Clicker Training? - German Shepherd Dog Forums

Increase font size: 0, 10, 25, 50%

GermanShepherds.com is the premier German Shepherd Forum on the internet. Registered Users do not see the above ads.
Reply
 
LinkBack Thread Tools
Old 06-13-2013, 08:25 PM   #1 (permalink)
Master Member
 
VTGirlT's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2013
Location: USA
Posts: 863
Default Clicker Training?

Clicker training is something that i am on the fence about.

I want my dog to listen to me no matter what, whether or not i have a treat.

People tell me how great clicker training is, how you can eventaully wean them off the treats and how its a great tool for obediance.
I have also heard that it should only be used for tricks because obediance is so important they really need to be trained without clicker and treats because of safety.

That being said, I have started clicker training. Loading the clicker with treats, I ask her to something she does it i click and treat. She already learned sit, lay down, up( almost!) without the clicker training. But i do have a feeling that stay and leave it will be best if there is more insentive besides my praise. (I wish my praise were enough!)

Do you guys believe in clicker training? why or why not? Are their benefits or maybe disadvantages?
__________________
Mom of: "Zelda"
Born: December 15, 2012
In my Care: May 01, 2013
VTGirlT is offline   Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
Old 06-13-2013, 08:55 PM   #2 (permalink)
Knighted Member
 
wolfy dog's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2012
Location: USA
Posts: 3,019
Default

You need to study how it works or else you'll be clickering and treating for years. This book is a must to do that: on't Shoot the Dog" from Karen Pryor. I would read it before you work with this method.
The dogs I taught by clickering have been the most obedient ones and happily too.
wolfy dog is offline   Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 06-13-2013, 09:03 PM   #3 (permalink)
Knighted Member
 
dogfaeries's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2010
Location: Moore, OK
Posts: 2,072
Default

I love clicker training. All my Italian Greyhounds and Dobermans were trained using a clicker. As a matter of fact, I am starting this weekend to train Carly in obedience, using a clicker.

I don't know why anyone would think a dog wouldn't be "safe" if it is trained using operant conditioning, and that it is only good for tricks. All the regular things that we teach dogs (sit, down, come, etc) are really just tricks to them.

I'm not sure why everyone thinks you have to have a treat, after a dog really knows a command. Treats are for training. After my dogs know commands, I occasionally treat them, or give them praise or a toy when I ask them to do something. It's just a way to continue reinforcing their behavior.

(and my dogs DO listen to me, whether I have a treat or not)
__________________
~ Diane in Okla

Carly ~ AKC Champion, GCh pointed, HIC
Sage ~ AKC Ch. pointed (13 pts - chasing that last major), HIC
Russell ~ the big boy
Mimi & Pi ~ the meezers
dogfaeries is offline   Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 06-13-2013, 09:26 PM   #4 (permalink)
Elite Member
 
gsdlover91's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2012
Location: Chicago, IL
Posts: 1,809
Default

I love clicker training. Really helps the dog know he did something right the *instant* he does it. That being said, I only use the clicker now when shaping something new. Once he gets it, I wean him off of the clicker and move to something else. I trained a lot of his basic obedience with the clicker (i.e. sit, down, stay, watch me). He no longer needs a 'click' for those, or even a treat or anything. I do occasionally praise him, or reward him with food or play but he has those commands down.
__________________
SG Valco "Berlin" vom Hokschhaus - CGCA, BA1, UNJ, HIC, TC

Rogue "Tesla" von Huerta Hof
gsdlover91 is offline   Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 06-13-2013, 09:33 PM   #5 (permalink)
No Stinkin' Leashes Moderator
 
Cassidy's Mom's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2003
Location: SF Bay Area
Posts: 29,290
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by VTGirlT View Post
Clicker training is something that i am on the fence about.

I want my dog to listen to me no matter what, whether or not i have a treat.
Of course, everybody does. But that doesn't mean that you won't have that if you use food rewards, with or without a clicker. That's probably the biggest and most enduring misconception about training with food, that you always have to have food handy or your dog won't obey, and that you'll always need a clicker on you if you clicker train or your dog won't obey.

The key word is "training". Behaviors that are trained and fully generalized do not need to be constantly rewarded for ever and ever.

There have been lots of previous clicker training threads that addressed all of your questions and more. I'll try to look some up for you later and post links here.
Cassidy's Mom is offline   Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 06-13-2013, 11:36 PM   #6 (permalink)
Elite Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2013
Posts: 1,147
Default

The food or click comes after they do what you asked, so they do perform without food. Just they may wonder why no treat that time until weaned off them.
volcano is offline   Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 06-13-2013, 11:49 PM   #7 (permalink)
Crowned Member
 
GatorDog's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2011
Location: NY
Posts: 3,911
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Cassidy's Mom View Post
Of course, everybody does. But that doesn't mean that you won't have that if you use food rewards, with or without a clicker. That's probably the biggest and most enduring misconception about training with food, that you always have to have food handy or your dog won't obey, and that you'll always need a clicker on you if you clicker train or your dog won't obey.

The key word is "training". Behaviors that are trained and fully generalized do not need to be constantly rewarded for ever and ever.


There have been lots of previous clicker training threads that addressed all of your questions and more. I'll try to look some up for you later and post links here.
This!!!
__________________
-Alexis
Aiden vom HausDaka - IPO3x2, FH, CGC, TT
Carma vom Oz Haus - IPO2, CD
GatorDog is offline   Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 06-14-2013, 12:59 AM   #8 (permalink)
Senior Member
 
RowdyDogs's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2012
Location: Albuquerque, NM
Posts: 458
Default

Read everything you can by Karen Pryor. "Don't Shoot the Dog" is a great text, as wolfy dog said.

Clicker training when done properly should NOT make a dog dependent on treats. Quite the opposite, in fact! The clicker itself should also only be used in the early stages of training a new behavior (basically, until the dog understands what you're asking for).

You do need to know what you're doing, though. Clicker training is not complicated, but it is easy to mess up, if that makes any sense. The biggest problems I see people having are 1)bad timing (reinforcing the wrong behavior; this also applies to any training though); 2)not understanding how to phase out the clicker and food rewards and so the dog becomes dependent on them.

If you understand what you're doing, though, I think clicker training is by far the most effective method for training reliable basic obedience. This includes things like recall--I often get compliments on the great recalls my dogs have (even being called off of things like chasing deer or rabbits, or going after other dogs), and I just trained it with a clicker and positive reinforcement.
__________________
The rowdy dogs:
Hector-2 y/o GSD (mix?) rescue
Scooter-12 y/o ACD/Border Collie mix
Bandit-8 y/o ACD
Wooby-14 y/o ACD
Abutiu "Abi"-ACD puppy and hopeful future SAR dog!
RowdyDogs is offline   Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 06-14-2013, 11:58 AM   #9 (permalink)
Knighted Member
 
wolfy dog's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2012
Location: USA
Posts: 3,019
Default

By the way, you can train any animal that has some form of brain with a clicker. I clicker trained my rats. One actually took the clicker to her nest as a possible treat dispenser.
Check out this video:
wolfy dog is offline   Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 06-14-2013, 02:02 PM   #10 (permalink)
Master Member
 
VTGirlT's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2013
Location: USA
Posts: 863
Default

I looked up that book on amazon and will be buying it Wolfy Dog and RowdyDogs! It had good reviews and perhaps it will help me master the art of clicker training!

And Wolfy Dog that is an amazing video!! Good job to you and your mouse!

Thanks for the replies guys!
__________________
Mom of: "Zelda"
Born: December 15, 2012
In my Care: May 01, 2013
VTGirlT is offline   Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
Reply

Quick Reply
Message:
Options

Register Now

In order to be able to post messages on the German Shepherd Dog Forums forums, you must first register.
Please enter your desired user name, your email address and other required details in the form below.
User Name:
Password
Please enter a password for your user account. Note that passwords are case-sensitive.
Password:
Confirm Password:
Email Address
Please enter a valid email address for yourself.
Email Address:

Log-in

Human Verification

In order to verify that you are a human and not a spam bot, please enter the answer into the following box below based on the instructions contained in the graphic.



Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may post new threads
You may post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are On



All times are GMT -4. The time now is 12:34 PM.



Powered by vBulletin® Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
SEO by vBSEO 3.3.2
PetGuide.com
Basset Hound Forum Doberman Forum Golden Retriever Forum Beagle Forum
Boxer Forum Dog Forum Pit Bull Forum Poodle Forum
Bulldog Forum Fish Forum Havanese Forum Maltese Forum
Cat Forum German Shepherd Forum Labradoodle Forum Yorkie Forum Hedgehog Forum
Chihuahua Forum Retriever Breeds Cichlid Forum Dart Frog Forum Mice Breeder Forum