How to handle "I don't feel like listening"

Anthony8858 · 11-08-2011, 07:42 AM

Had an interesting morning walk.

I went down to the local park / shoreline. It was about 6am, and we were the only ones there.

No matter what command I used, Kira would not respond. She was walking, sniffing, grabbed a stick, and carried it for about a half mile. Her spirits were high, and she was alert.
I had her on a long lead, and I typically use that lead to work on recall.
She wouldn't recall. If she were to get in front of me, I would issue the "watch me" (which she's normally rock solid), and she would simply look the other way.
I tried "sit".. she would glance at me, and look the other way and not sit.

She was downright defiant this morning. I decided to do nothing, until I learned the proper response to her behavior.

Otherwise, her training at home and in class, has been terrific.

**MaggieRoseLee** · 11-08-2011, 08:28 AM

How old is she? If she's a young puppy, they need to learn and your classes will keep helping with this.

And what did you have to make it worth her listening in such an exciting environment?

I know I'd of had her favorite toy (or a stick?

). And when I'm out and about and call I hold that toy up, just call my dogs name, and RUN IN THE OPPOSITE DIRECTION!

When they catch up I throw that toy! When training my dog's 'come' I make it worth their while and more fun than what they are doing.

Other thing is, if you don't think your dog will obey, DO NOT USE A COMMAND WORD!

Because if they do NOT obey, you teach them that 'sit' means nothing and 'come' means nothing cause you say it over and over and over and over and they just go merrily along with what they are doing.

So in outdoors situations like you describe, when I know my dog's not reliable YET then I just use their name as an attention getter and then RUN!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! That's so exciting they 'come' without the word and they get a reward (the toy).

Point being they did EXACTLY what I wanted (the come) without the word. And it reaffirms the power of their name (vital!).

You been playing/teaching alot of engagment training? Cause if I were you that's the main help in all future training and would be a huge help in your walks...

Click this ---> Engagement - Key to Training

Anthony8858 · 11-08-2011, 08:50 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MaggieRoseLee

How old is she? If she's a young puppy, they need to learn and your classes will keep helping with this.

And what did you have to make it worth her listening in such an exciting environment?

I know I'd of had her favorite toy (or a stick?

). And when I'm out and about and call I hold that toy up, just call my dogs name, and RUN IN THE OPPOSITE DIRECTION!

When they catch up I throw that toy! When training my dog's 'come' I make it worth their while and more fun than what they are doing.

Other thing is, if you don't think your dog will obey, DO NOT USE A COMMAND WORD!

Because if they do NOT obey, you teach them that 'sit' means nothing and 'come' means nothing cause you say it over and over and over and over and they just go merrily along with what they are doing.

So in outdoors situations like you describe, when I know my dog's not reliable YET then I just use their name as an attention getter and then RUN!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! That's so exciting they 'come' without the word and they get a reward (the toy).

Point being they did EXACTLY what I wanted (the come) without the word. And it reaffirms the power of their name (vital!).

You been playing/teaching alot of engagment training? Cause if I were you that's the main help in all future training and would be a huge help in your walks...

Click this ---> Engagement - Key to Training

Thank you so much. You're right on with this one.

For starters, Kira is only 4 months. She's been in obedience for 5 weeks, and she's doing great. I understand, and expect her NOT to be perfect. This was more about ME handling her lapses properly, which is what you addressed.
Her "treats" were not of high value. It was her usual kibble, and it didn't excite her.

I did walk in the opposite direction on a few occasions. She would stop whatever she was doing, look at me, and run to me.
So basically, she followed me on HER terms. She stayed 25 feet in front or 25 feet behind me. As i was walking, she sniffed and trotted, and had fun. If I would stop walking, she would stop and come back. If I called her... No way, was she coming back. She ignored me. I had to stop and go in the opposite direction. I didn't have to call her name. She was in tune with my footsteps.

Stosh · 11-08-2011, 08:53 AM

There's a great dvd by Patricia McConnell called "Lassie Come!" I recently watched it again and it's definitely worth it for any aged dog.

Lakl · 11-08-2011, 09:02 AM

I had the same issues with my girl when she was a pup. At home or in classes, she was very attentive and obedient, but out in public places, I could not get her to do more than a sit. The advice that I was given is that there are a plethora of distractions in public places. My pup was fear reactive, so she was too high strung about her environment to focus on what I wanted her to do. In addition, all the new smells and sounds are a lot more important to a new puppy than training commands. Make a point to do training sessions outside the home in public places. Start with an area that has minimal distractions, and then slowly build up. Use toys or treats and be animated to keep bringing her focus back to you and make it fun. It will get better with repetition and as she matures.

Freestep · 11-08-2011, 10:55 AM

Sounds like you have a wonderful, confident temperament on that pup! At 4 months of age, that kind of behavior is to be expected at times, especially when walking out and about with lots of distracting sights, sounds, and smells. Like the others said, make yourself more interesting! High value treats, toys, running away, etc.

Then again, there's nothing wrong with letting her explore and enjoy her environment, and not to expect goose-stepping obedience at this age. Keep in mind, she's just a baby. Sneaking in 2-3 obedience exercises during a walk is plenty at this stage.

Anthony8858 · 11-08-2011, 11:03 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Freestep

Sounds like you have a wonderful, confident temperament on that pup! At 4 months of age, that kind of behavior is to be expected at times, especially when walking out and about with lots of distracting sights, sounds, and smells. Like the others said, make yourself more interesting! High value treats, toys, running away, etc.

Then again, there's nothing wrong with letting her explore and enjoy her environment, and not to expect goose-stepping obedience at this age. Keep in mind, she's just a baby. Sneaking in 2-3 obedience exercises during a walk is plenty at this stage.

I agree 100%. I wanted her explore her environment (that's the reason for the long lead), while at the same time, I like to slip in a command here and there.
She is only 4 months, and her temperment is wonderful. She's very receptive to learning, and eager to please.
I was just wondering what I should do when she doesn't want to sit or come or whatever.

Emoore · 11-08-2011, 11:07 AM

It really depends on age and context. At 11 months, Kopper has started really pushing boundaries and ignoring stuff like "sit" and "down" even in non-distracting, familiar environments. He's not what you'd call sensitive and in those situations I *do* use physical correction. I don't think that's what you're dealing with, though, so I wouldn't use corrections in your situation. At her age keep it positive and motivating.

**Cassidy's Mom** · 11-08-2011, 01:45 PM

I did what Lakl suggests - I found places just slightly more interesting than home and worked up to more stimulating environments. And each time I progressed to more distractions I took a step back and just did a lot of marking and rewarding for attention. We live in a very quiet neighborhood, so I'd walk to a busy street corner with my clicker and a bag of treats and just wait for her to look at me, and then click/treat. Then ask for a sit and click/treat for attention, then a down, and click/treat for attention. There's a gas station a few blocks away, so I'd stop next to the driveway and work on attention, sits, and downs with cars going in and out. Then we'd go to strip malls and work outside stores.

Anthony8858 · 11-08-2011, 02:00 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Cassidy's Mom

I did what Lakl suggests - I found places just slightly more interesting than home and worked up to more stimulating environments. And each time I progressed to more distractions I took a step back and just did a lot of marking and rewarding for attention. We live in a very quiet neighborhood, so I'd walk to a busy street corner with my clicker and a bag of treats and just wait for her to look at me, and then click/treat. Then ask for a sit and click/treat for attention, then a down, and click/treat for attention. There's a gas station a few blocks away, so I'd stop next to the driveway and work on attention, sits, and downs with cars going in and out. Then we'd go to strip malls and work outside stores.

Very good suggestions here too.

The area I take her is very quite. I live near the ocean, and just off the beach, there are ponds and lakes. At 6am it's very surreal, and easy on the senses.

OTOH, the area is surrounded by wildlife. Lots of birds, ducks, seagulls, etc.. The place was probably loaded with scents that only she could smell.

11-08-2011, 07:42 AM	#1 (permalink)
Anthony8858 Elite Member Join Date: Sep 2011 Posts: 1,314	How to handle "I don't feel like listening" Had an interesting morning walk. I went down to the local park / shoreline. It was about 6am, and we were the only ones there. No matter what command I used, Kira would not respond. She was walking, sniffing, grabbed a stick, and carried it for about a half mile. Her spirits were high, and she was alert. I had her on a long lead, and I typically use that lead to work on recall. She wouldn't recall. If she were to get in front of me, I would issue the "watch me" (which she's normally rock solid), and she would simply look the other way. I tried "sit".. she would glance at me, and look the other way and not sit. She was downright defiant this morning. I decided to do nothing, until I learned the proper response to her behavior. Otherwise, her training at home and in class, has been terrific.

11-08-2011, 08:28 AM	#2 (permalink)
MaggieRoseLee The Agility Rocks! Moderator Join Date: Aug 2001 Location: Bushkill, PA (The Poconos!) Posts: 22,215	How old is she? If she's a young puppy, they need to learn and your classes will keep helping with this. And what did you have to make it worth her listening in such an exciting environment? I know I'd of had her favorite toy (or a stick? ). And when I'm out and about and call I hold that toy up, just call my dogs name, and RUN IN THE OPPOSITE DIRECTION! When they catch up I throw that toy! When training my dog's 'come' I make it worth their while and more fun than what they are doing. Other thing is, if you don't think your dog will obey, DO NOT USE A COMMAND WORD! Because if they do NOT obey, you teach them that 'sit' means nothing and 'come' means nothing cause you say it over and over and over and over and they just go merrily along with what they are doing. So in outdoors situations like you describe, when I know my dog's not reliable YET then I just use their name as an attention getter and then RUN!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! That's so exciting they 'come' without the word and they get a reward (the toy). Point being they did EXACTLY what I wanted (the come) without the word. And it reaffirms the power of their name (vital!). You been playing/teaching alot of engagment training? Cause if I were you that's the main help in all future training and would be a huge help in your walks... Click this ---> Engagement - Key to Training __________________ MACH2 Bretta Lee Wildhaus CGC TC TQX Glory B Wildhaus NA, NJ, NF + LOL (still) "*Always forgive your enemies; nothing annoys them so much." - Oscar Wilde*

11-08-2011, 10:55 AM	#6 (permalink)
Freestep Knighted Member Join Date: May 2011 Location: Northern California Posts: 3,092	Sounds like you have a wonderful, confident temperament on that pup! At 4 months of age, that kind of behavior is to be expected at times, especially when walking out and about with lots of distracting sights, sounds, and smells. Like the others said, make yourself more interesting! High value treats, toys, running away, etc. Then again, there's nothing wrong with letting her explore and enjoy her environment, and not to expect goose-stepping obedience at this age. Keep in mind, she's just a baby. Sneaking in 2-3 obedience exercises during a walk is plenty at this stage. __________________ Luka von Sontausen, CD Vinca von Sontausen, CGC Freestep's Beluga Whale, BWD

11-08-2011, 11:07 AM	#8 (permalink)
Emoore Crowned Member Join Date: Oct 2002 Location: North DFW, TX Posts: 9,215	It really depends on age and context. At 11 months, Kopper has started really pushing boundaries and ignoring stuff like "sit" and "down" even in non-distracting, familiar environments. He's not what you'd call sensitive and in those situations I do use physical correction. I don't think that's what you're dealing with, though, so I wouldn't use corrections in your situation. At her age keep it positive and motivating. __________________ Rocky vom Backyard- 10 years young Kopper vom Felssclucht Bach - 17 months At the Bridge: Cash van der Animal Shelter 2006-2010

11-08-2011, 01:45 PM	#9 (permalink)
Cassidy's Mom No Stinkin' Leashes Moderator Join Date: Mar 2003 Location: SF Bay Area Posts: 24,959	I did what Lakl suggests - I found places just slightly more interesting than home and worked up to more stimulating environments. And each time I progressed to more distractions I took a step back and just did a lot of marking and rewarding for attention. We live in a very quiet neighborhood, so I'd walk to a busy street corner with my clicker and a bag of treats and just wait for her to look at me, and then click/treat. Then ask for a sit and click/treat for attention, then a down, and click/treat for attention. There's a gas station a few blocks away, so I'd stop next to the driveway and work on attention, sits, and downs with cars going in and out. Then we'd go to strip malls and work outside stores. __________________ -Debbie- Dena 9/12/04-10/4/08 Forever would have been too short Keefer 8/25/05 Halo 11/9/08 Cassidy 6/8/00-10/4/04

11-08-2011, 08:53 AM	#4 (permalink)
Stosh Crowned Member Join Date: Jun 2010 Location: tyler texas Posts: 8,434	There's a great dvd by Patricia McConnell called "Lassie Come!" I recently watched it again and it's definitely worth it for any aged dog.

11-08-2011, 09:02 AM	#5 (permalink)
Lakl Master Member Join Date: Jul 2011 Posts: 525	I had the same issues with my girl when she was a pup. At home or in classes, she was very attentive and obedient, but out in public places, I could not get her to do more than a sit. The advice that I was given is that there are a plethora of distractions in public places. My pup was fear reactive, so she was too high strung about her environment to focus on what I wanted her to do. In addition, all the new smells and sounds are a lot more important to a new puppy than training commands. Make a point to do training sessions outside the home in public places. Start with an area that has minimal distractions, and then slowly build up. Use toys or treats and be animated to keep bringing her focus back to you and make it fun. It will get better with repetition and as she matures.

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