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Thread: Ditching the Gentle Leader, on to a FurSaver & CC Reply to Thread
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  Topic Review (Newest First)
05-22-2014 10:13 AM
Anubis_Star Lastly prongs don't choke the dog. They allow for an even and precise distribution to be felt around the dogs neck that allows for an obvious correction that does NOT cause pain unless severe enough. And many dogs will simply self correct when they hit the end. I did a lot of "flee market" walking with berlin when I first put him on the prong.

Holding the leash fairly short, gave him less than 6 inches so hr had to stay close, I kept my thumb in my pocket and my fingers holding on to the seem of my pants so the leash position with my body wouldn't change. Then I just pretended like I was walking around around a flee market. First fast, then slow. Stopping frequently. Looking around. Changing directions. I always turn my head in the direction I'm going before I change my direction so the dog can take a cue from that and follow.

There was no choking, no pain, he self corrected when he didn't pay attention and keep up. Simple.

As far as distraction, you need to work on way more engagement so YOU become more exciting. Lots and lots of play, with tugs are great. That way you should be able to call the dog off a lunge because coming back to you is going to be more fun.

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05-22-2014 10:11 AM
lyssa62 I bet I have the biggest plethora of gear on this forum. I've bought it ALL -- and it came down to the ONLY thing that has worked is a prong collar. I wish I had all the money I wasted on the other stuff.
05-22-2014 10:04 AM
Originally Posted by Lita View Post
Agreed. Which is why I am moving away from a head collar. A paradox arises though. Lita is somewhere between 9 and 18 months, as near as I can figure. You can treat/praise/reinforce for good behavior. How do you train a dog (large puppy) without giving a correction, whether it's a twitch on a head collar or a short tug on a neck collar, to let the dog know that behavior needs to change?

Some of the responses here are counter-intuitive.
There's no reason you can't start giving mild corrections at that age for known behaviors. By now hopefully you have a verbal correction she knows (no or uh uh for example), start combining that with with a slight leash pop

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05-22-2014 10:02 AM
Anubis_Star It's going to be pointless to train in class one way and at home another.

As well pet smart is far from decent training....

Why don't you find a private trainer in your area that will work with prongs?

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05-22-2014 07:51 AM
Originally Posted by David Winners View Post
I believe the snap of the dog's head when hitting the end of the leash on a head halter is far more dangerous to the dog than the pinch of a prong collar. JMO
I totally agree. Also, my dog had the fur rubbing off on her nose from her Gentle Leader, and my vet said she sees a lot of eye and neck injuries from them (it was irritating my dog's eyes).

My dog also would shut down in a gentle leader (literally curled up in a ball and wouldn't move), but is happy in a prong. It's funny that so many people think prongs are unkind, but my dog was *much* happier to wear that!

OP, a fur saver won't stop pulling. The links don't slide all that easily, I don't find it much different than a flat collar that way, my dog will pull like a freight train in her fur saver. Try a prong. You can remove links to make it fit. It should be relatively snug, and sit high on the neck, behind the ears.

I would use a fur saver as a backup to a prong though

You didn't fail your dog at all, don't be silly! You guys are a work in progress!
05-21-2014 08:53 PM
Bonzay Have you tried something like this?
Maybe you could train in your home and trigger her prey drive using a ball?

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05-19-2014 10:00 PM
kjdreyer Please don't feel as if you've failed, you deal with the dog you have, not always the one you particularly wanted! In my opinion, it's also kind to communicate clearly how you expect the dog to behave. Check out these links on prongs from a balanced trainer:

and maybe watch this one first, David Winners posted it a while ago, I think it's beautiful!

Good luck and have fun!
05-19-2014 06:22 PM
Decision Made

After talking with a relative who has had GSD's all of her life and our trainer, I ordered a Prong and a backup Fur Saver today. I'm out of options, and the Petsmart trainer endorsed a prong for her. What does that tell you?

I feel like I have somehow failed.
05-06-2014 09:44 AM
Liesje No brainer to me, use a prong. If she has all her adult teeth and is lunging at animals, she's old enough for one. You can either correct her yourself, or let her self-correct, but if she's not that soft, you may have to correct her, plenty of dogs will pull into prong just like they will any other flat collar. Praise her when she's right, correct her when she's wrong.
05-06-2014 05:51 AM
NancyJ The fur saver is terrible as a correction collar. The links are too big to get a good crisp correction. The smaller the links the better the correction with a properly fit non stretchy nylon (NOT what they sell at Petsmart!) one being the best (JMO from the days I taught with choke collars.......I used what they now call the "dominant dog collar" ( a snug snap slip) but you would go through several if the neck is still growing.

Second vote for a properly used and fitted prong but it sounds like you don't have any experience with one. Leerburg site has some good info on fitting a prong and we could help with that. Same thing with the prongs. Herm Springer is the best. But don't use a prong if you don't fit it properly.

I have used Halti's and Gentle leaders as well (Positive only methods) and the dog had FULL ability to pant so I am not sure how you are using it unless the dog is pulling into it but I like the prong a lot better.

For the pulling and general excitement, I think you need to spend more time on engagement in a non distracting environment . FWIW, I carry water on my walks. No biggie.

If a 9 month old cannot adjust adult food, I think you have a different problem. GSDs are a notorious breed for having sensitive digestions. A lot of puppies are never fed puppy food as the formulas are not all that different, particularly on the nicer foods as long as you stay away from the super high protein and calcium blends.........under 30% on the protein and under 1.5% on the calcium with about equal calcium and phosphorus is pretty typical for large breed dogs until fully grown.
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