The Purpose of the HIC

[The Stig]

In the Bloodlines and Pedigree forum, someone was asking about the acronyms about an American Showline titled dog. One of it was HIC, which stands for Herding Instinct Certificate.

I am curious what purpose does this certification carry?

It appears rather pointless to me, but that is merely my opinion. If someone can explain to me the other side of the coin, I will be willing to read it.

I know of a few sport herding dogs and I can understand acquiring the status recognition of a title after having proven the ability to work, i.e. HT, PT, etc.

Janka had her herding instinct, and we had our first formal lesson on Saturday. I do not expect a title to prove she has shown the potential for the ability to work, because I feel it is pointless unless the dog has proven worthy in actual trials.

~ Rei

[gagsd]

It shows if your dog runs from the sheep, exhibits interest, or chases them.... it's also fun
And it is not a "title," just a certificate.

[The Stig]

Thanks.

Yep, I know it is not a title. I should be more clear in my OP about it. I understand there are certificates for accomplishments, such as the CGC. But to show a dog has the prey drive needed to work (animals, in this case) is just a little unusual to me.

I have done the herding instinct test. And my puppy passed it with multiple flying colours. Perhaps I should ask for a HIC.

[Amaruq]

I think but I am not sure it may be required before going on to other trials/titles. Similar to the BH before any German working titles.

Even if I am wrong about the above at least is shows someone took a little bit of interest in doing SOMETHING with their dog other than tossing a ball in the yard or giving it some food and water.

[mspiker03]

Rei -
You do not need an HIC to enter an HT (or HCT from the AHBA). I believe that (at some trials) you can get an HIC (I believe it is a certificate from the AKC, but could be wrong). What you did with Terry won't get you a formal "HIC"; Yes, you did pass an instinct test, but it wasn't a formal thing - it was just Terry's way of seeing if your dog had enough instinct to warrant going for lessons - and we all know how much prey drive Janka showed!

[The Stig]

Well, it seems to be more of a informal test to gauge to see if a dog has sufficient drive to be able to successfully train to work. That is what I can see from a herding instinct test.

A BH certification is more involved than that. One has to train for a BH, which consists of 2 parts, and be officiated by a judge.

I think the HT would be similar to a BH, but I would need clarification on that.

Any dog can be tested for herding instinct. We saw a St Bernard and a Newfoundland getting their herding instinct test when Janka & I went for our first lesson. It just depends on the dog's level of drive to see how interested it is in sheep. I think it would only be worth something if the owner is willing to go 100% in on working the dog in herding.

But this is merely my opinion.

Just thought the basis for HIC was rather interesting. Unless of course, there IS a formal protocol to acquire this certification ... which apparently does exist in the A.H.B.A. as I have just found out.

It says no prereq; pass/fail; 2 passes; 2 judges.

Aw. I want a HIC for my pup. She will probably get a gold star. Oh well, I am training under AKC format.


@ mspiker03: if you read this, I wonder if Levi and Leyna have to acquire their HIC before going for their JHD if you do decide to trial for AHBA as well as the AKC. I am sure Levi would be MORE than happy to have another instinct test. *lol*

[The Stig]

Oh hey, Melissa! I just saw your post after I uploaded my reply.

Thanks for the clarification.

And here is some light reading for those who are curious about titles/certs:
http://www.cal.net/~pamgreen/titles_available.html

[edit: So what exactly do the judges look for to pass the HIC? Would it be similar to how Terry does it, Melissa? ]

[mspiker03]

You do not (I believe) need an instinct certificate to go for the JHD in an AHBA trial. You can start with an HCT - the first leg is similar to an HIC and the second leg is similar to the HT (AKC title). Also - both the HT and PT are pass/fail and 2 legs.

I would assume that an HIC would be similar to how Terry does it. I have never actually seen herding instinct tests done at either of the trials we went to. Terry will have you more than ready for the HT when she tells you to enter.

(Note: according to the AHBA website - "A dog may enter at any level for which it is trained. No title is a prerequisite for another.")

[gagsd]

Is an HIC any indication of "breedworthiness?" NO!
For me, it is along the lines of a CGC or competing in a fun match. It is something to do with my dog that is fun. It MAY give an indication of if your dog has ability to follow-up on. Then again, maybe not. I have seen some HIC testers award the certificate to a dog that just showed minimal interest.

[JenM66]

I did not go for the HIC nor the HT with Gracie - we went straight to the PT - pre-trial tested. Her trainer said not to waste time or money on the instinct testing. If you are working with a trainer, you know if your dog has the instinct or not. Now if you are wondering, sure go for it. We started the HCT but I haven't had time to get out to finish it (only 1 place I know of that offers it). I'd like to get the HS and JHD but now with Gracie's back it's all up in the air.