SAR dog size?

[Lauri & The Gang]

Every time I see SAR dogs it's always the larger breeds - Labs, GSDs, Goldens, etc.

Why not smaller dogs?

I would think it would be easier for a small dog - like a Cocker - to get into the rubble and move around in tight spaces.

Is there any reason for the size of the SAR dogs?

[cafrhe]

The dogs that are the most successful in SAR are the herding and some of the sporting and working breeds. They have the drive, desire to hunt for and work with people and the desire to use their nose rather than their eyes (like the sight hounds which are excited by moving prey rather than just the scent). Some breeds have great noses and desire to hunt--but critters rather than humans. The desire to engage with and play with humans is a very very important trait (rather than go off and have fun tracking a hot scent by them selves). Obviously this is a generality--lots of individual breess and mixes are represented as SAR dogs.

There are border collies and Aussies which are small. Some of the labs I am working with this week are fairly small dogs. Handlers often get their labs from field trial labs and they are not the bigger blocky types.

I would love a gsd in a smaller body for urban sar, but for wilderness, I dont mind the size.

[Catu]

Size in one of the factors why many people like malis over GSDs

[Catu]

Originally Posted By: cafrheThe dogs that are the most successful in SAR are the herding and some of the sporting and working breeds. They have the drive, desire to hunt for and work with people

This is very important. In SAR the dog is not the only one searching, you truly have to be a team with your dog.

Many hunting dogs, as beagles, foxhounds and that kind of breeds hunt by themselves and the hunters are somewhere behind them, but they decide where they go and once they have the track they don't even remember there is supposed to be someone with them (then is when dogs with shorter legs where created, to be able to follow them on foot).

When you are in SAR work you can't leave all the job on the dog. Yes, he has the nose, but you have the brains and you are the one in charge of making sure all your search area has been covered before to say it is clear. And that's is a huge responsibility.

Retrievers and shepherds have the ability to take directions without losing motivation nor the goal in mind. A good SAR dog you can tell them where to go, but they still can keep searching and making decisions without expecting you to tell them where to put every paw.

[Amaruq]

There are also different types of SAR. In disaster searches smaller breeds have advantages but larger ones do as well. Take the twin towers, a smaller breed could get down into the rubble, however, a larger dog would be more suited to get OVER the rubble. German Shepherds are "supposed" be be classified mainly as a medium build breed with some crossing over to the large size.

The same thing with a wilderness dog. While a smaller dog is going to be able to plow through the thicket they would also put out a lot more effort to cover half the ground that a GSD or larger breed could. There would be a lot of give and take.

As the others mentioned earlier there is also the stellar hunt drive and willingness to work WITH their handler. These qualites are harder to find in some of the smaller sporting breeds. Like some GSD varieties, many other breeds have not been bred to do the work that they were originally bred to do over the last 50+ years. Yes, there are some out there but it seems that MANY breeds have been bred for the show ring and have fewer and fewer breeders focusing on the fundamental working aspects of their respective breeds. This is not something that affects ONLY the GSD breed but many other breeds have the same issues. They can no longer do the job that they were originally "created" to do.

I believe the Labs and Springers that Renee uses for scent work are imported from countries that still use them for their original purposes. So finding smaller working dogs IS possible but it is a challenge to find true working dogs now a days.

Oh and the number one reason Shepherds are still very much used is their awesome versatility.

[ladylaw203]

I work english springers,english working cockers,welsh spaniels, smaller labs and now Goldens. I also work Dutch shepherds Smaller dogs are more agile and for my purposes looking for bombs or working the cadaver dog,I have found smaller to be better. I look for over the top retrieve/hunt drive for the training,rock solid nerve and agility.

[SouthernThistle]

Smaller dogs that were bred to work or be hunters are also successful (as previously mentioned) for SAR. However, most SAR groups have size limits on dogs (for obvious endurance reasons): over a certain size and under a certain size.

I had a debate with a Tibetan Mastiff person online who said that "TMs were being trained and used successfully in SAR." I had never heard of ANY teams using a TM as a SAR dog. Males often top out around 140-160 lbs., and the dogs were bred to be nocturnal guard dogs of temples in Tibet. I could not see handling a 140-160 lbs long-haired mastiff on a Search especially when they don't have the "hunt" instinct, but rather the sit around and wait mentality. When I questioned the breeder for the names and contact info of teams with TMs, I was never answered.

I know my ex's mastiff was 185 lbs ("English" Mastiff) who, if he decided to run off, would run maybe 10 yards then stop like, "oh who am I kidding? I'm not bred to be a runner!"

[jocoyn]

We had someone try to work a mastiff [regular mastiff] and we finally told him we were not going to invest any more energy into the dog - there was zero drive and nobody could read the dog, including the owner.

I really may consider a kelpie or a coolie for a future dog - nice small herding breeds, short easy coat for the south. My own GSDs are on the small side - Grim is 70lbs and very agile. Cyra is 50 - still very agile but not being worked due to the HD diagnosis. I met a kelpie at a seminar and really liked it.

I have seen some very nice field bred labs. ESS to but not most of the American one.