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-   -   Heel and down in motion (http://www.germanshepherds.com/forum/schutzhund-ipo-training/446194-heel-down-motion.html)

Liz&Anna 05-04-2014 10:25 PM

Heel and down in motion
 
So here we are at 8 months

Down in motion (8months) - YouTube

Anna's heel at 8months - YouTube


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Steve Strom 05-04-2014 10:59 PM

Looks like you're doing a lot of good work with her Liz and she's enjoying it. I'd avoid the ball in your right hand though. I know a point can be made that it shouldn't matter. You only mark or reward when she's correct, etc.. but when you go out to do the full routine and that reward isn't coming,,,,,,

She could start wrapping and crowding looking for it over there. Some dogs, maybe that wouldn't happen but it would be easier to just avoid it and keep the ball always on your left.

Cara Fusinato 05-04-2014 11:00 PM

Nice! I actually love down in motion. It's my favorite part of class and one we excel at.

Liz&Anna 05-04-2014 11:05 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Steve Strom (Post 5471778)
Looks like you're doing a lot of good work with her Liz and she's enjoying it. I'd avoid the ball in your right hand though. I know a point can be made that it shouldn't matter. You only mark or reward when she's correct, etc.. but when you go out to do the full routine and that reward isn't coming,,,,,,

She could start wrapping and crowding looking for it over there. Some dogs, maybe that wouldn't happen but it would be easier to just avoid it and keep the ball always on your left.

Sure! I totally see your point, I'm really only able to keep her looking the way I want for a few steps right now until she drops her head to check her footing or she forges, so I'm trying to keep the reward super handy for now, sometimes I do throw it over her shoulder though, not always forward, it just seems to build her drive and produce a bouncier/happier looking heel if she gets that long chase to the ball. I think once I can get her going a bit longer (10 steps?) I can have more time to get her ball out, haha I'm still not as fast as I should either


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Liz&Anna 05-04-2014 11:07 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Cara Fusinato (Post 5471786)
Nice! I actually love down in motion. It's my favorite part of class and one we excel at.

Thank you!! It's actually fun! For whatever reason her down in motion is easier then her sit, more on point/correct each time I ask. I've even started to practice it as i recall her over short distances. BUT her sit, sometimes she hovers or crouches... She isn't actually sitting -__- she fakes it


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Steve Strom 05-04-2014 11:12 PM

Can you hold it on your left shoulder with your right hand? Or put it under your arm? Try going back to one step, sit, and drop it to her? Everything on a line in the correct position, then throw it a couple of times. Does that make sense?

Liz&Anna 05-04-2014 11:18 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Steve Strom (Post 5471890)
Can you hold it on your left shoulder with your right hand? Or put it under your arm? Try going back to one step, sit, and drop it to her? Everything on a line in the correct position, then throw it a couple of times. Does that make sense?

Wellllll I could have :/ if I hadn't already trained her not to look at it, when she moved in the the fuss position she sorta pops up and mouths my hand- she has always done this, with or with out a toy or treat BUT he does not look at the toy or my hand I worked really hard on her when she was a bit younger using the Michael Ellis method and trained her to not look at my hand or the toy... Then I saw videos of people using the toy under there arm (got awesome head position it seemed) so I tried it- no luck! I did it probably 5 sessions, even dropping the ball down, she always looked very surprised as it would hit her in the head -__- hahah

Do you think that she may not heel as well if she sees the ball isn't in my hand?


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Steve Strom 05-04-2014 11:30 PM

Yeah. Its very tough to maintain that attention to your face, looking at you no matter where the ball is. If you do want to use the toy as a target under your arm, you have to go back and let her focus on the toy. A few misses, hold it up high above her head and then drop it to her. She has to learn that before its under your arm or on your shoulder.

simba405 05-04-2014 11:34 PM

I'd hold the ball cupped in your left hand then reward by holding the ball right above her head and letting her jump straight up to bite. Then tug. Then if you want you can fetch out of that. If you're going to throw I'd throw to the side. Throwing forward has no benefit especially when the main problem with attention heeling is the forging. I also sometimes hold in my right hand and reward behind me. Keeps the dog from forging if the reward is never going forward.

Imo the more the dog looks towards your left side the better. Even if you teach to look you in the eyes, during a routine you are looking straight forward and some dogs can wrap around a little to try to look you in the eyes. Imo the left arm pit is the perfect spot for the dog to look.

szariksdad 05-04-2014 11:53 PM

There are 2 things I would try on the heel. First when you call her to heel since she is only 8 months i would step back with my left leg and get her to follow it around and forward to the correct position sorts of open your left side of your body and draw her in to correct position. I would also reward by having the toy on the left other she will do the forging that she is doing now that you say she is doing. Also for the down I would call her to you or reward by going back and standing by her side. Not just always throw the ball and have her run for it. Throwing all the time unless you have freed her from the command can lead to problems later.


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