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Thread: Uh oh...here come the requests for Mali pups...lol Reply to Thread
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Topic Review (Newest First)
08-29-2014 10:25 AM
Blitzkrieg1 If you want a PPD / estate protection that does it naturally from day one I would look at this type of dog.. No one is abducting anyone with this guy on the loose. First time doing protection at 2.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HgdZ...A3BAqmUdJhTpRA
08-29-2014 07:26 AM
car2ner I made a facebook comment on that. How often do intruders come into your house with a full camera crew? The whole set up is unusual for the dogs to start with. I don't know if my pup would bite an intruder but since he loves bite work in IPO, I think he'd go after a bad guy in a sleeve just for the fun of it.

Now how many intruders would break in wearing a bite sleeve? hmmmm
08-29-2014 04:33 AM
DJGinger I think Shepherd is enough for me thanks.. though Mal look deliciously less fuzzy Heh.
I fear as this Shepherd girlie matures the answer is not to "if she will bite" but "if she can be called off" without training....
I am actually busy suppressing these urges while trying not to affect the confidence.
She doesn't approach immediately but she does not back up. Some smart arse was cutting between yards last month and when Mellie stopped 20 feet away to woofle; made a rawr-arm up- stomp. Not good idea. She went low, almost creeping or stalking but fast; right at him. I wish I could have taken pics, she was standing tall with feet placed like a sprinter at the blocks, tail flagged.
Had she decided "meh" to recall that moment (which we were just out doing ..thank goodness she knew I had treats)? Or had I been all the way in kitchen? It might have been ugly. My son is non verbal, he couldn't recall without visual. She didn't bark again, she just snarled like an asthmatic evinrude and said "rawr" back.

I made a post some time ago about her machissimo attitude at young age. She is still fearless. More fearless. She only "backs" from family.. and it is pouty reluctant obedience.

She is not particularly aggressive. Squirrels, cats, loose dogs. Catch her baleful gaze, but get no action (she does hate birds... probably because they can come thru top and side fencing to steal her food. Also didn't like snake she killed and totally wants piece'o possums) She is food aggression free, though that needed some training when it first came up at 6 months. Went from begging to aloof about strangers. Makes exception for young children.

Melasa is not coming up as predicted. Much higher drive. More than my show Brittany's without the high strung sensitive streak they had. She is likely showing her grandmum's patrol lines. Daddy dog has a few whelps in service work, but the breeder primarily has about 20 of her dogs placed in law enforcement locally when there are many competing protection dog schools and breeders seeming around. I could place Melli back with the breeder but she is really is a good dog.. just maybe not the one to pass the academy test week for being a full service dog.
Plus my son's condition is all about trust and continuity. Melasa is part of his world. Another dog can be incorporated but removal .. it was rough enough when the original service dogs were poisoned. Specially his therapy dog of 4 years. We only had Sara 5 months. I do need to train her not to take food from anyone that is not family. I haven't taught a dog that in years and she is a breed with unfamiliar ways. My son has permanent preference to dark dogs especially black and tan. Melasa outgrew those markings but had them long enough to be accepted. My fiance loves her and she kisses his feet when he visits from Poland. *sigh* She stays even if flunked.

She still needs tons of training and has bad habits of youth (bitey grabby mouth, occasional jump ups), but is particularly protective of him. Is not moved by loud noises, sudden movements or threat. Since I use target training with clicker, she doesn't fear sticks either. She used to cower with men but outgrew that.
I know I will have to find some job for her with that energy and drive if she washes out. Maybe competitive work of some sort.
08-23-2014 02:42 PM
Gwenhwyfair Yeah it was very, very sad. Actually it was when someone found and identified her dog that gave the police an important lead in tracking the man down.. It was too late though.

Yes, that's what I meant about guarding and protecting.

IMO most dogs won't bite for either purpose.

I can see it with my crew. Autumn our Aussie will bark but that's it. Smitty will bark but can be easily won over. Ilda is the one with the most natural suspicion and she won't take treats from strangers either.

Whether even she would bite I don't know. She's been tested up to the point of standing her ground, putting up one heckuva a show at barking, but that's it. So even with her I'm reluctant to say she would bite to protect me or property or territory. I just don't know.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Blanketback View Post
That's such a horrible story, the poor woman these crimes are getting out of hand!

Maybe I'm differentiating too much. I'm not talking about true protection, but instead about a territorial aggression. One of the perks of a GSD - that the territory belongs to them and they take it seriously. If I wanted a PPD, I'd actively look for one, and not just assume it can be trained in without the character of the dog being taken into consideration. Agreed
08-23-2014 02:31 PM
Blanketback That's such a horrible story, the poor woman these crimes are getting out of hand!

Maybe I'm differentiating too much. I'm not talking about true protection, but instead about a territorial aggression. One of the perks of a GSD - that the territory belongs to them and they take it seriously. If I wanted a PPD, I'd actively look for one, and not just assume it can be trained in without the character of the dog being taken into consideration. Agreed
08-23-2014 02:20 PM
Gwenhwyfair Yeah I agree there's a lot of variables. One of them is the breed. My greyhound had zero protection in him.

I also think that because of the liability of a dog that bites most breeds/breeders have really selected for dogs that won't bite humans.

So from a general perspective I feel pretty comfortable saying most dogs won't bite out of a sense of guarding or protection, at all and it's because they've been bred to be that way.

A few years back a young woman was hiking with her lab and was attacked and abducted. She put up a fight as she was trained in martial arts. The lab didn't protect her at all and the kidnapper took the dog too and later let it go.

She didn't make it, sadly, he murdered her in the end.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Blanketback View Post
Too many variables, lol Which dog would bite first: the dog with the low threshold and weak nerves, I'm going to guess. Or, not the ones being PPD/IPO trained, lol. In other words, my dog might not be able to save my electronics -not stand up to the B&E challenger- but that doesn't mean my neighbor isn't getting jumped on or nipped if he's in my back yard looking for DH's tool box. I think you know what I'm saying.
08-23-2014 02:11 PM
Blanketback Too many variables, lol Which dog would bite first: the dog with the low threshold and weak nerves, I'm going to guess. Or, not the ones being PPD/IPO trained, lol. In other words, my dog might not be able to save my electronics -not stand up to the B&E challenger- but that doesn't mean my neighbor isn't getting jumped on or nipped if he's in my back yard looking for DH's tool box. I think you know what I'm saying.
08-23-2014 01:57 PM
Gwenhwyfair No- I've learned from my experience and being around trainers who work protection and bite sport dogs that most dogs won't bite if they can retreat instead. They just don't have that strong of a guarding/protection instinct, they really don't.

That's why we see these "will my dogs protect me" videos where in the vast majority of cases the dogs retreat with just a little bit of pressure. I think one had a Rottweiler in it and the dog totally failed. He barked but that was it.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Blanketback View Post
I'm just thinking that gib laut's account of his pup biting his friend isn't really all that out of the ordinary, in what I think a typical dog would do, in a high percentage of cases. If someone comes in out of the blue, and isn't directly challenging the dog, that person gets told to leave. If someone comes in and makes the dog know a huge ordeal is coming the dog's way (a friend wouldn't act like that, lol) then I'd agree that most dogs are going to choose flight over flight. That's actually how I keep the loose dogs from harming my dog - it's mental warfare and most dogs avoid it.
08-23-2014 01:50 PM
Blanketback I'm just thinking that gib laut's account of his pup biting his friend isn't really all that out of the ordinary, in what I think a typical dog would do, in a high percentage of cases. If someone comes in out of the blue, and isn't directly challenging the dog, that person gets told to leave. If someone comes in and makes the dog know a huge ordeal is coming the dog's way (a friend wouldn't act like that, lol) then I'd agree that most dogs are going to choose flight over fight. That's actually how I keep the loose dogs from harming my dog - it's mental warfare and most dogs avoid it.
08-23-2014 01:39 PM
Gwenhwyfair I guess what I am trying to say is that for most dogs the extent of "protection" is barking and some won't even do that and the reason is they aren't bred for it.

RE: response to gib lauts statement why "any dog wouldn't".
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