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Shocked at the french GSD forum

14K views 87 replies 49 participants last post by  SuperG 
#1 · (Edited by Moderator)
Hi all,

Some of you may know us, we're the proud owners of 2 GSDs, one black and tanned Kailash and one blue Enakai. We live at the moment in France and we wanted to share our pics with french owners of GSDs.

We found a site where we introduced our babies, starting with Enakai, and Oh My God, i've never seen so many angry GSD owners in all my life :eek:

We have been attacked very aggressively that Enakai is not a german shepherd, that her pedigree given by the UK kennel club is pointless and doesn't mean anything and more specifically that the American Kennel Cub, Canadian Kennel Club and UK kennel club are even more PSEUDO SWEARING since they don't recognize the international standard!! :confused:

And even some members said about our dog that she was ugly and we should be ashamed, etc and the moderators didn't say anything (actually one of them said she was ugly) and when i said it's not right to say such a thing about puppies, i've been told by the moderators to accept criticism then finally blocked our post saying that blue GSDs is a shame and people need to be careful about people like me lying, calling our blue a GSD!!

REMOVED LINK

I remember when I introduced my girl to you guys, I've been well welcomed, no one insulted my puppie and even if some of you didn't agree with blues, which i can understand, then none of you said to me that my girl is NOT a GSD and her pedigree is PSEUDO SWEARING or even that she is ugly!

So can anyone tell me if it's true that the American Kennel Club and Canadian and UK kennel club are actually not recognizing the FCI (international standards)??

PS: by far, this forum is the best GSD forum in the world!!! :wub:
 
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#33 ·
I know this is tough for single language Americans to understand, but many times, there is a huge loss in translation. Words don't always translate the right way, and so someone with English as a second language might not understand how harsh a word in English sounds or is taken due to a cultural difference or just being the "wrong" word.

Like for example...if you look in a thesaurus, dislike and hate will be synonyms. But the use of each of those words signifies a different level of feeling. Each culture and language has that, and when you try to translate, there can be confusion.

I've heard this about Americans from Europeans...we love to use "love" to signify how much we like things. We throw that word around A LOT. "I love this burger." "I love that car." ect. In Europe, many cultures truly reserve that word for just what it really is, a feeling towards a person or possibly some other living thing. But the "love" of an inanimate object is almost comical to them.
 
#35 ·
Quote:
Originally Posted by ...
The internet has become a watered down, hand-holding, Kumbaya, be-nice-or-else wussfest over the last ten years. If anything people have just gotten more sensitive to the slightest harsh word, it's not that anyone has gotten more "hateful."

I've been surfing the information superhighway for roughly 18 years now. The word of today is Oversensitivity

I don't know if that's it entirely. People have always disagreed but we've just forgot how to be respectful of one another. The anonymity of saying what you want while insulated by a screen and keyboard makes it easier for some to be completely intolerant of any view other than their own.
__________________

Above the the post and reply from the convo on another forum, and not the doggie forum ...
 
#36 ·
Quote:
Originally Posted by ...
The internet has become a watered down, hand-holding, Kumbaya, be-nice-or-else wussfest over the last ten years. If anything people have just gotten more sensitive to the slightest harsh word, it's not that anyone has gotten more "hateful."

I've been surfing the information superhighway for roughly 18 years now. The word of today is Oversensitivity

I don't know if that's it entirely. People have always disagreed but we've just forgot how to be respectful of one another. The anonymity of saying what you want while insulated by a screen and keyboard makes it easier for some to be completely intolerant of any view other than their own.
__________________

Above the the post and reply from the convo on another forum, and not the doggie forum ...
I concur. Think about when you may be texting someone whom you know really well. You may be busy working or something while they are doing nothing but texting you. Therefore what occasionally happens is one of you sends a text that without the infliction of human voice is open to be taken as insulting, hostile, loving, worrying, caring, anything. I have had many misunderstandings with texts of this manner. Now consider that the majority of people on the internet are complete strangers. You never hear or see inflictions of voice or facial expressions. It's all about perception and the ability to keep an open mind.
 
#37 ·
First off - I have always loved your blue girl! I think she is gorgeous! A friend has a blue Weim and I think she is much prettier than the standard taupe color....but also a disqualifying faulted color just like in GSDs......

IF blues were allowed, I would probably have one....but they aren't......that does not make it right or correct or even remotely acceptable to bash an owner who has one and loves their dog!!!!

And yes, I have heard that in many European kennels, in the past, blues, livers or whites would have been culled at birth (ie - killed).....not sure if it would happen today there - here in the US a breeder following the FCI standard would most likely sell or place the pup with no papers in a companion home....Unfortunately, there are many here in the US who market them and breed them on purpose as 'rare' colors. I know of one blue and tan that was born and the breeder was so puzzled by the color he sold it at half price as a pet - that was the first blue I ever saw...both parents were titled also.

On any forum, there are people who are more emotional than knowledgable....and some with a little knowledge who then assume they are experts....sounds like the French based forum is pretty full of that! Ignore it.....their loss.....

Lee
 
#39 ·
Thank you very much for your message :)

I understand that people prefer to have allowed dogs. Blues only started to really come out now. But in France, you have no forum, no facebook page talking about blues, like if it was a forbidden topic :confused:
Unfortunately, from what this ex police dog trainer told us, breeders still kill the blue pups ;(
 
#38 ·
The thing is i'm French, born and raised here, my fiancé is English so i don't need a translator to understand what they say :) and trust me, when a french says your dog is ugly the way they did, the way they spoke to me, really harshly, they really meant what they said, really meant to hurt. They were that harsh that even some members (not a lot maybe 2 or 3) stuck up for me and told them to leave me alone. In general i don't let people to get to me specially over the net, but here people were so abusive, even on the chat, that it kind of upset me.
I mean everyone have preferences, I love certain type of dogs over others but in no way will I say to an owner that his/her dog is ugly, specially if i'm a moderator of a forum, just by principle.

@Bob McBob, i know what several people think about blues and this is really why my point was not to even talk about standards but only about GSDs and our love for them. The problem in my post is that everyone was going on and on about the fact i should be ashamed to call my blue a GSD, that she's everything other than being a GSD even if she's a pure bred and has a pedigree from the UK kennel Club, it didn't matter to them. In order for me to post on their forum, my dog needed to fit the standard , like my black and tanned boy, and this is what all the argument was about (more than the fact that my breeder had blue litters). I mean Enakai might not meet the standard as we know today, even if the blue has always existed from the start of the breed, but calling me a liar just because I say Enakai is a pure bred GSD, that i should be ashamed to even post on a GSD forum, really got to me. I'm not a breeder, just a GSD lover who loves sharing with other GSD lovers and i think they really really were over the top :( But the good thing is, I'm here and i love this forum and it's ok if i'm not allowed on a french GSD forum, as long as i'm here :wub:
 
#40 ·
#44 ·
Also they kept on saying that Enakai was a blue bay shepherd.
berger allemand poil long, blue bay shepherd, berger blanc suisse, elevage des gardiens du pacte et legend of darkness

Even though i told them there are only 2 breeders of blue bay shepherds in the world, one in Normandie and one in Florida and i got Enakai in York, England. It's like they refused to hear that she could be linked in any way to a GSD and prefered to say she was something else :/

I guess that is sorta like the whites being Swiss shepherds....dogs of pure breeding, used to found a color breed. I had color breed horses, so this is just normal spin off to me!

The color standards were set for reasons far back, now lost in time, only conjecture about why. I breed, so would not keep one if I produced it....but I would not demean or hurt someone over it. Now DNA tests are available to test for many colors, markings and patterns....like the black face...

Your girl is every bit as pure a GSD as any other, just a disqualifying color....they sound like idiots.....

Lee
 
#41 · (Edited)
The French can be very Rude. They hate Americans even though we saved their butts in WW1, WW2, and Vietnam. Point is the French need to get over themselves and realize they are just as good or bad as anyone else on this planet. I am sorry they were so rude to your dogs. Consider the source and tell them to get some manners. I would love to have a blue. I just want to rescue older dogs, so no puppies for now. I don't know if many people would be able to tell a blue from a black. Best of luck in France.
 
#45 ·
The French can be very Rude. They hate Americans even though we saved their butts in WW1, WW2, and Vietnam. Point is the French need to get over themselves and realize they are just as good or bad as anyone else on this planet. I am sorry they were so rude to your dogs. Consider the source and tell them to get some manners. Best of luck in France.
Missed the part about the OP being French, did you :eek:
 
#46 ·
So far as the French go, remember those of us in the US would be Brits if the French hadn't helped us out a while back...

As far as the other board being rude -- there are boards here only for the thick skinned, too. Not just a French thing...

So far as them insulting your dog and you -- It's the internet. It's easy to do when you can't see the person. A bit harder in person. My question: Why do you care what they think?
 
#49 ·
Is your dog a pure GSD?
I visited the Blue Bay SHEPHERD web site and do not see the word German . I do see that it is a creation of this Vicki Spencer to create a dog that looks like a wolf. Likewise attempts for the Timber Shepherd.

Your French forum made comment that a blue GSD would not be consistent or approved by FCI standards , which would have the universally accepted breed standard. Blue would not fit into that criteria . Are they not saying they should not be bred, something lost in tone or translation , that one should not go out and deliberately breed "novelty" dogs or colours , and adhere to the standard?
 
#52 ·
No Carmspack, they're saying that because it's a blue GSD (which is not mentioned in the FCI) there is no way in **** that it is ACTUALLY a GSD, it's some sort of "shepherd" type dog but not one of their beloved German Shepherd Dogs, and how dare she claim that it is.... they were very very rude and narrow minded in the whole discourse... Saying the blue's aren't even present in the GSD lines :crazy:
 
#50 ·
Come on people, dont judge the french by the thoughts and actions of one or a few people. I mean, if they watched the news in the 1994 then they might think that all americans hate their wives, murder them with undersized gloves and love to run from the police in white bronco's. I bet there are french people that love americans. After all, they gave us the french fry.:shocked:
 
#51 ·
Every forum has its own personality and culture. People are over-reacting by judging an entire nation on the comment of a few individuals.

There are GSD forums right here in the English language that can be just as rude and attacking.

I love it how some people's response to rude attacks is attacking back in the same rude manner - like, is that supposed to prove that you as an individual are somewhat better than they?
 
#53 ·
I'm a mod on a motorcycle forum which is really just cleaning up spammers and merging posts. We don't really care if someone's feelings are hurt. Post pic of your girlfriend and someone might say she's ugly. It's a free place where adults can come and go as they wish. We prefer people ignore what they want as opposed to asking every opinion they disagree with to be censored. What would happen at the grocery store if some said your dog was ugly? Expect management to throw them out?

Just find where you fit in and be happy!
 
#56 · (Edited)
Why i do care about what has been said is because I think you can judge people by their actions, their opinions but you can't judge a dog just by the way it looks? I mean Enakai has done nothing than being a happy dog and it will always upset me if someone says bad things about her.

Also thinking of all those blue and white pups that are still being killed over here because of their color really makes me so sad. So i think it's the whole lot that really got me. I might be a bit too much sensitive or idealist but because we have the possibility to stay anonymous on the internet doesn't give anyone the right to be so rude with someone they don't know. I don't think in real life, in a grocery shop or anywhere else, people would insult anyone else that easily. That's my opinion.

As for the french in general, I don't really feel offended by what is being said here. There was a report on our national channel stating that french were the most arrogant in Europe from tourists point of view lol This might be coming from the fact that French are also the most depressed in Europe according to another study.
Also we have a culture that makes french in general quite strict about standards, not only in dogs, but also in jobs, the way you dress, etc. I see that almost everyday with my fiancé who can't speak french that well and he always gets asked what's the point of staying in France if he can't even speak the language :confused:

Having said that, fortunately not all of us are like that, like in every countries, i guess there are good and bad ones. I personally love America, that much that we're planning on moving there after my PhD. :D

Now my point was to say that you can be into GSD standards but can't just reject all the dogs that are not fitting your view of standards.
 
#58 ·
Yes sure but here they're not only offending my dog, they're also denying the fact that she's a pure-bred GSD when she is (she has a pedigree from the UK kennel club) and either her color fits the standard or not, i cannot let this being said on a GSD forum. :confused:
 
#63 ·
I used to live in Germany when I was in the Army. We traveled to France several times. We found a lovely restaurant just across the border from the Rheinland-Pfalz area. We loved it! The people were friendly and kind. Went to Paris and the Parisians were very rude. I was nearly pushed off a sidewalk into a vehicle by a lady that wanted by me. But you knwo that can happen in New York too.

I think your dogs are lovely.
 
#64 ·
Hi all,

Some of you may know us, we're the proud owners of 2 GSDs, one black and tanned Kailash and one blue Enakai. We live at the moment in France and we wanted to share our pics with french owners of GSDs.

We found a site where we introduced our babies, starting with Enakai, and Oh My God, i've never seen so many angry GSD owners in all my life :eek:

We have been attacked very aggressively that Enakai is not a german shepherd, that her pedigree given by the UK kennel club is pointless and doesn't mean anything and more specifically that the American Kennel Cub, Canadian Kennel Club and UK kennel club are even more PSEUDO SWEARING since they don't recognize the international standard!! :confused:



And even some members said about our dog that she was ugly and we should be ashamed, etc and the moderators didn't say anything (actually one of them said she was ugly) and when i said it's not right to say such a thing about puppies, i've been told by the moderators to accept criticism then finally blocked our post saying that blue GSDs is a shame and people need to be careful about people like me lying, calling our blue a GSD!!

REMOVED LINK

I remember when I introduced my girl to you guys, I've been well welcomed, no one insulted my puppie and even if some of you didn't agree with blues, which i can understand, then none of you said to me that my girl is NOT a GSD and her pedigree is PSEUDO SWEARING or even that she is ugly!

So can anyone tell me if it's true that the American Kennel Club and Canadian and UK kennel club are actually not recognizing the FCI (international standards)??

PS: by far, this forum is the best GSD forum in the world!!! :wub:
Until I read this post I had never heard of a blue gsd and I've just spent some time researching them and omg I'm in love, your Enakai is absolutely gorgeous :wub: anyone who says she's ugly needs their head testing, the colour is amazing :) I've talked to hardcore gsd owners in the past and been told my Jax isn't show worthy because his back legs don't slope, his one ear flops down and even that he has flex of white in him, but I didn't have him to show, I had him to cuddle and go on long walks and to be a companion. They weren't interested.
 
#65 ·
Thanks a lot everyone for your kind messages :)
MichaelE LOL your post made me laugh :) Unfortunately (or fortunately) i have been banned from their forum because of the color of Enakai so won't be able to say anything anymore on a french gsd forum Hhhhhhh
 
#68 ·
Relax. To me these people are ignorant and stupid. True that blue and liver gsds along with show lines aren't what you'd call the 'original' gsds but that doesn't mean they don't exist under the breed. The French have to learn to accept the reality and not live in the past where all GSDs were black and tan. Besides even the Germans accept blue GSDs so what's their problem. It's not like GSDs originate from their country that they are outraged at the changes made on these dogs. Just ignore them and if I were you I'd quit that forum.
 
#70 ·
I agree with you. This is also what I tried to tell them with no success. I'm not part of their forum anymore :)
 
#71 ·
LOL I think this happens in every forum. I have BYB GSDs and recently got a Shiloh puppy so I just browse here and rarely say anything. I personally like the variations of GSDs that are possible! I realize they aren't all "to the standard" but I think in this world there is plenty of room for all of them and of course we should have the purest lines preserved as well. Hope this forum is more to your liking!
 
#75 ·
Hello sorry I missed the new comments. I put the link on my first post but I think it has been removed by the moderator which I can understand. If you want the link, I can send it by private message :)
 
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