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Old 03-15-2014, 01:45 AM   #11 (permalink)
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Ahh... luring, that does sound right... I know what I do... the whole terminology part just gets so complicated. Especially when you're mixing three different species in there as well, and they all have their own individual terminology.
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Old 03-15-2014, 02:10 AM   #12 (permalink)
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marking means saying 'yes' or 'good boy' whatever, as soon as dog does command, then treat

clicking means clicking the clicker as soon as dog does the command, then you can treat
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Old 03-15-2014, 06:47 AM   #13 (permalink)
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The clicker is a crisp noise that sounds the same all the time. You can do that with your voice but a lot of people have trouble with consistency.

I was recently told "NO is NOT a two syllable word!" Hey, I live in the South. The point was I was saying NO but by tone of voice was saying please.

Well, that's my two cents. On charging it, the video is a great idea.
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Old 03-15-2014, 07:27 AM   #14 (permalink)
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Here is what I'm betting is happening. You're performing an action before you click that the pup is seeing as a predictor of the click and resulting food and ignoring the click as a result.

Also consistency with the sound if a yes a no or good doesn't really matter that much over a relatively short amount of time. A flat yes a happy yes and a shrieking yeeeeeees! The dog is gonna learn to come get that reward really quick. Yes, bess, fess, mess and that dog is coming because it's (close enough). Especially for a reward release marker. Carrying around a clicker is kinda silly.

Last edited by Baillif; 03-15-2014 at 07:30 AM.
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Old 03-15-2014, 07:58 AM   #15 (permalink)
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To each their own. I see a difference in how fast they learn with the clicker vs. marker training. I can mark the action with a clicker faster than with my mouth.

The thing with clicker training is it should be used to get the dog started on something. Not forever. I only use it to teach what I want and then I use markers Yes!. When my dogs here that they are excited. And Bailiff is correct, it doesn't matter if I whisper it or yell it. They know they've done something right.

OP - just keep clicking and rewarding. Do that several times and then click and wait a second. See if he turns his head even the slightest towards you. Reward any small movement even if he is not looking all the way at you. that should tell him that looking towards you is what you want. When he finally fully looks at you, click and give him a jackpot. Many treats in fast succession and make a party of it. You can do it again to reaffirm it for him and then put the clicker up and let him think about it.

When you are teaching something, don't beat it to death. How did my breeder put it to me this last week...You should be done before he is!
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Old 03-15-2014, 08:05 AM   #16 (permalink)
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I use both clicker and marker training, but specifically use the clicker for training things like the out of motion IPO exercises. My training partner is also geared with a clicker, and as I am heeling my dog and give the command, he is able to click the exact moment the dog performs it correctly, while still presenting the normal "trial like" picture to the dog. No movement from me to check and see if my dog did it right, no second handler walking backwards down the field to give me the thumbs if when its good, and no verbal cue of "good" from my second handler either. Trial picture all done with a silly box
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Old 03-15-2014, 08:22 AM   #17 (permalink)
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a click is just a mark. I really don't think it matters what a person uses in the end. I don't measure my training by the first 2 weeks, but by the end result and they aren't all that different in terms of performance or time.

I like verbal marks, if i am not consistent in the beginning, though I think I am consistent enough the dog can pick it up really freaking quickly, they learn to read me and my voice and all the variables that are going to come up later. So sure, in the very beginning stages, being mechanical and sterile might help, I think any perceived "advantage" is short lived over verbal marks. longer term, I think the verbals offer advantages to me at least, in terms of that variability because they learn that I am variable too and how to read it. Maybe I'm just biased because I haven't figured out how to make a clicker click

I never "charge" anything. They always have to do something for me I'm a real prick that way. It takes them a little bit to understand, but that's ok, i can't think of any training that doesn't. They look at me, mark....reward. They come to me, mark....reward. Lure to sit, down, to heel, mark....reward.

It doesn't take long before they are learning all the things I want them to. To test if they know it, which is usually just a week or so depending on the particular situation, i get them doing something that allows them to completely ignore me and when I see them off doing something else, not expecting any sort of training to be happening, I mark, and they always spin around and come running so fast to get their reward. I know it's conditioned.
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Old 03-15-2014, 09:10 AM   #18 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by GatorDog View Post
I use both clicker and marker training, but specifically use the clicker for training things like the out of motion IPO exercises. My training partner is also geared with a clicker, and as I am heeling my dog and give the command, he is able to click the exact moment the dog performs it correctly, while still presenting the normal "trial like" picture to the dog. No movement from me to check and see if my dog did it right, no second handler walking backwards down the field to give me the thumbs if when its good, and no verbal cue of "good" from my second handler either. Trial picture all done with a silly box
I just use mirrors
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Old 03-15-2014, 10:33 AM   #19 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Baillif View Post
Shouldn't take long. Take some video lets have a look.
Ill post some soon as my wife gets up.
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Old 03-15-2014, 10:41 AM   #20 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Baillif View Post
I just use mirrors
When I'm inside, I do too. But I also train on fields. And don't have a mirror boy to follow me around just yet.
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