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Suggestions wanted for our weak nerved 8 month old GSD.

5K views 34 replies 17 participants last post by  msvette2u 
#1 ·
My GSD is 8 months old, and showing weak nerves. Over the past few weeks, he has gone from lying down in the back of my Jeep to barking like a nut at every person, beast, or vehicle he sees. He sounds like he wants to kill everyone. He is good with people when we run across them on walks, and generally acts aloof when they greet him (no aggression), but when in or near the car, he's awful. I'm looking for a crate for the cars. He loves his crate at home, and maybe this will help keep him calm.

When we have people (mostly kids) over, he gets stressed, and has to be put away. It's hard for us, because our other dogs were very relaxed and social, and that's what we were hoping for. I stressed to our breeder (who was recommended by several members here) that our number one attribute in a dog was strong nerves. I take some of the blame because the first breeding we really were interested in didn't take, so we got on the list for the next one (same sire, different mother). I thought I asked the right questions about the mother, and only after we got our dog did I see the breeder fostering the mom out-and requesting home without small kids. Knowing what we wanted, and our family situation with kids, we got a dog from a weak nerved mother. I was expecting the breeder to be more useful to us in picking the right litter, and now it seems they cared more about selling dogs then taking the time or making the effort to properly place them.

What now? My dog has been taken out to busy public areas since he was 8 weeks old, exposed to kids, and dogs (he shows no dog aggression, but gets very nervous when there are more than a couple of dogs around him). Can a behaviorist help? He gets loads of exercise and attention, and is a pretty quick learner. We all love him, and he is loving to us, but we are a bit stressed by all this. We are a family used to taking the dog everywhere, and now we are sort of at a loss. Any recommendations, comments, or suggestions are welcome.
 
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#2 ·
You are in a tough spot. It's very hard to deal with a dog like this, even if you know what you are doing. I would be looking for a good trainer that has dealt with dogs with behavior problems before - I'm not a fan of behaviorists. I obviously haven't seen your dog in action, but suspect this is going to be a case of managing his issues and not fixing them.

As for the car, a crate is definitely in order and possibly keeping it covered so he can't see out might help.
 
#3 ·
Over the past few weeks, he has gone from lying down in the back of my Jeep to barking like a nut at every person, beast, or vehicle he sees. He sounds like he wants to kill everyone.
This (or having people in your house) don't necessarily indicate bad nerves.
It can indicate that the pup needs more exercise as he's grown bored and is noticing things more.
Dogs, when bored, make up "games" and your dog's current game is "oh look, intruders!"
Gently discourage, and crate while in the vehicle.
And exercise the puppy more, especially before going places.
 
#4 ·
Just some thoughts for you. 8 months old is about the time that it is common for pups to go through a fear stage. Is it possible to manage him for a few months, being aware of his surroundings to not put him into stressful situations, but also not make a big deal of it in front of him? This phase might pass as he matures some if you manage it carefully. Then again it might be just who he is but many dogs become fearful around this age and often it passes.
 
#7 ·
He's at that age...gaining independence but not being able to really decipher what is and what is not a threat. Up your leadership(all family must be on board) with NILIF and keep on training him. Don't flood him with experiences, if you have to, stay on the fringe of things. When he reacts in the car tell him "OK I've got it, Quiet" so he knows he doesn't have to be in charge of the world.
As he matures he should slowly figure out that everything is not worth barking/reacting at.
Be firm, fair and keep building his confidence in a way that he knows you have his back....it will take some of his stress/anxiety away.
 
#8 ·
I certainly wouldn't write him off as nervy quite yet...both of my boys were kind of "funny" at that age. Don't baby him and hang in there.
 
#15 ·
I had a behaviorist help me with a dog for crate barking in the car. it took some work but it really did help....I would just park someplace near people and walk out of sight and randomly (frequently come up and reward him for being quiet-you can also do this with marker training) ... we worked it up to people coming up to around the car etc. We think this dog had been agitated in a crate before I got him. IOW I would actively reward the quiet and ingore the barking.

Beau had a little wonkiness around that age...nothing serious, mainly some hackles coming up in excitement and some little wuffs (not even barks) but they all vary. HE was fine before is fine now at about 1.5.
 
#16 ·
First, and it is hard to do, but watch your stress level, it will affect your pup. Easier said then done I realize.

A behaviorist is a good idea, but be sure they have verifiable experience with GSD and large working breeds, talk with current and past clients on their experience and the results. There are good ones out there, you just have to really search sometimes to find them. Be sure you are comfortable with them as well, he/she will be training you to handle your pup.

It appears you are already recognizing your pup's thresholds, your goal is to keep him below his limit. He reacts to people close to the car, park a little further away, slowly decrease the distance as he consistently shows no reaction. Woolf went from acting like a total nutcase in parking lots, stopped at red lights or even just riding in the car to one of ignoring, showing some interest or the fascination for whatever reason of the big trucks.

The kids are the main concern. They move fast, are loud and are unpredictable. Perfect recipe for a bite from a stressed dog. Putting your pup away is the safest thing for the kids and the pup you can do. That may or may not change as you progress through training.
 
#17 · (Edited)
I appreciate every response, thank you for taking the time.

Exercise, or the lack of it is definitely not the problem. My guy get tons of it, mainly hikes in the forest near me, and I don't lollygag in the woods. My wife also takes him around the neighborhood on leash. Not a day goes by where he isn't exercised. Sometimes I question whether it is too much at his age. I don't run him yet, though he runs a lot on his own, it is fast hiking through very hilly terrain.

Good to hear of your similar experiences, Twyla. We took him to my parents today, and hour in the car each way, in his crate. He did great. I always park away from other cars to lessen his stress, and the stress of other people or dogs. Once at my parents he was excellent, until my sister & her family arrived. He was actually good for awhile, until my 14 year old nephew went to the bathroom, and when he came out the dog started barking at him like a madman. They aren't really dog people anyway, so this behavior didn't help. Off to the crate went the beast.

We're keeping up the training. I will admit, I've gotten a bit lax, and need to tighten it up a bit. The NILIF approach looks like a good one, and I'm all for trying it.

Thanks again, I feel encouraged. I'll have my wife read this thread as well, it will encourage her too.
 
#27 ·
Exercise, or the lack of it is definitely not the problem. My guy get tons of it, mainly hikes in the forest near me, and I don't lollygag in the woods. My wife also takes him around the neighborhood on leash. Not a day goes by where he isn't exercised. Sometimes I question whether it is too much at his age. I don't run him yet, though he runs a lot on his own, it is fast hiking through very hilly terrain.

.
What about mental exercise? Some dogs require more mental exercise then physical exercise. Its a different balance for each dog, you just have to find it.
 
#19 ·
BTW...people like to tease dogs in cars, and I've seen it many times.
You may want to cover him up, as others stated, when he's in there especially when you park and go into stores.

People are just idiots, and I've seen people tease and even bark at dogs in their crates or loose in cars!
It's definitely a possibility. We used to take our last GSDs with us and they grew to hate teen boys with those beanie caps or hoodies on.
 
#23 ·
The car thing....I guess I don't really see the problem? My dogs don't act like that but they are in the car a LOT (we travel hours each way for training and regular competitions/tournaments, plus visiting in-laws, dogs coming to work, etc) but I know many GSDs that bark at people and other dogs while in the car but are very well trained, safe, well behaved dogs otherwise. Several of my dog-friends have dogs that will go off at me from in their car and I just tell them to shut it (I could open the door/crate and get them out no problem). I would agree with getting a crate, so the dog isn't damaging the car, but I guess to me just barking in the car isn't necessarily indicative of bad nerves, but maybe there's more to it... These are GSDs, they should be somewhat territorial and protective.

Can you elaborate on this "he gets stressed, and has to be put away"? What behaviors is he doing? How does he act once he's "put away"?
 
#24 ·
In my haste I forgot to mention a couple of things, and our hike today reminded me of one.

Normally when we are out, away from home or the cars, he pretty much ignores people, even in close proximity. However, when they are young kids, he barks at them and his hackles go up. It frightens them and us, and we don't understand it.

The other thing (although today he hasn't done it-maybe a turning point?) is he barks at the t.v. and the computer. He'll run up to either while we are watching something and bark his butt off. Animals, people, doesn't matter. We don't want to have to put him up while we are all relaxing watching a movie. In my mind, it defeats the purpose of having a family dog. Thanks again, CD
 
#25 ·
Have you taught him "quiet" and to settle down in a specific spot, like giving him a dog bed in the room that you watch tv/use the computer? My year-old can be loud at times too, usually he's just being demanding about more playtime. He's told to be quiet, and to go lie down on his bed. He's good about it for the most part, but he also knows what, "You're going to have to be put in your crate" means too, lol, his last chance to behave - which he now does, with a big sigh to go with it.
 
#29 ·
A lot of time it's barrier frustration for the car thing - it's like they are when they fence fight. And it can be fear based too/combo. That way no one will come near me eek. I had a dog who LOVED to do this - loved to pop up and scare the bejeepers out of people. When I was in the car with him, I could stop it, but not when I wasn't. :) So I am not sure how much reinforcing he was doing on his own - it seems like it happened more when I was nearby.

I did a lot of reinforcing of what I DID want him to do, after starting with corrections, which he just blew off - and it's not easy to do corrections while driving but easier to toss some treats back. When he got old, I'd let him do it. :D He loved it.

The crate should help.

For the home stuff, the kid stuff, I would talk to a behaviorist. I like to recommend Suzanne Clothier type trainers, or positive based trainers who might use a clicker - which smart dogs seem to really pick up on. I feel for you on the kid thing, that is too bad, given the research, etc.
 
#30 ·
I think he is a bit young but, honestly, I have no issues with a bark collar on an adult dog in a car crate. Several of our high drive SAR dogs go ballistic about their crates even though they are fine animals with no agression issues. The bark collar, we have found, actually helps keep the dogs from getting worked up in the vehicle and keeps them mellow all the way around.

Like I said, these are adult dogs. Not sure I wouldn't try other approaches with a puppy. Beau has been in his crate in the truck most Saturday mornings since he was a puppy and he actually puts his face against the side of it for my teammates to scratch because he has very nice associations with people and his truck. So even though he barks at the fence in my backyard, the truck is not something he feels any need to defend.
 
#31 ·
Karlo has never barked reactively in his crate in the vehicle(only when he hears gunshot/whips during training or sees protection)
People can walk their dogs by no problem. But with maturity, he doesn't allow people to put their fingers in his crate, it shows in his eyes and he has nipped or low growled when someone has done so.
Bark collars are fine, I'd get one that stims up til the dog shuts up, then you know the level needed. I wouldn't put one on a dog younger than 8 months though.
 
#32 ·
I absolutely positively know that my pups all grow thru different developmental (fear? ) stages and the more I do EARLY on to prepare them, the easier it is to work thru when they 'suddenly' crop up.

http://www.germanshepherds.com/forum/development-socialization/

Vital to all of this is the socialization and instant feedback/assistance I get from dog classes. Going once a week forces me to deal with any/all situations weekly and gives me the tools to work thru them for the next session.

What are your classes doing to help with this? If it's only getting worse than I'd look into a different instructor with more experience in different breeds.

SOCIALIZATION with people and the world is so key for our dogs the first year and I'm also not clear on how many thousands (I'm not so much kidding) of people your pup has been exposed to so far. The more new people and new situations many of our puppies can be exposed to...... and that we guide them thru as calm confident leaders (giving and handing out treats) the less scary and more boring the real world will be. So over reacting in a totally inappropriate manner doesn't even come up when a pup is deeply in the 'we are going into town to walk down Main St AGAIN!' mode.
 
#33 · (Edited)
Teddy (ten months tomorrow) definitely went through this phase, which did take me by surprise. My othewise laid-back, friendly pup barked frantically at people who approached the car, and even barked at a few folks in places like Petsmart.

She's already coming out of it. Petsmart was very crowded yesterday, and we stayed for a while, yet she behaved beautifully. No barking in the car and none in the parking lot. Let people pet her, when I was purposely avoiding people just a month ago.

She also just finished her first heat (a little on the late side, I think?). Frankly, I think she had a lot of pent-up, hormonal-type craziness for a couple of months.
 
#34 · (Edited)
We've socialized him since we brought him home at 8 weeks. He has been to parades, fairs, the beach, crowded downtown, etc, regularly. We just got home from the woods where we encountered a woman with a Lab, Chihuahua, and medium sized mutt, all off leash, and he did fine. Didn't even acknowledge the woman. Back to the car, berserk upon seeing a guy 50 feet away, then at every car on the short ride home. I've got to find a crate for my Jeep. The one we brought him in on Thanksgiving fits in my wife's car, not mine. I took him to Petsmart a few days ago to weigh him, and he did great. This is what confuses me a bit. To reiterate an earlier point, at my parents, he was fine when my sister and family got there. After awhile he began barking at my nephew. In the meantime the marker training continues, and we'll keep working with him.
 
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