I need serious opinions please..

[dgon27]

I have a:
2.5 yr old female GSD
4.5 month old male GSD (my girls pup)
3 yr old Dachshund

Long story short,
My 4.5 month old male GSD has already:

Attacked my Dachshund at home in our backyard. No damage.

Attacked a 10 week old puppy. He was on a line and the puppy got out of his pen and walked up to my dog. The puppy wasn't hurt. Thank GOD.

Has showed aggression towards a boxer, lab and a husky while on leash. I corrected him, so there was no attack. He pretty much growls at every dog that gets near him.

Now for the human encounters:
A 20 something year old girl walked up and asked if she could say hello to my puppy. I said sure. Well, she came within 1 ft of him with her hand down for him to smell and then he starts barking at her.

A teenage boy was petting his head and he snapped at him.

He want nothing to do with anyone but my wife and I.

Bottom line is I love this guy so much, but I don't trust him at all. I take him to my parent’s house and all I can think of is I hope he doesn’t bite them. My trainer told me that he is way too sharp and this guy is always going to be a risk.

My question is, should I give him back to the breeder? Please be honest. Is it worth the risk?

[selzer]

How do you correct your dog when he does these things?

How old was the puppy when you got him?

[KZoppa]

he's 4.5 months old and already doing this?! To me he definitely doesnt sound like pet quality and i agree that he does sound like a risk. Definitely not an animal i would ever have around kids if his behavorior is already like that at such a young age. I mean you could try training and see if he grows out of it but the bigger he gets, often times if training doesnt help, the behavior only gets worse. how has he been socialized? Extensively? or spareingly? Get a second or third opinion from other trainers. Especially trainers who have experience with the breed. Really it depends on what you're willing and able to handle IMO. Personally, myself with a 2 year old and a 1 year old, i wouldnt take the chance. He may eventually be good with all family but as an adult he would be too much of a risk to take out of the house without a very sturdy leash and a muzzle on to prevent him from biting when he did decide to lunge at someone. and no vet would be willing to work with a dog that is aggressive towards what i'm guessing is everyone he comes in contact with except for you and your wife. They work with sick and injured and nervous animals often but even an overnight stay would be considered too much of a risk if that need ever came up. not to mention as he grows, and the problem isnt resolved (or even if it were, he wouldnt be totally trustworthy) thats a serious issue you have on your hands because he could very possibly become a danger to yourself or your wife as well. Then you add in the breed prejudice GSDs have from some people and he really wouldnt be a good example. someone may be able to handle him as he grows but they would have to have some serious experience with dogs such as himself. There is also the possibility that he's just a bad egg of the bunch. It happens despite what people want to believe. We'd all love to blame the handlers for the dogs bad behavior and 99% of the time we're right in blaming the handler but that 1% no matter what, can still just be a bad dog. I'm sorry you're having difficulty with him but after reading your post, i have to agree with your trainer and that he's always going to be a risk.

[dgon27]

I correct hime with a quick tug on his leather lead / choke chain, say NO! and make him lay down.

I have had him since birth. All his littermater left at the age of 8 weeks.

[selzer]

Have you heard from the rest of the litter, are they having issues?

If you have had him since birth, are you the breeder? How would you give him back to the breeder?

I do not like the use of the choke chain here, the quick tug is correct for a leash correction, but at 4.5 months, I generally use a flat collar or a martingale. What I am concerned about that if he is facing something scarey and he makes a response/reaction to the scarey thing -- ie. barking at the 20 year old girl. And you correct with leash pop and saying NO. Then that socialization experience he just got was see something scarey, bark (hey go away!), OUCH!, Yes that WAS scarey!

And soon he will go directly to snap or even to bite when he is scared because he is being taught not to bark.

How to make a dog not bark at a threatening situation is to get him used to more and more situations. Get him near but not overwhelming. I will take puppies to a pet store or in front of a supermarket and not let ANYONE touch them. This is just to get them used to people being around. When they are comfortable with that, THEN I will start to let some of the people pet them -- not the lady with two dogs and three kids, sorry she has too much going on.

I do not like the idea of giving up on a 4.5 month old puppy. If you are the breeder of this litter, are you thinking of dumping him or euthanizing him? I think that if you give him up to ANYONE, that is what you need to worry about. Unless you give him to someone who can work with him, whoever you give him to, will most likely drop him off, or take him to a one way visit to the wood or vet. So be very careful if you care about this puppy.

It is possible that you have a weak nerved puppy. It is also possible that you have a puppy that needs a change in leadership style. Check out Nothing in Life is Free (NILIF) and see if that might work for you. Also, you might do better if you try to tire the pup out mentally as well as physically before taking him out on socialization experiences. Have you thought of what you want to do with the pup down the line, hiking, herding, agility, schutzhund, etc.?

If you did not breed this litter, have you contacted the breeder and asked advice from the breeder?

[Whiteshepherds]

Originally Posted by dgon27

I correct hime with a quick tug on his leather lead / choke chain, say NO! and make him lay down. I have had him since birth. All his littermater left at the age of 8 weeks.

Are you sure you aren't teaching him that when people and other dogs are around bad things happen??

I can't understand why you would use a choke chain on such a young puppy. Has he always been a handful?

[dgon27]

Originally Posted by selzer

Have you heard from the rest of the litter, are they having issues?

I know 2 of the females won something at the recent seiger show in malibu.

If you have had him since birth, are you the breeder? How would you give him back to the breeder?

I'm in a foster/ownership program. I don't fully own the female.

I do not like the use of the choke chain here, the quick tug is correct for a leash correction, but at 4.5 months, I generally use a flat collar or a martingale. What I am concerned about that if he is facing something scarey and he makes a response/reaction to the scarey thing -- ie. barking at the 20 year old girl. And you correct with leash pop and saying NO. Then that socialization experience he just got was see something scarey, bark (hey go away!), OUCH!, Yes that WAS scarey!

I used a flat collar, but get a better response from the choke. Trainer said it was ok. I know what your saying about socialization, but not sure how to make him barking at a 20 yr old girl as a good socialization experience.

And soon he will go directly to snap or even to bite when he is scared because he is being taught not to bark.

I don't think I'm teaching him not to bark, I'm trying to teach him not to bark, bark and then bite someones hand off.

How to make a dog not bark at a threatening situation is to get him used to more and more situations. Get him near but not overwhelming. I will take puppies to a pet store or in front of a supermarket and not let ANYONE touch them. This is just to get them used to people being around. When they are comfortable with that, THEN I will start to let some of the people pet them -- not the lady with two dogs and three kids, sorry she has too much going on.

He goes to my trainers property 3x a week and is involved with many different sounds and sights.

I do not like the idea of giving up on a 4.5 month old puppy. If you are the breeder of this litter, are you thinking of dumping him or euthanizing him? I think that if you give him up to ANYONE, that is what you need to worry about. Unless you give him to someone who can work with him, whoever you give him to, will most likely drop him off, or take him to a one way visit to the wood or vet. So be very careful if you care about this puppy.

He would be going back to the breeder. I am the foster.

It is possible that you have a weak nerved puppy. It is also possible that you have a puppy that needs a change in leadership style. Check out Nothing in Life is Free (NILIF) and see if that might work for you. Also, you might do better if you try to tire the pup out mentally as well as physically before taking him out on socialization experiences. Have you thought of what you want to do with the pup down the line, hiking, herding, agility, schutzhund, etc.?

I have been doing OB with him.

If you did not breed this litter, have you contacted the breeder and asked advice from the breeder?

The breeder said if needed she will take him.

[selzer]

You co-own the bitch, and raised the litter.

I don't get you being a foster at all. Sorry. Foster and adopt go for people rescuing dogs from shelters or puppy mills.

If you co-own the bitch and raised the litter, and sent the puppies to their new homes at eight weeks, then you are the breeder or co-breeder if you like.

It is bad enough that the PETA people and the HSUS people make out breeders to be bad, breeders have no business buying into that.

Fostering a litter, is when someone drops off a pregnant bitch to a rescue or shelter.

If you bought this bitch already bred, then you are the bitch's owner, and the owner of the litter -- maybe not technically the breeder of the litter, but definitely not a foster.

If you are in touch with, in relationship with the breeder of the bitch, then it is not a rescue/foster situation.

Ok, rant over.

This puppy is YOUR responsibility. If you had anything to do with the breeding of your 2.5 year old bitch, the puppy is your responsibility. If you are 100% certain your puppy will be better off with your partner, then do what is best for your puppy. My opinion is that you raised this puppy from birth, behavioral issues, weak nerves, poor socialization is YOUR responsibility.

If you want to be a breeder, then you should start with this puppy in taking responsibility and becoming the expert in behavior and training. Sending it to your partner to fix or deal with or put down is not taking reponsibilty for it. You will learn a whole lot from a tough pup than you will from a compliant easy pup. And if you want to be a breeder, than you NEED to know a lot about behavior and training and management and leadership. Start here.

[Jessiewessie99]

Originally Posted by selzer

You co-own the bitch, and raised the litter.

I don't get you being a foster at all. Sorry. Foster and adopt go for people rescuing dogs from shelters or puppy mills.

If you co-own the bitch and raised the litter, and sent the puppies to their new homes at eight weeks, then you are the breeder or co-breeder if you like.

It is bad enough that the PETA people and the HSUS people make out breeders to be bad, breeders have no business buying into that.

Fostering a litter, is when someone drops off a pregnant bitch to a rescue or shelter.

If you bought this bitch already bred, then you are the bitch's owner, and the owner of the litter -- maybe not technically the breeder of the litter, but definitely not a foster.

If you are in touch with, in relationship with the breeder of the bitch, then it is not a rescue/foster situation.

Ok, rant over.

This puppy is YOUR responsibility. If you had anything to do with the breeding of your 2.5 year old bitch, the puppy is your responsibility. If you are 100% certain your puppy will be better off with your partner, then do what is best for your puppy. My opinion is that you raised this puppy from birth, behavioral issues, weak nerves, poor socialization is YOUR responsibility.

If you want to be a breeder, then you should start with this puppy in taking responsibility and becoming the expert in behavior and training. Sending it to your partner to fix or deal with or put down is not taking reponsibilty for it. You will learn a whole lot from a tough pup than you will from a compliant easy pup. And if you want to be a breeder, than you NEED to know a lot about behavior and training and management and leadership. Start here.

Well said.

[dgon27]

You co-own the bitch, and raised the litter.

I don't get you being a foster at all. Sorry. Foster and adopt go for people rescuing dogs from shelters or puppy mills.

Maybe this will help you understand. The Breeder calls it a "Foster Owenrship Program" Here is a portion of the deal or whatever you would like to call it.
The family may choose to have the litter at their house or have us take the female to have the litter with us. All cost of breeding are covered, if the family chooses to keep the litter at their home, they are supplied with any and all required mateirals. For their time, effort and costs families are given a precentage of each litter profit(litter profit minus our cost). The female will retire at 6-8.5 years old. The female is then spayed and Ownership is then transferred to the foster owner.

If you co-own the bitch and raised the litter, and sent the puppies to their new homes at eight weeks, then you are the breeder or co-breeder if you like.

Ok co-breeder. Does it really matter. I started this post for advice. AKA seek counsel because I don't know what to do.


It is bad enough that the PETA people and the HSUS people make out breeders to be bad, breeders have no business buying into that.


Fostering a litter, is when someone drops off a pregnant bitch to a rescue or shelter.

If you bought this bitch already bred, then you are the bitch's owner, and the owner of the litter -- maybe not technically the breeder of the litter, but definitely not a foster.

If you are in touch with, in relationship with the breeder of the bitch, then it is not a rescue/foster situation.

Ok, rant over.

Thanks

This puppy is YOUR responsibility. If you had anything to do with the breeding of your 2.5 year old bitch, the puppy is your responsibility. If you are 100% certain your puppy will be better off with your partner, then do what is best for your puppy. My opinion is that you raised this puppy from birth, behavioral issues, weak nerves, poor socialization is YOUR responsibility.

I know my puppy is my responsibility. That is why I am asking for help, opinions, advise. Do you think it is an easy decision to make. Have you had a puppy behave like this? If so, please tell...

If you want to be a breeder, then you should start with this puppy in taking responsibility and becoming the expert in behavior and training. Sending it to your partner to fix or deal with or put down is not taking reponsibilty for it. You will learn a whole lot from a tough pup than you will from a compliant easy pup. And if you want to be a breeder, than you NEED to know a lot about behavior and training and management and leadership. Start here