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Thread: What titles make a dog breedworthy? Reply to Thread
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Topic Review (Newest First)
04-10-2014 08:56 PM
glowingtoadfly I must exonerate my dog's former owner, who I have been in contact with. My girl was not undersocialized. She was just a bear of an adolescent.
04-08-2014 05:37 PM
cliffson1 A reputation is only as good as the dogs and results that come with it. It is very difficult for the new by these days, but individuals with reputations must have the dogs/knowledge/training to merit the reputation. Now that is hard for the newby to determine, I admit, but people who are consistently producing and training very good dogs have results to sustain their reputation. I think that people who have read this forum for years intuitively know who is knowledgable about the breed....not because of " who" they are, but because of the content of their posts. I may not like a person's delivery of information, but I would never allow myself to discount quality information because of my likes or their style.
It's the same with breeding titled or untitled dogs, there are people who can breed quality animals without the titles, there are people who are breeding poorly with super titles on the dog. The difference is the marketing of the dogs bred to the public. It is much easier with the titles, but at the end of the day every dog has to stand on what it is, and if it is a quality dog my opinion or nobody else's changes that, and if it is a dog lacking the qualities of the breed, no opinion is going to make it better.
04-08-2014 11:37 AM
martemchik A lot of people build up reputations and become "untouchable." You can see this happen on the forum as well. People just entering the world, or even people just purchasing puppies are led to those types of people and no one asks questions. No one dares to challenge, if they do challenge, they themselves get attacked, or even extradited from the world by those that have been doing it for years. And without those contacts, its quite hard to make a name for yourself.

I've seen it happen in real life, and plenty of times on this forum. Anyone that is "new" gets told to get a "good mentor." Well...how is one supposed to know what a good mentor is if they don't even know what to look for? But say they find a mentor, that's doing something "questionable" and they learn that that's the way to do it, well they're going to do it that way and when 10 years later some new person questions it, they're going to respond with, "I've been doing this for 10 years! What do you know?" And the cycle continues...

Ruby, your last line..."only the lazy &/or uninformed would settle for a mere glance," is exactly the problem. 99% of the market for dogs is just that...and any "breeder" (knowledgeable or just money hungry) can realize that and take advantage.
04-08-2014 11:10 AM
RubyTuesday Lisa, I almost kind of sort of agree with you. IF I planned on breeding I'd be doing some sort of titling or performance activity just to meet with & learn from other knowledgeable people out there. HOWEVER a glance at the conformation rings convinces me that judges & the public are some ghastly combination of stupid, indifferent & INSANE. In various breeds noses have disappeared, gross obesity reigns, coats are so abundant they require hours for routine grooming, bizarre wrinkling compromises skin & even vision, legs aren't merely short, they're twisted, bowed & splayed and too often temperaments range from cringinging piddlers to snarling, snappy curs. Irish Wolfhounds & Great Danes don't routinely display any of these conforamtion/temperament problems-Yayyy-Ooops! they have a tendency to die at 5 or 6, sometimes even younger. Ditto show line Goldens & Boxers.

You can convince me (& fairly easily) that these experts know a great deal more than I do BUT why oh WHY aren't they using it to breed sound, healthy, long lived dogs????? IF all that they know doesn't follow through on what they DO, what they PRODUCE, then what good is it really?

I'm not opposed to titles. In fact, I'd look for sports titled dogs if I planned to participate in those events, but until I'm convinced that titles will help me get the dogs I want, I'm not particularly interested in them. They can indeed say 'something' but alternatively they can hide a great deal as well, much like health clearances, which give one a valuable peek into the dog, but it's still only a peek. Only the lazy &/or uninformed would settle for a mere glance.
04-05-2014 05:11 PM
glowingtoadfly
Quote:
Originally Posted by lhczth View Post
No title makes a dog breed worthy. What they do is "keep us honest". What I mean by that is that it puts the dog out there for others, judges and the public, to see and evaluate.

While I agree with David, MOST breeders have neither the knowledge nor the experience.

In the USA, though, all of this is moot. Breeders can do as they want.
I don't think it is moot to a good breeder.
04-05-2014 02:55 PM
Sabis mom While searching for my next puppy I stumbled across a bitch that I fell in love with. She was well titled, imported from a well known kennel. When I was conversing with the breeder I happened to mention that I liked her. The breeders response was that she was a great bitch, awesome to work and delightful at home, but sadly she produces rather erratically. She commented that although she has a stunning pedigree herself, a breeding that should have produced amazing pups, produced nothing more then pet quality at best. Yet a breeding with a full sister and the same stud produced awesome pups. Genetics, one must remember that something from generations back may rear it's head at any time. A good breeder can stack the deck, but nothing is guaranteed.
04-05-2014 11:05 AM
lhczth No title makes a dog breed worthy. What they do is "keep us honest". What I mean by that is that it puts the dog out there for others, judges and the public, to see and evaluate.

While I agree with David, MOST breeders have neither the knowledge nor the experience.

In the USA, though, all of this is moot. Breeders can do as they want.
04-04-2014 10:03 PM
onyx'girl
Quote:
Originally Posted by David Winners View Post
IMO, if the breeder is training and testing their dogs appropriately, the title is not necessary. If the breeder knows the dog has what they want in their program, along with the experience to make this decision about what it is they see in the dog/pedigree, then the title is moot.

It all comes down to trusting the breeder though.

from: http://www.germanshepherds.com/forum...ml#post5326993
But the buyer needs to understand the appropriateness or a breeder can just give them a song and dance. If the dog is never tested off their property or put thru some stress or pressure, how can the buyer decipher what is appropriate?
It is up to the buyer to do their research and know what the breeders focus and goals are in their program....what they've produced in the past and if those goals are being achieved.
I have heard many excuses from breeders who are breeding dogs with the minimum or no titles.
I'd rather not support those excuses and go with a breeder that is working, sweating and putting effort into their program to prove the focus and goals.
04-04-2014 09:17 PM
glowingtoadfly Thanks David! I agree.
04-04-2014 09:15 PM
David Winners IMO, if the breeder is training and testing their dogs appropriately, the title is not necessary. If the breeder knows the dog has what they want in their program, along with the experience to make this decision about what it is they see in the dog/pedigree, then the title is moot.

It all comes down to trusting the breeder though.

from: http://www.germanshepherds.com/forum...ml#post5326993
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