German Shepherds Forum banner

"Real" Protection Dogs

12K views 43 replies 19 participants last post by  Jack's Dad 
#1 ·
I sometimes get requests from people looking for a "protection dog" that run the gamut from a dog that will alert to the presence of a stranger, or to alert on command, or to bite on command...and further yet: dogs that will engage in a realistic situation.

As some discussion starters:

What do you feel a dog should be capable of to be considered a "Real" protection dog? Sleeve? Suit? Hidden sleeve? Muzzle work?

What kind of scenario based training do you engage in to fit your lifestyle?
 
#2 ·
I think it's important to define the mission of the dog in determining the extent of the training. For a dog that has an expectation of real engagement and sustained tactical use....then all of the training with aforementioned equipment should be instituted. Strong work in different places and different surfaces should also be trained. Defense of vehicle, buildings, and handler should also be incorporated, IMO.
 
#4 ·
Is this discussion for police dogs, personal/private use or both?

I like what cliffson1 wrote about training in different places and different circumstances. Our 1st trainer had protection classes. I often wondered if those dogs in the classes would only perform at the facility.

Our 2nd trainer has trained dogs to fiercely bark on command, definitely looks very scary, and a good deterrent. The dogs were on leash so this type of protection work could be done in a variety of situations.

I personally would not want my own dog to be trained to actually bite as part of protection work. I've seen a local K9 officer go through a drill with the ESU and he warned the officers that sometimes K9s might bite an officer in all the excitement of pursuing someone and advised the officers to relax and not over-react if bit. So I would not want to take that chance with my personal dog.
 
#5 ·
I really like KNPV style training. If I were to train a PPD, I'd go with those methods. I like the search and guarding exercises. Everything is done off leash so obedience is very important as well.
 
#7 · (Edited)
thanks for sharing the video! I was at a seminar with some Dutch LEO and trainers and they aren't fond of GSD's....said they are full of HD and weak nerves. lol
Then one of them worked Karlo and a couple other GSD's. The size of the GSD was more than they are use to, and I could tell that was another reason they are more into the Dutch/Mal's!
 
#8 ·
There are some great GSD's out there...there is no disputing that. I like seeing a KNPV GSD, since it is a sport dominated by Mals and Dutchies...mostly crosses, actually.

It is always hard to determine with *any* sport evaluation though...how much is the dog/genetics, and how much is training and/or conditioning the exercises...
 
#9 ·
right, but I think the Dutch dudes are a bit biased to the smaller structured dog. I tend to agree, the dogs they breed are so stealth and athletic for what they work them for. When Karlo was worked by the decoy, the decoy was pretty worn out, and I could tell K's 90# frame was more than he was use to...kind of like the IPO helpers working the rotties.
 
#10 ·
I sometimes get requests from people looking for a "protection dog" that run the gamut from a dog that will alert to the presence of a stranger, or to alert on command, or to bite on command...and further yet: dogs that will engage in a realistic situation.

As some discussion starters:

What do you feel a dog should be capable of to be considered a "Real" protection dog? Sleeve? Suit? Hidden sleeve? Muzzle work?
All the above. Like Cliff said, they are all tools that should be used.

What kind of scenario based training do you engage in to fit your lifestyle?
I have done scenarios like:
1) I get a knock on the door (at home) my dog jumps on the door barks (you know the usual things most people want there dog trained to not do). I recall my dog off the door/entry way and have my dog in a down stay behind me and when I answer the door I get attacked or after a short conversation I get attacked and the dog engages.
2) I get home, the front door to my house is open or tampered with. I turn on my dog tell person to come out. If they don't I send dog in to search or I bring dog in on lead to search. Usually depends on the level of training for the dog and handler.
In the quote box in blue are the only things I could think of at the moment.

Tim thanks for starting some threads I'm actually enjoying reading.
 
#12 ·
There's a whole world out there in tactical uses of the dog in protection work. Often when you introduce environmental challenges, heights, water, fire, enclosed surfaces, planes,trains,buses,and extreme rubble, you would be surprised at how the dog reacts and the amount of dogs that either shut down or function so tepidly as to not be effective. A strong PPD I think should be introduced to as much of the routine world as possible for exposure.
 
#15 ·
Tim that is why a few of us have been placed on a police k9 committee FoR the USCA. We are designing a new title as WPO/DPO was eliminated. We are designing something that us not an arbitrary routine and puts real pressure on the dog in order to hopefully be a decent test of breed worthiness. Wish us luck.....
 
#20 ·
Excellent. I look forward to seeing what you guys come up with and I hope it is well supported!!
 
#21 ·
Me too. I like many of the SDA exercises but their trials are so few and far between. There hasn't been one in MI since fall of 2010 despite two different clubs keep telling me they are planning them. I don't consider my dog a "personal protection dog" but I like training outside the box (ie, not just SchH exercises and will my dog release a sleeve before I speak the "s" in "aus" sort of thing).
 
#22 ·
My dogs are mainly used as a first line of defense to give me time to get to my main object of defense. I use them mostly as a deterrent in my vehicle and in and around my home/farm so my training revolves around these areas. I mostly do IPO and then add in suit and hidden sleeve work.
 
#23 ·
To me, just having a GSD with you is kinda like walking around with a shotgun. It may, or may not be loaded but most people aren't going to try to find out.

I personally don't feel like I need protecting from my dogs, so not something I really put a lot of thought into. (I'm normally more worried about protecting people from my dogs lol:))
 
#31 ·
I'd love to go after that title with my male. If there's one thing he is exceptional at, its taking any amount of pressure and keeping a clear head
 
#32 ·
Hunter, I really love your male! :)

Lisa- does your club do hidden sleeve, suit, or muzzle work? These are all things I'm interested to see if Grim would like to do. I'd also like to keep secondary options open for him. I was told his background would be good for PSA, but of course there's nothing like that around here to do. He's not old enough yet, anyway, but if things change in the meantime that would be GREAT!!
 
#33 ·
Once the dogs have good obedience and control plus have progressed well in the SchH work we often do some suit work. Depends a lot on the dog. The hidden sleeve work I have done separate from the club and both our helpers have also done. Unfortunately I have never had a chance to do muzzle work though I would love to with Deja. She would be brutal.
 
#34 ·
That sounds great! (I honestly didn't mean now, or even near future) One thing I'm afraid of is a dog that gets so focused on a sleeve they won't bite anywhere else, including a hidden sleeve. If you even do put Deja in a muzzle, I'd like to see it, too. :D
 
This is an older thread, you may not receive a response, and could be reviving an old thread. Please consider creating a new thread.
Top