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Topic Review (Newest First)
01-23-2014 07:25 PM
selzer The bones in the elbow are not united to start with, but then they say by five months, if they remain ununited it is one of the types of ED, UAP.

I have a girl who was diagnosed very young, after they let her tie herself up and then fall off or jump onto a bed, and she ended up doing damage to the elbow. They took her in, and the x-ray showed this.

I took the x-ray to my vet, and her opinion was to not be hasty about surgery and see what happens. I took the dog home and let her heal -- the dog's elbow was still swollen and injured. I just let her heal. She did heal. The dog will be four in March, and hasn't limped or had any problems with that elbow. So, now, I should probably get a new x-ray and see what is what with her. Did it repair itself?

We all know that dogs mature at different rates, often small breeds are fully grown by a year old, where a shepherd takes 15 to 24 months to finish growing. Maybe longer. Might that process take longer in larger breeds?

I really don't know.

This is a dog that runs and jumps and does everything, is pretty crazy really, and shows no sign of distress, now.

I would want to ensure that this problem is caused by ED/UAP and not pano which can happen concurrently with other problems.

In the end, you need to decide with your vet/specialist what the best course of action is for this dog. It is certainly possible that surgery is the best bet for your pet. I would read as much about the condition as possible and then make the specialist sell you the surgery. Have him tell you what the choices are, why it should be done at this point, what the long term prognosis is, etc.
01-23-2014 06:44 PM
WGSD Nikko
Quote:
Originally Posted by Soundguy View Post

You haven't mentioned this and I hesitate to add any more anxiety, but I'm sure they will want to x-ray both elbows. Has your vet brought that up?

Give Rocky our best,
Gary & Cas
They xrayed hips and elbow of all 4 limbs. I figured I might as well do it all at once to know what all I'm working with. We were originally thinking pano and dysphasia so that's why I wanted all of them done. Only his front left elbow has any issues...thankfully!




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01-23-2014 04:26 PM
Soundguy If I remember the time frame accurately, They recommend that surgery be done by about the age of your dog (20 weeks) because after that stage of growth the surgery is less successful. The earlier the surgery is done, the better chance the process has of reuniting. Cas was 24 months when diagnosed and both elbows look like train wrecks, but he absolutely never limped and there was no way to know that he had UAP. I actually bought him after he was diagnosed knowing that he was going to need lifelong management and believing that I could give him a good life. In his case, the supporting structure around the joints is very strong and the joints are pretty stable, so a lot of exercise early in his life probably helped him. Our biggest battle is going to be arthritis as he gets older, which is what we're fighting against. He's now 39 months old and doing very well. He's a moderate drive working line dog, lives on a horse farm and pretty much does what he wants, although I don't encourage any extra exercise from him. He will limp just a little on his right leg if he really overdoes it as in playing hard with another dog, but most of the time I tend to forget about his elbows. Right now he is a happy 3 year old and he's never seen his x rays, so he thinks he's normal.

If I were in your position, at Rocky's age, I would for sure do the surgery if I could. I think the critical factor there is the after care, so make sure you're prepared for that. Debbie and others here who have been thru it can better advise you. Cas and I are just playing the hand we we're dealt and I realize that his elbows could turn bad at any time, but I think the odds would be much better with a successful surgery. Look for whatever you can find on Google. I know it's hard to find case histories, but the prognosis is pretty good if the surgery is done early enough.

You haven't mentioned this and I hesitate to add any more anxiety, but I'm sure they will want to x-ray both elbows. Has your vet brought that up?

Give Rocky our best,
Gary & Cas
01-23-2014 03:06 PM
WGSD Nikko
Quote:
Originally Posted by Soundguy View Post
I just want to offer support. Cas has UAP, but wasn't diagnosed until his OFA's at 2 and was never symptomatic. I probably know as much about UAP as anyone, since I researched the heck out of it, but I can't speak to the surgery question because it wasn't an option for him because of his age. I just want you to know that you didn't do anything wrong and that it's good that you found it while surgery is an option. There are a number of threads here about it and it's helpful to know that a lot of dogs do very well after diagnosis, both with and without surgery. I would consult with the best orthopedic guy I could find, probably more than one, and weigh the advice.

Good luck to you and your pup! Keep us posted. I'll follow the thread.
Sound guy, thank you for your input! They referral my normal vet sent me just happens to be one of the best in Kansas. I guess he works with the local universities as well, so I am wondering if we can perhaps work with the schools and him, and possibly get it done cheaper (again money is no issues, but when I paid a big price tag for him, it's helpful).
I have done some research, but in truth there really isn't much out there about quality of life after surgery.
Curious as to why surgery wasn't an option since I was told he would be lame if i didn't get it. Then again you stated he didn't show any signs and Rocky is showing every sign there is.


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01-23-2014 02:13 PM
Soundguy I just want to offer support. Cas has UAP, but wasn't diagnosed until his OFA's at 2 and was never symptomatic. I probably know as much about UAP as anyone, since I researched the heck out of it, but I can't speak to the surgery question because it wasn't an option for him because of his age. I just want you to know that you didn't do anything wrong and that it's good that you found it while surgery is an option. There are a number of threads here about it and it's helpful to know that a lot of dogs do very well after diagnosis, both with and without surgery. I would consult with the best orthopedic guy I could find, probably more than one, and weigh the advice.

Good luck to you and your pup! Keep us posted. I'll follow the thread.
01-23-2014 01:45 PM
Cassidy's Mom Thanks. In your case, sooner might be better than later. Cassidy was actually showing no signs of pain and no limitations in movement, we just happened to know about it because the breeder provided x-rays before we decided to get her. If your boy is already favoring that leg, I'd go ahead and schedule the surgery.
01-23-2014 01:41 PM
WGSD Nikko Thank you for your response! All 3 vets said if I do not do this surgery ASAP he will be lame by his 1 st birthday. He is already not putting weight in that leg and is turning it out right, so I'm trying to get it done ASAP.
I'm so sorry to hear about your dog. That's so sad


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01-23-2014 12:03 PM
Cassidy's Mom Cassidy had UAP surgery at the time of her spay. She was already 20 weeks old when we got her, and our vet suggested that we wait awhile and see if it corrects on its own, which can happen. He thought it would be good to wait until after her first heat, as the hormones are beneficial to developing bones and joints, and then he did x-rays again when she was almost a year old. He felt there was no point in waiting beyond that, so we scheduled both surgeries.

As it turns out, she had a piece of bone about the size of his thumbnail in the joint, which was what prevented it from developing normally. It was removed, and she recovered well. Unfortunately, she was diagnosed with discospondylitis (a painful spinal disease) at a little over 2 years old and we euthanized her at a few months past her 4th birthday, so I can't tell you how her elbow was long term.
01-23-2014 11:03 AM
WGSD Nikko
Uap

Hello everyone,
So my 20 week old GS was just diagnosed with UAP in his front left elbow. I am completely beside myself since I did everything right. I went to a breeder who rated hips and elbows, I feed a great diet, I haven't allowed any jumping during his growth period ect ect. His limping started about 2 weeks ago and everyone wrote it off as pano. After I finally demanded for X-ray's due to him getting worse, he did them and it's clear as day he has UAP.
I am curious to hear from those who have experience with UAP. Which surgery route did you take (screwing the plate to the ulna, removal of the growth plate, or elbow replacement)? What is the outcome, does your dog live a normal life, can he do normal things? Also the cost. Not that money is an issue, but I want to know what I'm in for.
I am waiting for the orthopedic vet to contact me, but I want to be as informed as I can be.
Thank you everyone!

Here is an X-ray pic
Attachment 170866

And here is my baby
Attachment 170874

Attachment 170882


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