German Shepherds Forum banner

For ROCKY89: Please share your success stories about what worked for DM

3K views 19 replies 10 participants last post by  Masha1 
#1 · (Edited)
We have a new user named Rocky89 who is digging up ancient threads on DM, trying to contact users who are long gone for help.

My guess is his dog might have DM and he's trying hard to locate any information about treatments that have helped, however long the odds.

If you treated your dog for DM, or delayed the progression, please post here so that he can ask questions of people who are still around.

(Rocky, my apologies for stepping out of turn to start a thread for you, but after watching you try fruitlessly to find people who might be able to help you all day, I thought it might be useful to get you a thread where you can talk to people who are still here. We can tell you are worried about your dog, so hopefully this will get you started more efficiently in finding something that will help. Please describe what's going on with your dog, so that the experts here who've been through this can think through with you what your options are.)
 
#2 · (Edited)
He asked you Magwart specifically about acupuncture in one of the threads.

Looks like they are in Gainesville and interested in vets, diet, stem cell therapy and wheelchairs.
 
#3 ·
I have not had a dog with DM, so I can't offer any opinion on whether acupuncture would help if it's really DM. We have had several suspected cases in rescue that turned out to be back injuries and experienced significant improvement. (My dad's last one with DM progressed very fast, and her quality of life plummeted with astonishing speed.).

I have seen acupuncture (by a certified vet-acupuncturist) help dogs with spinal issues that had symptoms that looked like DM, esp. if there's a nerve component, and some subset of "suspected DM" may actually be a spinal injury. It's one of those things I would be inclined to talk with a vet about trying (in the "can't hurt, might help" category of unknowns).

I would also want to consult with a neurologist. Too many vets assume hind-end lameness in an older GSD is DM, or that all knuckling under is DM. Sometimes it is, but there are other issues that can look identical -- and those are sometimes treatable!
 
#4 ·
Hello Magwart,

I read about RebelGSD's success with Riley's recovery back in 2011 from stem cell therapy, and am very interested in considering to go down a similar path with my mom's dog. Her dog Rocky (and best friend) is a 7 years old GSD that's been recently diagnosed with DM and his back legs are starting to cross pretty bad when walking. This was determined by sending out the cotton swap tests for DM and also determined by multiple neurologists. A local hospital, chase farm vetinary hospital, began offering stem cell therapy as of last year. The vet has been looking more into treating dogs with DM but got back to us two days ago that we may see no results based on the publications she's been reading. They've personally treated at least 50 dogs with success in other areas like arthritis but the one dog with DM seen no positive results. He did however have some other issues, I believe like hip displacia. So now we're stuck and not sure which path to go. I am open to looking into other ways to slow down the progression of DM such as acupuncture and other methods to hopefully allow him to live as long as possible while being as comfortable as possible. We also live on a second floor of a house, so the wheelchair condition will make things much more difficult.

I currently live in Gainesville Florida and am a student at the University of Florida, that's why I asked about the Dr. Clemmons antibiotic I seen someone had posted about before. My mom and dog actually live in Massachusetts, so I am trying to help them by finding other cases online. We are considering to try stem cell therapy in the next two weeks or so if we feel this is our best option. The only thing about stem cell therapy is that they use the stem cells from the fat instead of bone marrow like RebelGSD so I'm not sure if there is less of a chance the therapy will work.

Thank you very much for starting the thread!
 
#5 ·
RebelGSD doesn't post often. I think she's active in rescue -- maybe someone here knows her on FB and can send a message. I don't have a way of contacting her outside the forum, unfortunately.

Since you are in FL, have you tried contacting Dr. Clemmons for a consultation? He's at UF, and he's also certified in acupuncture, so it would seem to me that he'd be in a great position to give you advice on whether that will help or not, if he still sees patients...even if it means a road trip from Mass to FL for your dog:
Roger M. Clemmons » College of Veterinary Medicine » University of Florida
Maybe call their clinic's office number on Monday (352-392-2235) and see if you can schedule a consultation with him specifically?
 
#8 ·
There is a DM group on FB that tries to keep the latest info available. It is a good source but as with anything, everyone has to do their research and decide what is best for them.

Rocky you need to be aware that DM is a diagnosis of elimination. All the test proves is that your dog COULD develop DM. Positive diagnosis can only be made after death.
Basically once everything else has been ruled out a vet will tell you that it is DM, but again only a necropsy proves it.
Seven years old is on the young side and if the dog has a history of hip issues that could be what you are seeing.
DM is most recognizable for it's lack of any pain, the dogs don't realize what is happening because they don't feel anything. The muscles in the affected areas begin to atrophy quickly because there is no nerve response. It is important to keep them moving as long as possible, with assistance if needed. Swimming and acupuncture are great for DM dogs.
Understand that treatments, and supplements/diet SLOW the progress. Stem cells seem to restore some function from the research I have seen, but this disease is NOT curable, and a good vet should be making that clear.
When Sabs was diagnosed my vet told me it generally comes down to how much the owners can stand, not the dogs. She was right.
There are any number of treatable injuries and illnesses that have similar symptoms.
 
#10 ·
If you treated your dog for DM, or delayed the progression, please post here so that he can ask questions of people who are still around.
Lost my last GSD to DM....4 years ago ....everything was pretty much textbook as to the progression. Did the U of M DNA test and she had 2 mutated copies of the gene they test for....at risk. Did the Dr. Clemmons supplementing and other suggestions. Did some other hopeful remedies at the vet regarding some type of laser therapy or something to that effect....
Everyone in the business I dealt with was very honest.....no promise and mostly told the grim reality of the situation.

Whether or not I delayed the inevitable ....I would have no idea.

There would be no walking wheelchair contraption for her either....she was too noble of a creature and her mental condition was still sharp...so her frustration due to her hindquarters not working... along with her never giving up was too much to subject such a magnificent creature to....no animal should have to struggle in such vain.

Informed the breeder ...was told she was now testing her dogs...and supposedly took those at risk...out of her breeding program.

I believe I witnessed a classic case of DM.....by every measure.

Wish I had something rosier to say.....but I suppose it has made me appreciate my current GSD more than I thought possible.

SuperG
 
#11 · (Edited)
llombardo and Sabi's mom,

Yes my dog Rocky has been diagnosed with DM between a few neurologists. He has two copies of DM, one from the mom and one from the dad. I'm not sure if that makes things worse. The main neurologist was leaning towards DM before we got the results because Rocky did not seem to be in pain at all, and they checked his reflexes on all his legs and noticed the back ones were much slower.

Also thank you for the Facebook group suggestion. I'll try and see the success and failure stories there for stem cell therapy. I am leaning towards it, but the local vet does stem cell therapy from the fat cells, whereas RebelGSD used the bone marrow stem cells, so I'm not sure on the difference between the two. I am also open to acupuncture as well, I may give that a try first.
 
#14 ·
llombardo and Sabi's mom,

Yes my dog Rocky has been diagnosed with DM between a few neurologists. He has two copies of DM, one from the mom and one from the dad. I'm not sure if that makes things worse. The main neurologist was leaning towards DM before we got the results because Rocky did not seem to be in pain at all, and they checked his reflexes on all his legs and noticed the back ones were much slower.

Also thank you for the Facebook group suggestion. I'll try and see the success and failure stories there for stem cell therapy. I am leaning towards it, but the local vet does stem cell therapy from the fat cells, whereas RebelGSD used the bone marrow stem cells, so I'm not sure on the difference between the two. I am also open to acupuncture as well, I may give that a try first.

There are 3 possible results from the DM test.
At Risk-means the dog has two copies of the gene and may develop symptoms.
Carrier-means the dog has only one copy of the gene and will not develop symptoms.
Clear-means the dog has no copies of the gene and cannot develop symptoms, nor can it pass the disease on to any offspring.
I am explaining this because definitive diagnosis is only possible after death.
Stem cell therapy is still fairly new and while some people see improvement, lots do not. Please understand that there is NO cure for DM. Treatments may stall progression, the disease plateaus anyway so it's tough to say, but there is at this time no cure.
Sabi lasted almost 3 years after the onset of symptoms. We used swimming and acupuncture as well as the diet/supplement protocol. Like SuperG, I declined to resort to the indignity of a wheelchair. She would have hated it.
 
#16 ·
Sabis mom,

How often did you do either the acupuncture or the swimming? Do you feel like either made the DM worsen or lessen any bit or is it just hard to tell? We just had Rocky do his first session of swimming/treadmill today.

Thank you
We did acupuncture once a week and swimming as often as I could, pool time here is expensive.
I don't know if anything had any effect. We had good days and bad. It took a long time for me to stop the I think she's getting better, maybe the vet is wrong, maybe she is the one that it will reverse in.
At some point I needed to decide to accept it.
The disease naturally plateau's which makes it tough to say if anything helps. But the trying helps us to feel like we have done something.

Love your dog.
 
#17 · (Edited)
My boy had slight DM. It never got really bad ,but he did wear down his rear nails and had small callus on top of his rear feet but still with fur. He could also still run. We took him swimming a lot and that probably also helped.
We couldn't walk him very far on gravel or pavement, but grass was good ,and we had booties for his back feet .
I supplemented his diet with ,VIT C 500MG, VIT E 400, VIT B COMPLEX 100, Q10 ,fish oil. It seemed to help because he was diagnosed with it 3-4 years earlier, and as I said it never got really bad.
Hope this helps :)
 
#18 ·
I have never had a dog with this, but I wanted to shout out to Magwart for seeing a member in need and being proactive. I hope this can get Rocky some information. And thanks Magwart.
 
#20 ·
Hi there.
We have a 9 1/2 year old GSD (Minka) who has genetically tested at risk. She also showed signs of arthritis in the spine and spondylosis. This made the whole deal a lot harder to diagnose. I had to push for the testing. When we started the hydro therapy her hind legs showed 17 inches of top lg muscle. 8 weeks later with 2ce weekly sessions her muscle mass is now 17.5 inches. So we have improved. The nail dragging is still there very slightly, but we are using soft caps to stop the quick bleeding and these have been successful. Minka has also been doing acupunture every 2 weeks for 4 sessions and the vet doing this indicated she was firmer in her posture as well. So for now we are on the positive side of things. It is really hard watching them wobble when they walk, and tight corners make her fall over. The hard wood floors we have are going to have carpet put down so she doesnt hurt herself. We have her on metacam/pentosan and high dose glucosamine/chondroiten/MS/Hyralonic acid for the arthritis and vit e/vit c/tumeric/fish oil for the DM. Hopefully she will see out her senior years.
 
This is an older thread, you may not receive a response, and could be reviving an old thread. Please consider creating a new thread.
Top