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-   Pregnancy, Whelping & Raising a Litter (http://www.germanshepherds.com/forum/pregnancy-whelping-raising-litter/)
-   -   3 weeks!! (http://www.germanshepherds.com/forum/pregnancy-whelping-raising-litter/388514-3-weeks.html)

pwillow 12-30-2013 09:10 AM

3 weeks!!
 
Hi I have a friend who's gsd became pregnant on accident (puppies are mixed) Now I hear they are trying to get rid of them at 3 weeks old.

I was under the impression this was too soon but 3 weeks would be this Saturday. They told one of the girls coming out that some people wait till 5 so they can see personalities etc.

But I did not think this was the reason to wait 5 weeks. I thought it was more of a medical thing but perhaps I am wrong. I don't want to upset her if I am wrong by suggesting she keep them for longer so I'm just not sure.
I guess 3 weeks could be okay..

Any help!

Eiros 12-30-2013 09:31 AM

Puppies learn a lot from other pups and their mom during this time.

The fact that it is illegal in many states to separate a pup from it's mother until 8 weeks should tell you something... 3 weeks seems unimaginable to me!

Please encourage her to wait until 8 weeks or more!!!! And check the laws in your state (if in the US)


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pwillow 12-30-2013 09:36 AM

I live in NYS, I looked up this info and it says it's illegal but I don't know where to go from there if I tell her and she still doesn't care.

also the law says "pet dealer" so wouldn't this be like a store or business

http://www.animallaw.info/articles/o...ysaletable.htm

Yeah so I guess it's not Illegal in her situation. The litter is 12 but that's not more than 25 per year out of the house shes staying at.

Pet dealer: any person who engages in the sale or offering for sale of more than nine animals per year for profit to the public. Such definition shall include breeders who sell or offer to sell animals; provided that a breeder who sells or offers to sell directly to the consumer fewer than twenty-five animals per year that are born and raised on the breeder's residential premises shall not be considered a pet dealer as a result of selling or offering to sell such animals

GSDlover143 12-30-2013 09:42 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by pwillow (Post 4742346)
I live in NYS, I looked up this info and it says it's illegal but I don't know where to go from there if I tell her and she still doesn't care.

also the law says "pet dealer" so wouldn't this be like a store or business

http://www.animallaw.info/articles/o...ysaletable.htm

Yeah so I guess it's not Illegal in her situation. The litter is 12 but that's not more than 25 per year out of the house shes staying at.

Pet dealer: any person who engages in the sale or offering for sale of more than nine animals per year for profit to the public. Such definition shall include breeders who sell or offer to sell animals; provided that a breeder who sells or offers to sell directly to the consumer fewer than twenty-five animals per year that are born and raised on the breeder's residential premises shall not be considered a pet dealer as a result of selling or offering to sell such animals

I would not be very nice. Honestly I'd call on her. 3 week is just too early!!

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lhczth 12-30-2013 09:47 AM

They are far too young and shouldn't even be weened at this point. They are barely mobile. She should keep them until at least 7 weeks though 8 is better. Doesn't sound like your friend really cares about the welfare of the puppies she created so not sure anything you say to her will make a difference. I would suggest you highly recommend that she spay the female ASAP so this doesn't happen again.

GSDlover143 12-30-2013 09:48 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by lhczth (Post 4742426)
They are far too young and shouldn't even be weened at this point. They are barely mobile. She should keep them until at least 7 weeks though 8 is better. Doesn't sound like your friend really cares about the welfare of the puppies she created so not sure anything you say to her will make a difference. I would suggest you highly recommend that she spay the female ASAP so this doesn't happen again.

I'd recommend that and report this" friend" I'm sorry but she is ignorant and needs to care more about these puppies.

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pyratemom 12-30-2013 10:00 AM

Three weeks old is too young to leave the litter and mother. Pups learn a lot from the socialization of the litter, including bite inhibition. They are likely still nursing at this age or should be. Eight weeks is considered acceptable but I believe even 12 weeks is better. Of course they are cute and cuddly at 8 weeks and easy to get rid of, but three weeks is too young. And, if your friend is selling these puppies then she is a dealer, no matter what the law says. If you are selling something then you are in business - she is a backyard breeder whether accidentally or not. She needs to have her female spayed to prevent "accidents" from happening if she is going to be that careless. I know friends don't always take advice but you would be doing that litter a favor by pointing out to her the young age she is separating them will affect their personality for the rest of their lives. With no litter socialization and no learning bite inhibition, the dogs could grow up to be a problem and you didn't say what the cross was. Does she even know?

dawnandjr 12-30-2013 10:14 AM

Like others have said, 3 weeks is too young. They should still be nursing and should now be started on kibble (I would suggest RAW, but we know that wont happen). This is the time frame puppies start becoming work for the human, and hence why she wants to get rid of them. See if you can find a rescue willing to take the entire litter and keep them til they are 8 wks and adopt them out to responsible owners. Where abouts in NYS are you? Or even if the rescue would be willing to educate the owner on how to properly raise the puppies and maybe help with food for them. Do you know what they are mixed with? Reason for asking is you have two breed rescue resources to go to if you know the fathers breed.

pwillow 12-30-2013 11:10 AM

She is in Syracuse... I agree that if you are selling puppies that makes you a breeder but it would seem according to the law statute that you're only a breeder if you're selling more than 25 a year out of your home which would not make her in violation of that law

She texted me like a week before they were born she didn't know that her dog was pregnant. I told her to feel for them on the belly she felt them kicking.

I tried to give her as much advice as I can but even though I've suggested using this website (many times) I don't think she has based on the action


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pwillow 12-30-2013 11:24 AM

Cross is a Mastiff.

When I first found out about it she was asking if anyone knew where to buy a blow up pool this time of year. I knew she just found out she was pregnant so I made a joking comment on the status about if she was considering doing a water birth...that's when I found out she was going to use it for the dog!
I sent photos of a proper whelp box and tried to explain the logic behind bumpers but yeah..


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