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Topic Review (Newest First)
05-10-2014 12:16 PM
Ellimaybel Update: Gunther is just fine. Took him to the vet to make sure and it's a minor scratch not nearly as bad as it looked at first. Both dogs are fine, and I understood why you had suggested re-homing Cyclone. I did come off sounding like I despised him forever in the original angry post.
05-10-2014 12:05 PM
my boy diesel when i typed my advice to rehome i was reading this
He hurt our puppy and now we have to spend more money on Gunther because the stupid little dog wants to act tough. I'm sick of his trying to dominate Gunther. He will never be allowed out of his crate with Gunther again. I'm so mad I feel sick
the op explained they were just upset when they typed that
but i cannot imagine a dog living where there is open hostility to it

now that op has calmed and said she actually loves the little dog i gave other advice
keep them separated
figure out the triggers and prevent issues from arising and also separate them using a gate so the older dog can have respite from the pup
that is how i do it in my home but i also understand how dogs think and prevent issues rather than assuming issues wont come up
05-10-2014 04:44 AM
Anubis_Star There is no reason to rehome an older dog for correcting an annoying puppy. That is absolutely horrible advice without further effort put forth.

6 year old Zeke got a good correction on Berlin when Berlin was 9 months old. Berlin tried to steal Zeke's bone in the back yard. Zeke snapped at him, Berlin submitted, altercation was over. Boy was I ever mad at Zeke that night. I learned, they do not have toys together now. There has not been an issue since.










You need to get the help of an experienced trainer. Saying your dog can't learn and change because he's 6 - that's a very naive and dangerous way of thinking as well. Old dogs can DEFINITELY learn new tricks, and they can at least learn obedience and manners. Just because he's been a solo little thing doesn't mean he's allowed to be a crotchety old grouch. And puppies can definitely learn obedience and manners. And, treats/toys should never be out with both of them.
05-10-2014 12:45 AM
huntergreen i doubt you are going to be able to solve this with out pro help.
05-09-2014 09:56 AM
petite I have a beagle/rat terrier and a GSD pup and this is my lingering worry. I'm sorry this happened, I would be devastated as well. Daisy ignores Fawn for the most part and has no problem telling her to back off with an air snap and snarl. I try hard to correct Fawn for barking in her face for play Daisy has no desire to engage in. That's our biggest struggle.

I'm glad Gunther is going to be okay and this is a reminder for me to be extra diligent to keep the peace around here between the girls.
05-08-2014 01:09 AM
KZoppa
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ellimaybel View Post
Perhaps keeping one or both tethered while working on this behavior in the yard and house? That way with a dog in each hand (if I can handle it) I can keep them separate yet train together? Gah!
no. tether them both so you can be sure to maintain a safe distance between them. If you are holding the leash of one, the other is free to move into the treat zone. You don't want this until they can both remain chill during treats in their respectful zones. One being tethered and one not can actually serve to create a bigger problem. Make sense?



Gunther Tethered Here ____________space____________Cyclone here

there is enough space between that they cant reach or thieve the others treat but still be close enough to be worked together.

Hopefully someone else can explain it better than I'm currently able. Feel free to PM me if you wish. I can probably explain better after some sleep.
05-08-2014 01:05 AM
Ellimaybel
Quote:
Originally Posted by KZoppa View Post
okay, I cant find it. Basically, make each time they are out together a positive experience for both of them. Be sure to keep an eye on them and stop and correct anxiety causing behaviors in either dog. Gunther gets too rowdy, stop the behavior before Cyclone can. For anything involving treats and training together, as I mentioned previously, tethering them to help keep them out of each others reach, can help so nobody gets hurt. Cyclone will still be able to see that he'll still get a treat. DO correct for bratiness when treats do come out though. You mentioned he gets into a punk mode about it.

Teach Gunther that Cyclone enters the house first. Teach him to backup on command as well a sit and wait. If Gunther is taught to back up and sit and wait until Cyclone passes, that can help alleviate a great deal of stress on that particular side of it for Cyclone.

You basically have to train both dogs. In Cyclones case, you have to train/retrain him that you make the rules and they both have to respect them. Minor corrects are acceptable and normal behavior but over the top corrections can reasonably be met with corrections of their own from you.

I apologize if I'm not explaining adequately. I do much better demonstrating than explaining, especially when its 1 in the morning where I am lol. I will continue to try to find the video I referenced earlier or one similar for you so you have a visual to go off of.
Makes perfect sense. Gunther goes in and out first, but always stops and looks back to let Cyclone run out ahead of him. Sometimes I hold him in place to let Cyclone get a head start lol. Thanks for all the tips, I'm going to work on this slowly but surely.
05-08-2014 01:04 AM
KZoppa
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ellimaybel View Post
I was out in the yard one day training Gunther with treats and noticed Cyclone was following the commands along with him. You reminded me of that day, and now that I have remembered it I feel I should do more of that. Poor Cyclone does get stepped on sometimes and I look out for it. Correcting Gunther when he's interfering is hard because Cyclone thinks I'm correcting him and stop coming. Then when I encourage Cyclone he's ok, Gunther thinks he is too. At this point I have to laugh because I'm realizing how frustrating and ridiculous this may sound to others. One moment I feel like I need to keep them separated and the next moment I feel like I should do more with them together. I think I'll go bang my head on a wall now.

no, we get it. Some more than others. Believe me. Remember to take time with them individually to work with them too. Gunther will likely learn as he gets older to better watch himself and his positioning around Cyclone. As he learns his size and better control of it, he'll should become more mindful of Cyclone. As far as training together, correcting one and the other thinking they're in trouble, its tricky. Training separately can reinforce your individual bond. Training together can actually turn into a competition for who can do the trick the fastest to get the treat first. Does that make sense?

Best example I have right now with the time, my mentor trainer had two pitbulls. She would work them individually and then together. When she worked them together it was races. One race would be who could back up to the wall the fastest? The one to touch the wall first, got the treat first. Sit - first butt planted on the floor got the first treat. Down, stand, etc. It got so they were lightning quick in performing the actions for the commands given and it became harder to judge who would get rewarded first so they'd get rewarded at the same time.
05-08-2014 12:58 AM
KZoppa okay, I cant find it. Basically, make each time they are out together a positive experience for both of them. Be sure to keep an eye on them and stop and correct anxiety causing behaviors in either dog. Gunther gets too rowdy, stop the behavior before Cyclone can. For anything involving treats and training together, as I mentioned previously, tethering them to help keep them out of each others reach, can help so nobody gets hurt. Cyclone will still be able to see that he'll still get a treat. DO correct for bratiness when treats do come out though. You mentioned he gets into a punk mode about it.

Teach Gunther that Cyclone enters the house first. Teach him to backup on command as well a sit and wait. If Gunther is taught to back up and sit and wait until Cyclone passes, that can help alleviate a great deal of stress on that particular side of it for Cyclone.

You basically have to train both dogs. In Cyclones case, you have to train/retrain him that you make the rules and they both have to respect them. Minor corrects are acceptable and normal behavior but over the top corrections can reasonably be met with corrections of their own from you.

I apologize if I'm not explaining adequately. I do much better demonstrating than explaining, especially when its 1 in the morning where I am lol. I will continue to try to find the video I referenced earlier or one similar for you so you have a visual to go off of.
05-08-2014 12:54 AM
Ellimaybel Perhaps keeping one or both tethered while working on this behavior in the yard and house? That way with a dog in each hand (if I can handle it) I can keep them separate yet train together? Gah!
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