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Thread: Is paper training in x-pen interfering with overall housebreaking? Reply to Thread
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Topic Review (Newest First)
12-17-2013 02:21 PM
Sansa's Mom
Quote:
Originally Posted by MichaelE View Post
Try monitoring her water intake. Control it if necessary and watch to see how long it takes for her to eliminate after drinking.

She may be emptying the bowl at one sitting while you aren't looking.

As another poster mentioned, some puppies take longer for it to 'click'.
This actually may be one of her issues, my husband keeps moving her water bowl into her crate. I think that the ability to drink at will is making her pee schedule sporadic.

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12-16-2013 08:59 PM
MichaelE Try monitoring her water intake. Control it if necessary and watch to see how long it takes for her to eliminate after drinking.

She may be emptying the bowl at one sitting while you aren't looking.

As another poster mentioned, some puppies take longer for it to 'click'.
12-16-2013 07:01 PM
Sansa's Mom
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mary Beth View Post
I wonder if it all started back at the breeders with the area of wood shavings that she used for a potty which is why I recommended the book because that will sometimes happen with puppies purchased from a pet store which is discussed in the book. It seems to me that she got the idea to keep her area clean, but as you said anything else was okay to pee on and never really learned to hold it. It is one thing to hold it in the crate because she isn't moving -it is the movement that triggers it. I suggest you move the crate closer to the door - have her walk outside - don't carry her. As she gets better - move the crate further away. That way she will learn to hold it inside while walking. To teach her to hold it longer try to take her out for a good walk and playtime - then when you come inside for just a short time - walk her around tethered to you or brush her or play with her- offer water - and put her inside her crate for 45 minutes. Again after that time - let her out of the crate and have her walk to the door. Gradually increase the amount of time. I also wonder if going back to Mary's post - the paper training or in your pup's case, the wood shave training would be better, providing she has access. If she had access - say there were wood shavings on a peed pad by the door or in the x-pen with the door open was left by the door - if she would go in there and not pee on the floor.
I will look into the Evans book and see what they say about housebreaking pet-store puppies. For moving her crate closer, I think I can do that some of the time-I have a two story house and all of the bedrooms are upstairs, so it would be difficult to move it towards the door for her morning pee. But when we are downstairs in the family room I am able to make her walk out by herself (on a leash, usually) so I can try doing that during the times we are downstairs. I don't want to re-incorporate the wood shavings just yet because ultimately I want to break her away from that completely.
12-14-2013 04:41 PM
Mary Beth I wonder if it all started back at the breeders with the area of wood shavings that she used for a potty which is why I recommended the book because that will sometimes happen with puppies purchased from a pet store which is discussed in the book. It seems to me that she got the idea to keep her area clean, but as you said anything else was okay to pee on and never really learned to hold it. It is one thing to hold it in the crate because she isn't moving -it is the movement that triggers it. I suggest you move the crate closer to the door - have her walk outside - don't carry her. As she gets better - move the crate further away. That way she will learn to hold it inside while walking. To teach her to hold it longer try to take her out for a good walk and playtime - then when you come inside for just a short time - walk her around tethered to you or brush her or play with her- offer water - and put her inside her crate for 45 minutes. Again after that time - let her out of the crate and have her walk to the door. Gradually increase the amount of time. I also wonder if going back to Mary's post - the paper training or in your pup's case, the wood shave training would be better, providing she has access. If she had access - say there were wood shavings on a peed pad by the door or in the x-pen with the door open was left by the door - if she would go in there and not pee on the floor.
12-14-2013 12:28 PM
Sansa's Mom I do clean it with an enzyme cleaner, not natures miracle but another brand (who knows if it's actually working) also I have the enzyme carpet powder for vacuuming. Maybe I need to start doing the bells on the door thing so she will learn to alert me. I've been thinking about it and she is crate trained, knows what to do once outside, but the missing link is her not alerting me. I was reluctant to do it bc i think my cat will ring them all day.

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12-14-2013 10:44 AM
TAR HEEL MOM What do you clean the soiled spot with? If you are not completely removing the smell (just because you can't smell it, doesn't mean she can't) then they will continue to go there time and again. Honestly, I have found that this is the biggest mistake most people make in housetraining. You need to buy an enzymatic product like "Nature's Miracle" (there are several brands on the market) and clean up as directed. Even on seemingly impervious (tile, etc) floors. I give this same advice to every new adopter when they take a puppy home

Good luck!!
12-14-2013 02:41 AM
Sansa's Mom
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mary Beth View Post
The Evans Guide to Housetraining your Dog by Job Michael Evans - you may find the book helpful. It discusses situations like you have. My Sting was easy to train but I did keep him on a leash attached to me when he was inside, mainly because of the cat, but it did help as I was right there to observe the signs . I think also, and this is discussed in the book, is that the pup needs to know that it is wrong to potty inside. A sharp "no" pick her up and take her outside - praise her when she potties. I didn't use treats at all for potty training - but only praise. The book also discusses this. I hope it is still in print, or you can get one from your library or interlibrary loan. The author was one of the Monks of New Skete and was one of the authors for the first edition of "How to be Your Dog's Best Friend." I also think you may want to be sure your children are all on board with the training program since you mentioned before that they get home earlier and let her out.
Thanks for the advice, but I am already doing all of that, which is why i'm stumped. This is my 5th puppy and 2nd gsd puppy. At home she is either crated or tethered to me, she'll be one foot away from me and pee without warning. She gets taken out every 30 min or so, plus after play, meals, and sleep. I go out with her and give praise and treats. When I catch her in the act I give a loud NO and clap my hands loudly before scooping her up and taking her out. She actually continues peeing even if I scared her, and peed on me once while I picked her up mid-pee. So yeah, i'm at a loss of why she isn't progressing at all.
If anyone else has had this experience please share what you did. Oh also, my kids are on board. My older son is 12 and he keeps her tethered to his belt and takes her out frequently with our "pee" command.

Basically, she understands not to go in crate, and understands to go once outside, but wont alert us in any way if she has to go inside.
12-13-2013 10:07 PM
Mary Beth The Evans Guide to Housetraining your Dog by Job Michael Evans - you may find the book helpful. It discusses situations like you have. My Sting was easy to train but I did keep him on a leash attached to me when he was inside, mainly because of the cat, but it did help as I was right there to observe the signs . I think also, and this is discussed in the book, is that the pup needs to know that it is wrong to potty inside. A sharp "no" pick her up and take her outside - praise her when she potties. I didn't use treats at all for potty training - but only praise. The book also discusses this. I hope it is still in print, or you can get one from your library or interlibrary loan. The author was one of the Monks of New Skete and was one of the authors for the first edition of "How to be Your Dog's Best Friend." I also think you may want to be sure your children are all on board with the training program since you mentioned before that they get home earlier and let her out.
12-13-2013 05:01 PM
kiya I set up my pup in the puppy proofed kitchen and have always put down wee pads or paper and never had a problem. I would much rather have a pup go on paper than on the bare floor and track it all over. It never took long for pup to end up not using the paper at all which always make my husband very happy since he is the first one home.
12-13-2013 04:50 PM
Sansa's Mom bump for an update...

I have done away with the x-pen so that she doesn't get confused with paper training, and have just been crating her while at work. She has really come to love her crate and often crates herself if she is tired or if the kitten is bothering her. Every time I take her out of the crate, I carry her outside with a treat, and she now goes to the bathroom on command in the yard. I stay outside with her for 10-15 min each time and make her go a couple of times to make sure she is empty before I bring her in, but...
she still keeps going in the house! She still gives no warning, we'll be playing or something and she'll just squat and pee where she stands. She seems to regard everything outside of her crate as fair game to be peed on. She knows that she gets a reward for going outside, a couple of times she has even "faked it" by squatting down for a couple seconds pretending to pee, and then coming to me like "where's my treat?". What is the deal? I wouldn't sweat it if she was progressing gradually, but nothing has changed at all. Have any of your dogs done this before, and what did you do about it?
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