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Thread: Some concerns I have about starting ecollar training Reply to Thread
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Topic Review (Newest First)
03-27-2014 12:56 PM
Sri
Quote:
Originally Posted by Lee Taylor View Post
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Thanks Lee Taylor . Yes, I understand how efficient a tool the ecollar can be, If/when I decide to use it I will definitely find a good trainer. More than anything, right now he is at an age where I can't take him offleash, and in the summer our family is out in the nature quite a bit.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Chip18 View Post
[/url]
Chip18, thanks I did see these videos from when you posted them earlier in response to someone else's question . they've helped me get better too.
03-26-2014 11:48 PM
Chip18 Not going sat I'm opposed to the E collar but as others have said you need to know what your doing.
Maybe these links are helpful?

03-26-2014 11:06 PM
Lee Taylor
Concerns

Sri,
Haven't read Lou's e collar info but I train with E collars and will share some of what I know 1st hand.
To begin with not all e collars are created equal!! Again, not all e collars are the same. I only use Dogtra but what is imperative is that you need many levels of stimulation. Some Dogtra models have 100, some models have more.
The last thing you want is a piece of junk that has 6,8,10 or 12 levels. They hurt like **** once above the 1-2 level! The last thing we're trying to do is cause pain or any type of fear. Please don't even consider such. Yet that is typically what is sold at the big Pet stores.
The goal is to start training ( the come command is always the 1st command I begin with as this is the easiest way for a dog to learn , in essence, how to turn off the stim and get rewarded with verbal praise ) with the absolute minimal stimulation ( lowest level) required to get your dog's attention thus to comply with the command given. I Begin with a long line and call the dog 'come'.As soon as I have your dog's attention and he / she is following the command the stim stops and I enthusiastically give verbal praise. Make it fun. Typically, doesn't take too many reps ( even if the dog has never been taught to come before) before your dog clearly understands what is being asked. It is amazing to see how effective it is when a competent trainer does it. The come command is the foundation for e collar training so put in the reps and don't be like so many owners that are amazed at how "awesome" or "easy" it is that they don't perform countless reps. This is where you gain confidence and timing but most importantly where you use positive reinforcement / make it fun for your dog.
Remember the emphasis is on rewarding the desired behavior, yet you have the ultimate, immediate correction device (using the minimal amount of stimulation) to get your dog to focus / refocus.

Much like a gun, an e collar in the right hands is a beautiful thing. An e collar in the wrong hands or used by someone with anger issues or incompetence is a disaster waiting to happen. I swear I don't wish to get in a debate but it is my experience and opinion that an e collar is the most effective and efficient way to teach basic obedience and solve behavior issues ( when in the hands of a professional that knows how to use it properly). I chuckle when others claim they'd put their training method up against it..especially teaching 'HeeL' ...if they only knew!! As far as bullet proof recall..it is the ultimate peace of mind in ANY distraction.
03-22-2014 10:37 AM
Arlene/Archer
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sri View Post
A lot! And it is very encouraging. Wish you lived closer!


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That would be fun! Well, enjoy your lovely dog and best of luck with the training, be patient, be consistent and have fun.
03-22-2014 10:32 AM
Sri A lot! And it is very encouraging. Wish you lived closer!


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03-22-2014 10:24 AM
Arlene/Archer
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sri View Post
Oh how wonderful! He looks gorgeous even from the back. Love how he is watching the swans curious but relaxed. I would love to teach Frodo all of this with the whistle. Right now he will run where I am pointing and stop and turn when I say 'there'. Actually I don't know how he got that, just evolved from playing i guess. How can I teach him this? Any link to a video or guide much appreciated. .


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Heh, a few seconds later he was all, 'ah yes, swans, good day to you, I'll be on my way in a moment.'

I'm sorry I don't have a video, but I will try to explain as best I can. Regarding lefts and rights and so on, I trained Archer using fetching games to teach direction and a hand signal for halt. I'd throw his ball left and reinforce it with the whistle at the same time. The right/whistle and so on. For halt, I put my hand up as he approached and the first time he stopped I added sound. When he was stopping on the sound at all times approaching, I then included the sound while he was traveling away from me, and he nailed it after a few confused looks. Now he stops dead on it, which of course is very useful for a number of reasons.
For a young dog, he's incredibly focused during this kind of game and early on I noticed he was inclined to ignore dogs while anticipating the throw. Using that as my starting point, I often delayed the throws/whistle until sometimes a dog would nearly be on top of us, then release Archer on the whistle the moment I thought he might break- a sort of reward for his patience/tolerance.
Over time he became SO uninterested and relaxed around other dogs he now views them as a mild impediment to his fun and games and is remarkably calm and easy going in dog company. I pack walk him once a week too, which seems to be a great confidence builder. He's not the largest dog in the group, and must be well-behaved. When there are occasional spats within the group (usually amongst the bitches. heh) I can give the 'go wide' command, which keeps him out of trouble, and I ALWAYS throw something for him when he does this, to reinforce and again reward his compliance.
Hope this helps a little!
03-22-2014 09:19 AM
Sri Oh how wonderful! He looks gorgeous even from the back. Love how he is watching the swans curious but relaxed. I would love to teach Frodo all of this with the whistle. Right now he will run where I am pointing and stop and turn when I say 'there'. Actually I don't know how he got that, just evolved from playing i guess. How can I teach him this? Any link to a video or guide much appreciated. .


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03-22-2014 08:33 AM
Arlene/Archer
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sri View Post
Hi Arlene, Mine is 13 months old, unneutered, working line . Thank you for the response. I've heard of the whistle recall. Mine does well on recalls, in fact he loves them and I love watching him race to me with a big grin on his face. I am going to try the whistle recall. We like to go camping or hiking and It would be great to have more reliability.
That's cool I've trained Archer to go left (one peep) and right (two peeps), wait/ halt (sharp triple peep) and 'to me' (Double short, one long) all on the whistle, as he seems to really like this kind of 'work'- which I guess is the herding instinct kicking in.
Initially I looked like a total wally blowing my whistle around the 'wilderness' (actually rough parkland) where we train and exercise in the mornings, but now people are starting to ask me about it as Archer is so quick to respond and one lady is in the process of training her dog to the whistle as well.
I'm teaching him a 'go wide' signal at the moment as I find this to be one of THE most important commands when we're out for dealing with approaching dogs or people who look a little nervous. He already understands it verbally ( I use it when we run in the city), but I'd like to put it to the whistle for off lead work. It's actually quite pleasant to have people compliment you on your dog's behaviour (especially when the decks are sometimes stacked against GSDs) and it allows Archer valuable off lead time to socialise or not (as he chooses) with other dogs.
Best of luck with your dog! I found 13 months really interesting but it was really around the 18 month mark that ALL of Archer's training seemed to come together and now at 2 he is an absolute gem. The photo of include is one of him cooling himself mid a 10k city run ( that's why he's wearing a harness), and being polite to inquisitive swans. As you can see, he does not bother or annoy them in any way, all of this was taught using positive training
03-21-2014 07:37 PM
boomer11 Each training tool (including food) has its strengths and weaknesses but if I only got to choose one tool to train my dog with it would hands down be an ecollar.
03-21-2014 05:50 PM
Blitzkrieg1 If your worried about screwing the timing on the e collar keep the levels low. I like MEs vids on E Collar training for beginners looking to get started.
My only thing is I hate screwing with a long line hence why I prefer the E Collar.
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