BBS being registered as GSD's. Your thoughts? - German Shepherd Dog Forums

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Old 02-22-2012, 01:43 AM   #1 (permalink)
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Default BBS being registered as GSD's. Your thoughts?

As some of you may have heard, the FCI now recognizes the Berger Blanc Suisse as a distinct breed of dog. The FCI also recognizes the German Shepherd Dog.

The AKC and GSDCA have said that Berger Blanc Suisse coming into the US will be registered with the AKC as German Shepherd Dogs. (the AKC does not recognize the Berger Blanc Suisse) This has already been done, although it's only been a few dogs at this point. (this have been verified and acknowledged by the AKC)

The justification for doing this is that the Berger Blanc Suisse shares a common ancestry and DNA with the German Shepherd Dog. While this is true, the FCI considers the two breeds to be distinct and different and they have different standards. The AKC has said that the dogs are German Shepherds going by another name.

Do any of you have an opinion on this?

I believe it's wrong for several reasons but was interested in hearing how GSDCA members and other GSD owners feel about it.

Do you believe that importing Berger Blanc Suisse and adding them to the GSD gene pool will help to advance or improve the breed?

Do you believe it will have negative impact?

Do you believe that the GSDCA has the breeds best interest at hand when it supports the importation and registration of what could be hundreds if not thousands of dogs over time, when these dogs carry a disqaulifying fault?

Thanks in advance for your responses.
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Old 02-22-2012, 01:47 AM   #2 (permalink)
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Good Lord help us. The Berger Blanc Suisse has it's own Gene Poll, they may have originated from the GSD but they have worked and fought hard to gain FCI recognition and have their own standard now. To make them GSD's will only ruin what all those people have worked for.

I don't get the AKC. The FCI does one thing, the AKC does the exact opposite...
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Old 02-22-2012, 03:52 PM   #3 (permalink)
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This is why the AKC is not an official member of the FCI. They have always done their own thing.

Of course the people importing these dogs are allowing the AKC to make this decision. They need to fight to have the breed recognized for what it is and not just accept what AKC is doing. They have a choice. Does the UKC recognize the BBS? Many breeds have gone that route until they were able to get AKC recognition for their breeds.
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Old 02-22-2012, 04:23 PM   #4 (permalink)
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I know the AKC's biggest issue with it is that two brown GSDs can have a white puppy and then what would you register that dog as? I'm not sure as to the particular differences between the breeds, but from a novice perspective its pretty hard to tell the difference between a white shepherd and a BBS.
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Old 02-22-2012, 04:26 PM   #5 (permalink)
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I don't think it will have any impact on the GSD breed in general.

Most folks won't breed to them anyway. (Except for those that breed white GSDs.)

I agree with Lisa.
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Old 02-22-2012, 04:28 PM   #6 (permalink)
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This is MY understanding of the situation. The BBS was created from white GSDs imported to Switzerland from the US and Canada. After 20 generations without further importation of dogs from outside of Switzerland, the BBS was born. Here in the USA, white is still considered a disqualification (since the 1960's). To allow the seperation of dogs from the GSD gene pool based on a disqualifying fault is not good. There will still be colored dogs carrying the white factor and so there will still be white GSD's born. Can white GSDs from here be imported to Switzerland and registered as BBSs?
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Old 02-22-2012, 06:38 PM   #7 (permalink)
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But they are still German Shepherd dogs Genetically, Am I Correct?
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Old 02-22-2012, 06:41 PM   #8 (permalink)
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It doesn't matter if they were or weren't. The white GSD was not accepted since it was a fault and some people have fought hard and long to get them the recognition they wanted.

The American GSD originated with the German as well and yet they are so far away from what the GSD should be that some call for a split.

Let them have their own Breed Standard. Let them have the recognition they deserve and please DON'T mix them with the GSD over here...
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Old 02-22-2012, 10:09 PM   #9 (permalink)
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This isn't about the white coated GSD's in the AKC leaving the breed although I support that happening. It's about the bizarre things that happen in the dog world.

The BBS fought long and hard to create a new breed. They didn't do this so the AKC could turn the dogs back into GSD's.
This is a different breed, different structure, different temperament and they only come in white. They aren't GSD's.

I think the AKC needs to explain why this was done instead of turning down the registration and I'd like the GSDCA explain if this was something the AKC did before contacting the GSDCA, or after it was done. (in other words, who made the decision to turn BBS into GSD's, the AKC or the GSDCA?)

Here's part of the BBS standard, does this sound like a GSD to any of you?
UTILIZATION: Companion and family dog.


CHARACTER: Lively and balanced temperament, enjoys action, attentive with good ability to be trained. Friendly and discreet. High social competence and devoted to his owner. Never afraid or aggressive without provocation. A joyful and easy to teach working and sporting dog with capability for all round education. High social competence allows for a marked ability to adapt and integrate to all kinds of social events and situations.

Aggressive and overly shy is considered a disqualifying fault.
************************************************** **********
If the breed of a dog was determined soley on the basis of it's DNA and ancestry, the FCI wouldn't have approved the BBS as a new and distinct breed.
On the same note, if this was the only criteria for determining the breed of a dog the SV would have white dogs. The SV doesn't say white is just a fault, they say the color does NOT exist in the breed. So much for DNA and ancestry.

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Of course the people importing these dogs are allowing the AKC to make this decision. They need to fight to have the breed recognized for what it is and not just accept what AKC is doing. They have a choice. Does the UKC recognize the BBS? Many breeds have gone that route until they were able to get AKC recognition for their breeds.

You're right and I don't know what their reason was for doing it.
I'm sure the AKC has been approached about accepting the BBS. I know we'd like to import one but won't do it until the UKC or AKC accepts the breed. Right now the UKC accepts the White Shepherd but not the BBS. I'm guessing they'll be quicker to accept the BBS than the AKC.
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Old 02-23-2012, 06:39 AM   #10 (permalink)
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I really don't have an opinion in this matter. I was just asking a question.
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