wouldn't redirect behavior if the dog was biting me as this is like a reward for that behavior. When the dog got used to offing then I would reward.

In your case you can stop nurturing excitement and nurture calmness. The dog biting is excited behavior. So through body language and slowing everything down you can stop it.

My girl Bullmastiff mix was always biting my other dog lab mix on the neck and pinning him to the floor. She also liked to chase swans. I developed the Irish e collar for this and simply threw a stone at her rump. Fact was she was off leash and knew I couldn't catch her so the stone bridged the gap.

Merciel 12-12-2013 09:29 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MadLab (Post 4660001)
Getting a dog to give the paw for nail clipping would be an achievement.

Actually it turns out that it took one repetition/about 20 seconds. I asked Crookytail to do it just now, mostly to see whether I could, and he did it. Wiggled a little after each clip but didn't actually move any of his feet.

I used a lot of treats because I was asking for something new and harder than what he's used to, but the basic behavior was identical (give me your foot, don't move it until I say so) and he's a fairly placid dog, so it was literally first try and we're done.

I am not saying these results will be immediately duplicable -- for one, Crooky already has a long history (about two years) of doing the "lift your foot for wiping" variant -- but it wasn't nearly as difficult as I thought it might be.

I know there are a couple of other trainers who have taught their dogs to file their own nails by scratching against sandpaper mounted on a slanted platform, and a lot of other trainers who have taught both the foot lift and the lie-on-your-side for nail clipping, so there are lots of viable alternative ways of handling this. Pick the one that you like best and works for your dog. :)

lyssa62 12-12-2013 10:34 AM

for the land sharking...I nipped that in the bud from the get-go with a can of pet corrector. Now all I have to do is say "No-bite" and she gives a kiss.

the counter I use a firm "OFF". ( this one has been the hardest cuz she NEEDS to see what is on the counter and approve it. )

Blanketback 12-12-2013 10:35 AM

Everything Zelda is doing (air snaps, mouthing, etc.) is all communication, hopefully communicating in such a way that you can understand what she's trying to say. You're on the right track - you know the frustrated air snaps mean she needs to get out and burn off energy, you know the mouth hug mean she's excited...etc. Now you just have to channel that into a language that you both can understand.

"No" is something that I use with a new dog/puppy right away - I know some people don't use it, but that's what's right for them, not me. Some things I never have to use the word for, because some things are just too much of a risk and I manage the situation instead, like rifling through the garbage. I NEVER leave anything in the garbage that I'd regret my dogs swallowing - so any cooked bones are always put in the freezer until garbage day. This makes the garbage can pretty unappealing. My puppy did show an interest in it when he was very young, so I got in the habit of pouring vinegar onto the garbage when I used it....problem solved. It's lidded too, so that helps.

"No" in my home is combined with physical removal of whatever it is I'm trying to stop - I'm not a chin smacker, and I disagree with that advice - but I will body block (say, for counters) or push the dog away from something (plant chewing, pestering other pets) and after my dog knows what "no" means, I use a different word to let the dog know they're actually being disobedient. So I'm not constantly saying "no" and the dog doesn't tune me out.

I think you should reconsider the leash in the house, because that's the easiest way of communicating to cease whatever she's doing, to draw her away from her target. But I wouldn't use the walking leash, since it excites her. Get a cheapo dollar store one and it will work just fine.

Packen 12-12-2013 09:01 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MadLab (Post 4660001)
So what's the correction if the dog doesn't comply with your wishes??

That depends on what your training plan is for that particular dog and how well he understands the exercise. The correction could be as simple as withholding the reward or as complex as NEPOPO.


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