Heavy handed???? I need help!

[Whiteshepherds]

If you aren't comfortable with the training methods, the odds of you sticking with the training are slim. I'd find a trainer I liked working with.

[Liesje]

No offense to this trainer, but if I had a dime for every person that supposedly "trained police K9s for 30 years" I could quit my job. I've trained with some people that advertise themselves as K9 trainers. Just like any type of training (or anything, really) there's a huge spectrum between legit people that know what the heck they are doing and people that think b/c they've trained a working dog they are a K9 trainer. You say the other "people" there swear by it...what credentials do they have? Are they handling active K9s? Have they earned working type titles like Schutzhund? How did you come by this particular trainer and choose him over others? Can he demonstrate high levels of training and titles/certifications with his own dogs?

To me the whole thing just sounds like a rip-off, a supposedly legit police dog training training 6 month puppies for $1000. I'd run not walk, personally.

[LissG]

Originally Posted by Liesje

You say the other "people" there swear by it...what credentials do they have? Are they handling active K9s? Have they earned working type titles like Schutzhund?

They were customers, it was a group training class. He'd work with one dog while everyone watched, then another, then another. They were there for obedience, like me, and looking to do SchH, agility, or some other protection type sport after mastering obedience.

[Liesje]

Do you know if any of them compete and title their dogs? I ask because I see a lot of bad trainers who people "swear by" but the people that train with these trainers often never achieve or attempt anything beyond a BH level. Most of the time it is not the dog that is the problem but the bad combination of the trainer and the handler. If you want to do Schutzhund later on you'd be better off looking for a trainer or club who really knows the sport and gets results rather than someone who just says they offer that type of training.

Personally I prefer a club atmosphere because I feel there are more "minds" there to observe and offer critique rather than just one person acting like they are the god of training and telling everyone what to do with their dogs. In a club you will train your own dogs but get help and support from the training director and other members.

[chelle]

Originally Posted by LissG

I honestly didn't know...there were about 10 people there with their GSDs assuring me that THIS is what they need in order to be trained, they're all working lines and their driveyness need THIS to be taught, and they swore up and down about how amazing this guy is. The trainer was assuring me also. I just didn't know if it really WAS normal and I was just being over protective or not, but I'm glad my instincts were right. They (people+trainer) were telling me that I babied my dog because I didn't use an e-collar or prong collar, and i was babying him by asking if it was ok, if he was being hurt, etc...while i was there I was thinking "ok-these are all adults, they all have GSD, they're all more experienced then me, I don't think they'd put their dog in harm...MAYBE they are right...better consult the GSD forum" LOL. I do NOT want my dog to be afraid of me, ever. I don't have kids, he IS my kid lol. I don't mind correcting him but I want to work WITH him, not have him cowering and scared. That's just awful.

Prongs are not evil. In my case, I was angry because I had never worked with one, didn't know how to use it, fit it, nothing and I was expected to just jerk the thing and "know." What a crock! Now that I've learned about prongs, I like the prong. But only because I am confident with placing it and using it.

Heck, you might be overprotective but better that than blindly trusting someone.

These type of classes may bring "quick" results, but for our "pet" dogs, (non-show, etc) I can't see why we need to go with that.

I clearly remember many dogs in my class, mostly GSD's, and they were very well behaved, executed the commands nearly flawlessly.. But I also recall several others, mostly non GSD's, who were not doing as directed and their owners were being yelled at and both dog AND owner just looked like deer in headlights. Some were pups younger than Bailey. It was just wrong on several levels. As the newcomer, I was getting yelled at.. a LOT! It was real trial by fire stuff. (This class brought in new people every Monday night, so some had been there for weeks, even months) NOW I know what the training goal was - a proper heel and sit *beside* the owner. Bailey kept sitting sideways and wow did we catch **** over that.

It's too easy, when we doubt ourselves, to fall into the trap of hey, this guy is a super duper trainer, look at all he/she has done, they MUST know best!? I mean, we're rookies, right? Who are WE to doubt super-duper-trainer-person?

But bottom line is that as the owner, we must train in the fashion WE are most comfortable with. Whether that's positive reinforcement, compulsion training, what have you, the dog KNOWS if the handler is confident. I was totally NOT confident with what was going on, but allowed myself and Bails to be yelled at for a bit, then we went to the side of the ring to just watch. We never went back.

Some days I flirt with the idea of going back, since Bailey's older now, I know what to expect, know how to use the prong AND I believe we can deliver it. Yet on the other hand, the trainer was a nasty person whose methods were ridiculous with a new member. I have NO respect for the fact that he threw the prong on and expected me to use the prong properly, (thru osmosis, or ?) and even less respect that he wanted me to do that, a complete novice with a prong, with a four month old dog. Even LESS respect that we were yelled at like that. I'm not a scardy cat kind of woman , I've been yelled at plenty,,, but come on.

Again, trust your gut. Get more info and use the training method that YOU can feel totally confident with!

[LissG]

Originally Posted by chelle

I have NO respect for the fact that he threw the prong on and expected me to use the prong properly, (thru osmosis, or ?)

Hahahaha I'm glad I'm not the only one who has gone through a situation like that, I don't feel so bad anymore... But now that I know better, I'll NEVER ever let anyone do that to me or my Wolf again . I'm not going back there, I'm going to keep looking and trust my gut.

[chelle]

Originally Posted by LissG

Hahahaha I'm glad I'm not the only one who has gone through a situation like that, I don't feel so bad anymore... But now that I know better, I'll NEVER ever let anyone do that to me or my Wolf again . I'm not going back there, I'm going to keep looking and trust my gut.

Yes, keep looking and learning. We ended up with a class that primarily used rewards- based training, but Bails was on a prong for the heeling work. It was a great compromise.

Bailey just sent you a friend request. Haha, I'm not the only one who has a fb page for their dog, yay!!!!!

[Anastasia]

If you are looking for obedience training you may want to check into Home

She is in Marlton so not to far from you. She came highly recommended on this board.