Afraid of Training? - Page 4 - German Shepherd Dog Forums

Increase font size: 0, 10, 25, 50%

GermanShepherds.com is the premier German Shepherd Forum on the internet. Registered Users do not see the above ads.
Reply
 
LinkBack Thread Tools
Old 12-22-2012, 09:24 PM   #31 (permalink)
Master Member
 
frillint1's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2010
Posts: 837
Default

So, we just did a short clicker training session. I pretty much clicked for everything him sitting, laying down, pawing my leg, eye contact. I would just toss a treat no click to get him to stand then as he walked towards me I clicked and treated. He then did a play bow on his own and i clicked and treated for as long as he stayed then i tossed a treat no click then he turned around did the bow again on his own and I kept clicking and treating then I quit and he was still in the bow position then stood up and he was staring at me like why did you stop. I put the clicker and stuff away and he just kept looking at me.That was the first time in a LONG while that we did a session without him getting scared! I think I may have been making them to long in the past. What we just did was probably a minute at most. I guess I will have to do that more frequently!!!

I have a question though. Can I still praise him even though the clicker is the marker for yes you sometime good a treat is on the way. I feel silly just clicking and treating and not talking
__________________
R.I.P- Smokey my GSD/Husky. You are my hero, my heart, my soul and you will forever remain in my heart. You were a true companion. I love You and miss You so much. Run like the wind!!

Chief-GSD

Last edited by frillint1; 12-22-2012 at 09:31 PM.
frillint1 is offline   Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
Old 12-24-2012, 09:41 PM   #32 (permalink)
Senior Member
 
RowdyDogs's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2012
Location: Albuquerque, NM
Posts: 458
Default

Good for you! It sounds like clicker training will really help.

Absolutely still praise him when you use the clicker! Just don't talk while you press the clicker, but you can praise him right after.

Remember, the clicker isn't a replacement for praise or other rewards. It's basically just a way of saying, "that is exactly what I want!" at the moment the dog does the behavior. The reward for the behavior is the same as if you weren't using the clicker.

Dogs live in the moment to a much greater extent than we do. When you take a second to praise/treat a behavior (which is impossible to avoid no matter how quick and good of a trainer you are), the dog has to figure out what you're rewarding. Let me give you an example with a very basic behavior, sit:

Without the clicker, you teach a dog to sit. His butt hits the floor, and you tell him he's good and give him a treat. Well, there's a lag of maybe half a second to a second there as you watch him sit (after all, you have to make sure he's actually doing what you want to reward--if he jumps right back up and you reward him then, you're rewarding him for standing) and process it and act. From your dog's perspective, you maybe rewarded him for the sit...but he's also looking at you, and maybe wagging his tail, and cocking his head, etc. You could be rewarding any one of those behaviors for all he knows. He has to think about it more and get it through several repetitions.

With the clicker, you click as soon as his butt hits the floor. It isn't a big deal if he doesn't stay there, because the click isn't a reward, it's a marker--when his butt hit the floor, you told him, "yes, that is what I want!" You can even still reward him, because he knows that the reward is associated with the click (if you've conditioned him right leading up to it). So things are a lot more clear to him.

Note that the reward is the same in either case; it's just that the clicker allows you to mark the specific behavior and be very clear to your dog about what you want.
__________________
The rowdy dogs:
Hector-2 y/o GSD (mix?) rescue
Scooter-12 y/o ACD/Border Collie mix
Bandit-8 y/o ACD
Wooby-14 y/o ACD
Abutiu "Abi"-ACD puppy and hopeful future SAR dog!

Last edited by RowdyDogs; 12-24-2012 at 09:43 PM.
RowdyDogs is offline   Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 12-29-2012, 04:03 PM   #33 (permalink)
Master Member
 
frillint1's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2010
Posts: 837
Default

I will certainly have to use it more often. I'm going to have to reorder that book apparently they didn't feel the need to let me know it was canceled right when I ordered it because they were out of stock. Sigh. Will have to find someone on there that actually has is then. Man I have been excited for a week for nothing lol
__________________
R.I.P- Smokey my GSD/Husky. You are my hero, my heart, my soul and you will forever remain in my heart. You were a true companion. I love You and miss You so much. Run like the wind!!

Chief-GSD
frillint1 is offline   Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 01-06-2013, 03:27 PM   #34 (permalink)
Master Member
 
frillint1's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2010
Posts: 837
Default

We were having some success, with clicker training I did it for 1 minutes, but I guess it was still to long just sitting on the floor not asking for any thing click treat click treat all the sudden he wouldn't take the treat then he crawled to my lap and just laid down. I reordered the book it should be here in a couple days

Today I wasn't doing training all I was doing was reaching for a treat to put inside the flaps of his everlasting treat ball which he loves and I reached for the bag in the cabinet and he cowered and went to the door shaking, so I ignored him and played with Smokey all high pitched voice playing with him on the ground on my back, but enticing Chief and he came over by himself all happy.
__________________
R.I.P- Smokey my GSD/Husky. You are my hero, my heart, my soul and you will forever remain in my heart. You were a true companion. I love You and miss You so much. Run like the wind!!

Chief-GSD
frillint1 is offline   Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 01-08-2013, 03:23 PM   #35 (permalink)
Master Member
 
frillint1's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2010
Posts: 837
Default

How can I get Chief to lay down and stay while I eat. He is so enticed by the smell he comes right up to me and sniffs right by my plate. I say go lay down and he will look at me and streach his neck out farther to get to it. The only way he will lay down is if i raise my voice a bit to get him to go. I don't want to have to raise my voice and scare him as he is scared to train and I don't want to scare him at all. How can I use positive reinforcement to not beg. I don't want to have to lock him out of the room and be away from the family.
__________________
R.I.P- Smokey my GSD/Husky. You are my hero, my heart, my soul and you will forever remain in my heart. You were a true companion. I love You and miss You so much. Run like the wind!!

Chief-GSD
frillint1 is offline   Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 01-08-2013, 04:21 PM   #36 (permalink)
Senior Member
 
RowdyDogs's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2012
Location: Albuquerque, NM
Posts: 458
Default

There are a couple of ways to do it depending on exactly what you want him to do. Basically, no matter what you're going to be teaching him a command, and then you eating is just a distraction. So if you want him to lay in a specific spot while you eat, get him really good at a down stay away from food, then put him in it and eat a snack (at first try to use ones that don't smell that amazing--crackers instead of a hot dog, for example ). If he gets up, just return him to his down stay. Start for short periods at first and gradually extend it to the length of meal times.

If you just want him to quit being pushy (which is what I like), I just teach a firm "leave it" command. My dogs might still be sitting near me, but I don't mind that as long as they're not sniffing at my food or staring at me.

If you've already taught him a "go lay down" command and he just ignores it when you eat, I'd just back up a bit and strengthen that in less distracting situations, then practice it during short, boring snacks (sit down with a couple of crackers, for example), and gradually increase from there. If you haven't taught a strong "go lay down," then that's probably most of your problem.

Basically, try to change your way of thinking from, "How do I stop him from doing this?" to "What do I want him to do instead?" and teach the latter. Dogs learn better when they're given firm guidelines of what to do, rather than having to try to figure it out for themselves and getting corrected for making mistakes.
__________________
The rowdy dogs:
Hector-2 y/o GSD (mix?) rescue
Scooter-12 y/o ACD/Border Collie mix
Bandit-8 y/o ACD
Wooby-14 y/o ACD
Abutiu "Abi"-ACD puppy and hopeful future SAR dog!

Last edited by RowdyDogs; 01-08-2013 at 04:24 PM.
RowdyDogs is offline   Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 01-08-2013, 05:44 PM   #37 (permalink)
Master Member
 
frillint1's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2010
Posts: 837
Default

Hes not really firm at anything since I cant train to our full extent. I don't care where he lays I just want him to lay away from me like you. Today I took him outside and tried to do a little training since he always gets scared inside I thought I would try outside even thought its highly distracting for him. I got a hoola-hoop and just had him walking through it and he did it I then moved it from the ground a little. He got a little stressed at first, so I quit and we walked around the yard then tried again. He was doing i and seemed happy doing it. I could still tell he was a little nervous, but still did it. Inside he would have given up, then I did a few sits, down and speaking. He only seemed a little nervous the whole time and seemed pretty proud of himself when we were done. I was using warmed up turkey. We came in the house and he sat with me on the couch relaxed and he kept hitting me with his paw and licking my arm. The training was 5 minutes at most. We did a few high jumping to and he loves that.
__________________
R.I.P- Smokey my GSD/Husky. You are my hero, my heart, my soul and you will forever remain in my heart. You were a true companion. I love You and miss You so much. Run like the wind!!

Chief-GSD
frillint1 is offline   Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 01-08-2013, 06:27 PM   #38 (permalink)
jae
Master Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2012
Location: IA
Posts: 701
Default

The first thing I taught my dog was to be DOWN while I eat at the table, breakfast, lunch, cofee break, dinner, I don't care what it is. Obviously it had to be done with him leashed; ask for a down, and I stepped on the leash for the entire meal. If he gets up, just ignore, he will correct himself. Later you can lose the leash, and if he gets up, you get up and place him back down, without a word. Maybe a pat on the head.

What I also did was eat before he did, so the moment you finish, go and serve him his meal. That way he gets the idea down at the table = meal coming.

Now whenever I sit down at pretty much any table, he goes to an automatic down. One of the funnier things to see, he'll come across the house to me sitting at the kitchen table and lay down, even if there is no food anywhere to be smelt.

There is some good information in this thread by people who have much much more experience than me. But I thought I would share my dinner etiquette. This may sound repetitive, but there are plenty of articles on positive reinforcement. For now, ignore and ignore some more, every single bad thing he does and focus only on the good. Allow him to realize what to do. Allow him to correct himself (see above) and see that the correction means no praise from you, rather than meaning something totally negative. In fact, that is what I did for the first 2 months after I yelled at my dog a few times ( I felt terrible ) once your dog learns the command PERFECTLY, start incorporating a few corrections to see how he takes it.

Last edited by jae; 01-08-2013 at 06:35 PM.
jae is offline   Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 01-12-2013, 06:45 PM   #39 (permalink)
Master Member
 
frillint1's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2010
Posts: 837
Default

I got a treat bag today, so hopefully that will make training easier for us. I am going to make my Own agility course for the back yard for fun and see how he does with a few items. Then will add other stuff if he does good. He seems to do wayyyy better with outside obedience and gives me some attention in public IF I have a treat in my hand, so I am thinking I need to desensitize him training inside as he opens up outside. I have no clue how to do that though.
__________________
R.I.P- Smokey my GSD/Husky. You are my hero, my heart, my soul and you will forever remain in my heart. You were a true companion. I love You and miss You so much. Run like the wind!!

Chief-GSD
frillint1 is offline   Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 01-14-2013, 04:26 PM   #40 (permalink)
Master Member
 
frillint1's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2010
Posts: 837
Default

Finally got my book today The Culture Clash and will begin reading it.
__________________
R.I.P- Smokey my GSD/Husky. You are my hero, my heart, my soul and you will forever remain in my heart. You were a true companion. I love You and miss You so much. Run like the wind!!

Chief-GSD
frillint1 is offline   Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
Reply

Quick Reply
Message:
Options

Register Now

In order to be able to post messages on the German Shepherd Dog Forums forums, you must first register.
Please enter your desired user name, your email address and other required details in the form below.
User Name:
Password
Please enter a password for your user account. Note that passwords are case-sensitive.
Password:
Confirm Password:
Email Address
Please enter a valid email address for yourself.
Email Address:

Log-in

Human Verification

In order to verify that you are a human and not a spam bot, please enter the answer into the following box below based on the instructions contained in the graphic.



Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may post new threads
You may post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are On



All times are GMT -4. The time now is 04:19 PM.



Powered by vBulletin® Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
SEO by vBSEO 3.3.2
PetGuide.com
Basset Hound Forum Doberman Forum Golden Retriever Forum Beagle Forum
Boxer Forum Dog Forum Pit Bull Forum Poodle Forum
Bulldog Forum Fish Forum Havanese Forum Maltese Forum
Cat Forum German Shepherd Forum Labradoodle Forum Yorkie Forum Hedgehog Forum
Chihuahua Forum Retriever Breeds Cichlid Forum Dart Frog Forum Mice Breeder Forum