|02-03-2014 11:18 PM|
|RebelGSD||After losing three dogs in rescue after S/N surgeries (two did not come out of sedation, the third died during the night after neuter) - I only put mine under when medically necessary. Bloodwork does not guarantee that the dog won't have a reaction.|
|02-03-2014 11:04 PM|
They just use ketamine? :/ That is a fairly old school way of approaching that. Ketamine is a cataleptic drug. They are essentially paralyzed when they are on it, and it gives a certain period of time where a procedure could be done, but generally most people only use ketamine as an induction agent that is mixed with another drug and followed with inhalant anesthesia. The only time that I ever saw just ketamine used in animals, it was a very old school vet who did that with his feline patients for short procedures.
Dex/torb is probably one of the most widely used because of how easy it use, the fact that its reversible and it gives you nice muscle relaxation and sedation. You can truly use small doses of it also. It is the only thing I would use without worrying about intubating a patient. Propofol can be titrated in and added a little as needed over a course, but you can overdose on that and if the patient does something like regurge and you don't have that airway protected? You are asking for trouble. I went over what one of the vets I work with wanted me to do with a patient he thought of just using quick propofol with to do a procedure. I intubated the dog and figured I would just start the inhalant too. Within moments of positioning the animal, a HUGE amount of yellow fluid came out of his mouth. However, I knew I had his airway protected. This is why I mention the staff should be trusted too lol.
I did my dogs hips even if I wasn't going to breed, but with as physically active as I am with my dogs and the fact I had a dog with severe HD, I like knowing things work properly. I PennHIPed one of my dogs and will likely the others too. Form and function are both very important.
|02-03-2014 05:29 PM|
Carma and Wuma had hips/elbows done on Thursday/Friday last week using dex/torb reversal sedation with no problems at all. Basically as soon as they gave the reversal Carma was up and wild again. You'd never know she was sedated. I just knew she is the type that wouldn't tolerate that type of restraint by a stranger when fully conscious
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|02-03-2014 05:15 PM|
1) IF you care about the results of the X-Ray - meaning you actually want to know, then have the dog put under. Getting the dog in the proper position is critical to getting a good hip x-ray and a slightly bad position makes the X-rays worthless. I'd trust someone who has done lots of GSD hip X-rays for certification or an Ortho vet. I tell you from experience that the X-ray of regular small animal DVM may not be good and you might have to do it over.
The X-ray position is unnatural and uncomfortable for some dogs.
2) If this dog is your pet and you're not influencing breeding, you may not want to know... We've on our 2nd GSD, this one has great hip flexion and mobility, that's enough for us.. He's a rescue, won't ever be bred and the condition of his hips probably won't change much about how we treat him.
|01-30-2014 07:57 AM|
|JakodaCD OA||My vets usually use propofal for xray sedation, no real after effects..I've never had a problem with sedation on any of my dogs.|
|01-30-2014 07:54 AM|
|readaboutdogs||We never had a problem, but whenever Cody was put under, he pretty much selpt the rest of the day. They gave him the shot to reverse, and he'd go out to car, get home go potty, then sleep. I have to say he'd sleep heavy enough it made me monitor him all evening. After reading on the MDR1 being 10 percent with shepherds it made me wonder. Clipper never slept like that when he was put under. I never knew about MDR1 until studying on the collies. He was always alright the next day.|
|01-30-2014 07:35 AM|
I have always used the same Veterinarian who is so good at doing hips and elbows that he rarely has to sedate the dog. People bring their dogs to him from across the country due to his reputation. You should see him work! Flip, x-ray, done! Amazing! Perfect first time. Anyhow, that has been my experience with 3 dogs now. I fear he will retire before my pup is two and needs his OFA pictures.
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|01-30-2014 05:21 AM|
They use Ketamine.
Thank you for all the responses so far.
|01-30-2014 12:03 AM|
Most places likely use the Dexdomitor/Torbugesic method of sedation. Generally speaking to get the few views for OFA, it's easy to use a very low dose of it and it makes getting the films much easier for everyone involved in them. In order to manipulate things into the right position, it is far easier if you aren't fighting against the dog. It doesn't give you how the bones simply are put together, because you have the potential of the patient resisting. Not to mention the amount of exposure to radiation with how many times it may take to get a perfect shot if the patient is uncooperative. These are not films that you don't want perfect.
I have only ever seen issues with that kind of sedation once, and it was a patient who was post trauma. Every other time that we've done this, especially in a young and otherwise healthy patient, they have come through it easily enough. The sedation gives about 45 minutes of time to take films and have them developed. The Dexdomitor is completely reversible and the sedative effects of the torbugesic may last through the night, but if they are worried, there's also a medication they can give to reverse that too.
All I do every day in and out is anesthesia. It's my favorite part of my job and something that I take pride in. I've put cases under anesthesia that could have died, and they've made it through. If you take all precautions and the staff is knowledgeable and knows what is happening with the medications they're giving, the potential side effects of that medication and how they work in the body, things can have a really good outcome. My patient today only had one kidney. I've dealt with heart problems, splenic issues, pancreas issues (talk about the fun of an insulinoma), liver, etc. If you trust your vet and their staff to know what they are doing and keep things in the best interest of your pet, I definitely can't see an issue with a little sedation for films.
|01-29-2014 11:39 PM|
Molly has had this done 3x already, no issues except glassy eyes and being uncoordinated. For us it is very quick, it just takes a while for Molly to wake up enough to walk to the waiting room.
I also wanted to add, our vet said the way the hips need to be manipulated, its best the dog is relaxed, sedated. Molly has been able to have a straight forward knee x-ray without sedation, but when the vet feels he needs to manipulate a joint, then he does the sedation.
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