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Thread: Michael Ellis Remote Collar Theory Reply to Thread
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Topic Review (Newest First)
11-27-2012 02:57 PM
MaggieRoseLee
Quote:
Originally Posted by lhczth View Post
Vislor, just wait. It isn't always civil here either.
11-27-2012 02:24 PM
lifebreath I'm a believer in a good shock collar (yes, let's call it what it is!) used judiciously, especially for recall and boundary conditioning. We have 35+ acres, much of it wooded, and my dog has a very high prey drive and a mind of his own. He learns quickly, and is responsive 98% of the time. The other 2% of the time is a problem not easily rectified by other means. The 2% consists of either THE CHASE or THE EXPLORATION or both. Both behaviors are related to the prey drive, and both behaviors are EXTREMELY self-rewarding. My GSD loves us and we love him, but nothing I have to offer as reward can compete with the thrill of THE CHASE or the joy of THE EXPLORATION. And he knows that outside and off-lead, I cannot enforce my command. He is in the driver's seat, and he knows it!

I'm sure that if I spent hours and hours of training the dog, I could probably get it licked. But, I don't have hours and hours to spend, and in the meantime, the behaviors prohibit our having fun off-leash in the wide open area near the house. We live in the city, and when he bolts, he's off into the woods or the neighborhood. He always comes back, but he could get hit by a car, hurt in some other way, or just plain freak people out, even though he's not aggressive.

Enter THE COLLAR, a Tri-Tronics Pro-100 G3 EXP. DOG already has basic obedience, and the come command is well-reinforced off-lead in controlled settings and outside in the fenced-in area, and on a long light lead outside of the fence. However, once DOG had taste of THE CHASE and THE EXPLORATION, he's like a crack addict. Long story short, THE CHASE and THE EXPLORATION are no longer fun. In fact, SOMETHING BAD is out there now! Much nicer to stay close to Papa! SOMETHING BAD goes away when DOG close to Papa. SOMETHING BAD in the brush in the ravine! Now DOG finds no fun in THE CHASE and THE EXPLORATION. Now DOG has fun off-leash with Papa, playing and running and stuff! Now DOG can have fun going to explore with Papa off-leash, and SOMETHING BAD is not there!

This is the one area that I believe the e-collar excels in, and it can restore the JOY of having fun with your dog off-leash in the open.

As an aside, I did once try using the collar without really understanding it. All I succeeded in doing was to freak the dog out and freak myself out wondering if I'd screwed us both up for life. Thankfully, we both recovered quickly, and put the collar aside for a few months, worked on other training, then revisited the collar after having learned more about training theory. Once I understood what made the dog tick, applying the collar made much more sense, and it had VERY quick results.
11-26-2012 07:55 AM
LouCastle Sorry meant to send this post as a PM.
11-23-2012 07:10 PM
KristiM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bear L View Post
I, too, am looking to learn how to use it for recall - for wildlife and chasing dogs away from playing in "her" river.

Did Odin come back full from a meal?
Lol, no I'm just glad something didn't turn him into a meal! GSDs are very far from the top of the food chain where i hike!

My husband and I joke that he's just trying to say hi to the deer and show them what a nice boy he is, but they just keep running away!
11-23-2012 01:43 PM
Bear L
Quote:
Originally Posted by KristiM View Post
I use an e collar with Odin for the same reason. We are in the mountains a lot and there is LOTS of wildlife around here. This fall a dog (on leash) was eaten by a grizzly bear! I once lost Odin for about 20 minutes on the side of a mountain when he took off after a rabbit Having an e collar for him is a must when we are in the woods!

I would suggest doing a proper e collar intro with your dog before you have to use it for an emergency. It's a much more humane tool if the dog understands what it's for and how to turn it off.
I, too, am looking to learn how to use it for recall - for wildlife and chasing dogs away from playing in "her" river.

Did Odin come back full from a meal?
11-23-2012 01:32 PM
Vislor
Quote:
Originally Posted by lhczth View Post
Vislor, just wait. It isn't always civil here either.
Well you've had at least one page of civil conversation and that has impressed me enough :P

Theres always the same "camps" regarding e-collars;
1st. Those who have endeavoured to learn how to effectively use them and find them a very useful tool to add to their (hopefully large and varied) toolbox,
2nd. Those who don't understand them but think they do, use them and abuse them as the only tool in their tool box,
3rd. Those who are thinking about using them but are unsure and are seeking good advice and
4th. The hysterical reactionary nut jobs that have no idea, have probably never even seen one but are 100% convinced that they are some sort of hellish weapon of mass destruction.

Its the fight between the 2nd and 4th camp that tends to blow up, which convinces the 3rd camp to either leave them alone or use them incorrectly whilst the 1st camp carries tries to bite their tongue and stay out of it
11-23-2012 12:20 PM
lhczth Vislor, just wait. It isn't always civil here either.
11-23-2012 05:03 AM
Vislor I must say you guys all seem very sensible and civilised in relation to talking about e-collars. In the UK if anyone so much as whispers the word "e-collar" on any online forum a full scale civil war breaks out!

We've learned how to use them over the years and had a little help from the likes of Jogi Zank and Bart Bellon in developing the proper techniques. Its a very handy tool, but very misunderstood.
11-22-2012 11:52 PM
RocketDog I completely agree Jane. This is what is so frustrating for me-- Spokane County is over 600,000 people. I think the ecollar is a very viable and humane tool in the box for some dogs if used properly. I can't freakin believe its so hard to find someone here! Grrr.
11-22-2012 11:44 PM
onyx'girl The trainer I work with is a field retrieve/hunt competitor(as well as an AKC obedience competitor/trainer)...so some methods she knows of are 'old school' but she uses different techniques than many of her fellow competitors.
I'd be cautious if you do find a hunt club person for help, make sure they aren't rushing the process with too much pressure.
We taught it with using target plates, placeboards & a wobble-board~ added in commands on the boards, then taught directionals with distractions. A prong was used in the beginning along with the e-collar. I was the one handling the remote at all times.
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