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Thread: Why am I starting to see more and more dogs in the grocery stores? Reply to Thread
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Topic Review (Newest First)
05-20-2014 08:22 PM
volcano I was at the grocery and two people were walking out with puppies. I asked and they got them from the meat dept, I think the grocery stores are puppy mills and thats why you are seeing more dogs in the grocery store...
05-20-2014 02:49 PM
Gwenhwyfair I've actually been involved in some of those licensing threads. I commented that we'd rather cater to the lowest common denominator then incentivize and reward those who would put the effort in to do better. There is a punitive nature to this country.

Having said that this really wouldn't be an insurmountable problem to solve, but if it isn't solved the problem will only get worse.

But that's so boring, when matching outfits are so important and business owners can be bullied with impunity.

Quote:
Business owners also face problems. In August, Russell Ireland banned a dog from his Oxford, Mass., diner after its owner put a plate of food on the floor for the dog.

James Glasser claimed it was a legitimate service animal and took part in a boycott of the diner. There was talk of a lawsuit. Ireland apologized. The dog's actual status is unclear.

Cook Justin Fisher said his boss' reputation took a beating. Business is just now returning to normal.
Not all those involved in the Service Dog world are so unfair.

Quote:
There needs to be a standard, said Jennifer Arnold, founder of Canine Assistants in Atlanta. "The sticky part is who will do the testing and what will be the criteria for allowing dogs to be considered assistance dogs."

An ID card might be the simplest answer, she said, adding that she doesn't think the loss of privacy will be the big issue that some think it will be.
Fake service dogs a growing problem - NBC News
05-20-2014 11:12 AM
martemchik
Quote:
Originally Posted by Gwenhwyfair View Post
The problem is the system is way too adversarial. As I have learned the last couple of days that is in large part due to SD owners themselves.
It’s not the SD handlers…its everyone. It’s today’s American culture. I’m not sure how many times I run into someone who does something because it’s their legal right to do so without any worry about actually caring if its morally okay. Tons of times people believe that if they have the legal right to do something, it doesn’t matter what kind of a human being they’re being.

Unfortunately, we probably all do this in our day to day life. Like, I can recall how someone didn’t want dogs walking on their front lawn and actually confronted a neighbor about it…well, IMO…you just ruined a relationship with someone that is probably going to live there for a while and there is a chance you’ll need them for something at one point…but your “personal property” was more important and you can’t have a dog walk through it for 30 seconds.

The funny thing about licensing/testing…look up some “dog license” threads. See how people feel about those…and those are just regular pets. People hate the government telling them what they can and can’t do, or paying even a nominal fee for a license that they don’t believe is necessary.
05-20-2014 10:59 AM
Gwenhwyfair The problem is the system is way too adversarial. As I have learned the last couple of days that is in large part due to SD owners themselves.
05-20-2014 10:33 AM
martemchik
Quote:
Originally Posted by gsdsar View Post
Ok. So maybe ignorant question. Why would people, with and without, a disability be against a formal certification? Why is this a problem? I know not all dogs are trained for the same things, but being able to demonstrate skills and basic manners for an impartial judge? Why is this not done? It would not disqualify owner trained dogs, it could even be a minimal fee, to pay for evaluators. That way, if questioned, all that needs to be shown is a cert card.

Not trying to be difficult, just a question.


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This is actually a very simple answer which lies at the basis of the law…to ask someone to prove/test that something they need for a more normal life is in effect discriminatory which is exactly what the law is trying to prevent. It’s all about not making people have to jump through hoops and do extra steps. The people the dogs are helping are already disabled, what’s the point of making it more difficult to get help?

There was a person on here about a year ago that was on a panel or an organization of some sort that was trying to put together a more inclusive guideline for service dogs that they were going to try to present to law makers and try to get pushed through as an addition to the current law. Unfortunately, like all things made in a committee or by an organization, it sounded extremely exclusive and from the get go you could easily tell that no one in the service dog community, from trainers, to handlers, to breeders, would ever agree on a more detailed set of guidelines or requirements.
05-20-2014 10:06 AM
Gwenhwyfair This is what is needed. More peer pressure from within the community of SD handlers for consistency and standards and professionalism.



Quote:
Originally Posted by Cheyanna View Post
I do ask. If I see a person with an "SD" with a misbehaving dog, I will say something to them. I live in a county in Ca that actually issues a license for SD. I ask if they have one and show them Fiona's. I tell them that they make it harder on people like me. "Thanks for making my life harder than it already is."


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05-20-2014 09:56 AM
Gwenhwyfair Ya know as a small business owner I can say when you hear them complaining about the cost of regulations one of the biggies that is one of the few overbearing federal regs that affects almost all brick & mortar establishments.... ADA.

Then you add on to that SDs that aren't held to any standards, PC gone overboard so you can't figure out if someone is even faking it with their pet dog, a lack of professionalism amongst what are supposed to be working dogs, disabled people suing businesses, no easy visible ID because they want to be able to have "outfits that don't clash" with their dogs, the ever increasing reasons dogs can be classified as service dogs, it's getting so onerous as to be unsustainable.

No wonder businesses and citizens are starting to feel taken advantage of, not to mention the costs involved being passed on to all of us.

If SD owners don't start thinking about reaching out and meeting people and businesses in the middle here, adhere to some standards, the whole system is going to collapse.

It's hard enough to get a business up and going in this country and to not think about how to make it easier for businesses and the public to comply while meeting the needs of people who REALLY need a SD is illogical, unfair and self defeating.
05-20-2014 01:13 AM
Cheyanna
Quote:
Originally Posted by counter View Post
Back from visiting multiple grocery stores up in Boise, and no supposed SDs seen today. Oh well! I'm all for real SDs in any and every store, but my blood boils when I see obviously fake SDs being taken where they aren't allowed, and then the fact that no one else seems to see them or care to do anything about it. I'll volunteer to be the one who asks the questions, especially in defense of all of the people with real SDs.

And like many of you have stated previously, not every disability can be seen or understood externally. I have worked around many with PTSD and other military-related disabilities, and you would never tell just by looking at them.

I do ask. If I see a person with an "SD" with a misbehaving dog, I will say something to them. I live in a county in Ca that actually issues a license for SD. I ask if they have one and show them Fiona's. I tell them that they make it harder on people like me. "Thanks for making my life harder than it already is."


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05-20-2014 01:05 AM
Cheyanna
Quote:
Originally Posted by gsdsar View Post
Ok. So maybe ignorant question. Why would people, with and without, a disability be against a formal certification? Why is this a problem? I know not all dogs are trained for the same things, but being able to demonstrate skills and basic manners for an impartial judge? Why is this not done? It would not disqualify owner trained dogs, it could even be a minimal fee, to pay for evaluators. That way, if questioned, all that needs to be shown is a cert card.

Not trying to be difficult, just a question.


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Some things Fiona does for me cannot be tested. She grounds me when I get a dizzy spell. But I cannot predict when it is going to happen. My employer wanted this test. I said how about the 5 firemen who saw her keep me upright when I got hit by a dizzy spell in the grocery store testify. But all SD can be expected to at least pass CGC.


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05-20-2014 01:01 AM
Cheyanna
Quote:
Originally Posted by Serbrider View Post
Exactly. That's like saying you want an electronic wheelchair/scooter because you'd like to go everywhere without having to walk.



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That is so annoying. My cousin told me that she wished I could go every where with her, because I have handicap parking. I told her I wished I could walk without pain and falling. She did not get it.


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