|03-03-2014 05:36 PM|
Thank you for your input, I understand what you are saying about
finding the working level for your dog and guiding it to wanted
behavior and or away from certain acts before they start. I am a
simple pragmatic man, hence my method, while what I did worked
fantastic for Dex, I see the downside to it with the wrong dog.
There is no doubt a prudent person would be wise to become
familiar with your insight and methods.
|03-03-2014 01:06 AM|
Deno if this is your only use of the Ecollar, you're only scratching the surface of what can be done with the tool. Many people, perhaps most, use the tool as you describe here, only for delivering remote corrections, and they are very happy with the results, as you seem to be. The problems come if the dog doesn't understand what the stim means, and that is not uncommon. When this happens I've seen people (and one of them has been mentioned here) who simply crank it up higher until the dog successfully guesses what is desired. But that guessing can take time and cause undue stress and discomfort to the dog. It can also result in the dog developing irrational fears that come from making improper associations. Most of my work is done at the level of stim that the dog can first perceive.
My methods were devised to prevent this from happening. They involve guiding the dog into the desired behavior and then shutting off the stim, rewarding the dog for doing the right thing. That way the dogs don't get stressed and the work goes faster. I use the collar to teach with, not just to give corrections.
|02-16-2014 04:53 PM|
I have always understood e-collars to be used as a correction when a known command is not followed, such as what Deno has stated. That just makes sense to me. However, before I purchased the e-collar, I read up on how to use it and discovered the whole low stim while saying the command (Lou Castle's method).
Anyways, I purchased the Dogtra 1900 and signed up to Lou's website and I began training his method with my dog (15 month female). So far, it has been going well. Although, I am not sure how well, because my dog already knows and obeys the commands (sit, down, stay, here) prior to me using the e-collar.
My intention with the e-collar is simply to reinforce the commands during high distraction / off leash. My concern with the e-collar is the dog becoming collar smart and only obey when the e-collar is on. I have read Lou's approach to weaning the dog off the collar and I plan on following that when my dog is ready.
Thanks for the discussion and feedback.
|02-15-2014 10:23 PM|
I had one video of him on another subject, but my wife destroyed it.
We have neighbors who ran into some serious insurance issues with their
2 well behaved Rottweiler's, no biting problems or anything like that, it
was just for having them. Thanks for the kind words, I had forgot how funny
the look on my face was when the cart hit my truck.
|02-15-2014 09:57 PM|
Nice truck. (The oops was funny )
Any videos of him doing bitework?
|02-15-2014 09:28 PM|
He was heeling off the lead at around 4 months.
Copy of Dex @ Feeder's Supply - YouTube
|02-15-2014 07:54 PM|
To DPC, the OP
I would love to see a sit down side by side comparison of the various methods. Some are 'trade secrets' but I think they would "sell" more seminars/videos etc if they revelaled the "secrets" a little as Lou Castle does because we all know there is no real substitute for doing this kind of thing one on one with a mentor.
|02-15-2014 07:46 PM|
|jocoyn||I hope to get it Monday night and if it is not the right tape I will order it.|
|02-15-2014 07:38 PM|
Biggest difference is leash pressure work that is done, the way Michael Ellis teach it. Lou Castle doesn't layer ecollar over leash pressure. The leash pressure, if I remember correctly (been a while), is learned first to teach the dog how to respond easily into the various positions/commands. After that, layer in the ecollar at the same time as leash pressure so that the dog learns what the stim is for. After the dog adjusted to the ecollar you won't need the leash pressure. There is more steps the way ME teaches it and is the protocol I followed.
ME teaches the continuous stim also but just mentions that some dog may respond better to nick, so that you find what works best for your dog. My dog works with nick, not continuous because that is what she responds better to.
The recall ecollar tape by ME is excellent. I think Leerburg released a new ecollar training tape that is more comprehensive by ME as well. Haven't watched this one myself.
|02-15-2014 06:54 PM|
The Michael Ellis recall video covers his e-collar layering over the recall. If you are interested in a video Nancy, this may be the better choice for your requirements. The e-collar section isn't in depth, but you already know how to find the working level and the basics of escape training, so I think you would be fine with just the recall video.
OTOH, if you can borrow the e-collar videos, the price is right
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