Training Progression

[sagelfn]

Good point Elaine. Also, some people (not saying the OP) think once the dog learns A,B,C,D etc that they can stop training. I see training as a constant for the life of the dog

[Superhero]

I disagree. Competition training is not necessary for a well-behaved pet. Using that logic, competition training at a driving school should be required to get a driver's license. My dog so far will do the commands she knows as quickly and as reliably as the dogs doing advanced competition obedience that I was watching at a club not too long ago. In fact her recall was significantly better in many cases, and the trainer was impressed when she came from about 30 yards away on the first call, with no repeated commands of any kind, while she was in the middle of being loved on by some small children. I was shocked when I found out they start training recalls at 10' or so. I was teaching a sit from 10' away first day and her first recall lessons were from 25' - 30'. What's even better is that unlike the competition dogs, who acted like they had no life left in them, mine does it eagerly and happily. It isn't just because she's a puppy, this also goes for the older dogs that I have worked with. I do not often see (not that they do not exist, because they certainly do) competition dogs who also come across genuinely as excited. They're too damned serious. If that's your thing then great, but there is no need to press this upon others.

I feel that the elitism which propagates the idea that any training less than competition training is somehow of lesser value is completely ridiculous.

I require that my dog do the commands I give immediately, enthusiastically and with great gusto. Is it always straight? No, but her ass will hit the ground every time just as quickly (and often faster) as some of the competition dogs I have seen. You don't need perfect form to establish great communication and obedience with your pet. What you need is perfect consistency in how you teach and reward. It is the consistency that establishes trust with your dog, it is the consistency that creates reliability, and it is consistency that gives you obedience.

I am not sure why, but the dog training world is filled with a lot of elitist assholes and that's why I am not choosing to give my money to any of them.

I apologize for coming across strongly here, but if I, as a non-professional, can learn (and in some cases figure out on my own) and apply effective, non-compulsory, positive training methods with great success, then I believe anyone can do it. Competition training is not necessary, and I would argue that for many dogs and their owners it is not desirable.[/I][/B]

Originally Posted by Elaine

People make some strange connection that competition training isn't necessary for the well behaved pet. The point of the training is to teach you how to communicate well with your dog and get reliable, consistent, off-leash control. Do you need a straight sit in real life? No. But by expecting it in training, you are raising your level of control of your dog and by expecting a straight sit in training, you might get some sort of sit when you ask when you are out and about in the real, very distracting, world. Whether you chose to compete after that is up to you, but you will end up with a well behaved, well controlled, dog.

[Superhero]

I agree here. A big part of why I posted this was in order to find out more things to teach her so that I don't run out.

Once I "finish" with her obedience I would like to start doing some tracking work. I may seek a trainer for this as from all I have seen it's not the easiest thing to teach, but we'll see how things go. Then from there I can do all sorts of other things. Just like humans, dogs should always be learning something new. It keeps the mind sharp, focused and calm.

Originally Posted by sagelfn

Good point Elaine. Also, some people (not saying the OP) think once the dog learns A,B,C,D etc that they can stop training. I see training as a constant for the life of the dog

[Superhero]

I am ready. I've been through it before. Very, very frustrating. It's all good though. I have found if you just keep on working through it and continue being consistent that they emerge from this phase more eager and more obedient than they started. My chihuahua goes through this regularly and she's 3. lol

It's really frustrating when they're 2' away and still don't seem to hear you. ARGH!

Originally Posted by codmaster

I think that you also ought to be ready for the usual "hard of hearing" affliction that attacks most puppies between about 6-9 months. they seem to lose all ability to hear a command when they are doing something real interesting!

[jakeandrenee]

LOL..."hard of hearing" We are entering that stage as we speak!

[codmaster]

Originally Posted by Superhero

I am ready. I've been through it before. Very, very frustrating. It's all good though. I have found if you just keep on working through it and continue being consistent that they emerge from this phase more eager and more obedient than they started. My chihuahua goes through this regularly and she's 3. lol

It's really frustrating when they're 2' away and still don't seem to hear you. ARGH!

Sounds like you are ready for anything!

[codmaster]

BTW, I wonder how would the rest of you would define "competition training"?

Does that mean anyone who wants to show in the AKC obedience (or rally also) show?

OR would it mean someone who is real serious about showing and looking for 1st place or even HIT scoring?

There is a great difeerence between the two approaches usually. I have shown in the obedience ring and really enjoyed it but never had any aspirations to winning my class (unless I was the only one entered!) or anything like that. If I got a green ribbon (qualifying score), I was very happy and pleased with both me and my dog.

But some folks make obedience a very competetive sport and that is fine for them if they can enjoy it and have their dogs enjoy it also.

But a few people take the sport much too seriously.

[Elaine]

Superhero, your idea of competition training being less than home training because the competition dogs are too serious and those of us that do it are elitist a-holes, clearly shows your complete lack of knowledge and how insulting you really are. You may have the concept of consistency in training, but the vast majority of people that don't go to school do not. I don't know what you think goes in in dog school, but if you want to continue to live in your little bubble, go right ahead, but I will have absolutely nothing to do with you again.

[Superhero]

If that's all you got out of my post then you completely missed my point. Also, as regards "idea of competition training being less than home training because the competition dogs are too serious and those of us that do it are elitist a-holes" - you're totally off-base and I have no idea how you could reach so far as to think that's what I meant. Did you actually read what I wrote? I did not say that at all, nor did I insinuate it.

Since you failed to get the point, I'll make it very clear: competition training is not necessary, and in many cases, it is not desirable.

Oh, if it makes you feel any better, elitist assholes aren't confined to dog sport. They exist everywhere, in every hobby, profession and field. Don't be so defensive.

Originally Posted by Elaine

Superhero, your idea of competition training being less than home training because the competition dogs are too serious and those of us that do it are elitist a-holes, clearly shows your complete lack of knowledge and how insulting you really are. You may have the concept of consistency in training, but the vast majority of people that don't go to school do not. I don't know what you think goes in in dog school, but if you want to continue to live in your little bubble, go right ahead, but I will have absolutely nothing to do with you again.

[codmaster]

Originally Posted by jakeandrenee

LOL..."hard of hearing" We are entering that stage as we speak!

Heh! Heh!