Administering vaccines on a DM Diagnosed dog? - German Shepherd Dog Forums

Increase font size: 0, 10, 25, 50%

GermanShepherds.com is the premier German Shepherd Forum on the internet. Registered Users do not see the above ads.
Reply
 
LinkBack Thread Tools
Old 02-28-2014, 01:24 PM   #1 (permalink)
Junior Member
 
Mrpuck's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2004
Location: New Jersey
Posts: 34
Send a message via AIM to Mrpuck
Question Administering vaccines on a DM Diagnosed dog?

As the subject says, I am looking for people who have had a DM (Degenerative Myelopathy) diagnosed pup. And still continued to vaccinate as scheduled.

I have read many articles on this, especially the good ones from Dr. Clemmons who from what I have read is considered the expert on this. Mostly everything I have read is that DM is in a sense an auto-immune disease and that vaccinating with this diagnosis can hurt the dog and actually progress their disease further.

Some backstory:
I have an 8 year old GSD, that has been positively identified with DM and now the town is coming after me to get her re-vaccinated. So far my local vets (This is NJ) seem pretty clueless to this disease. I've requested a rabies vaccination exemption from them, but none of them will sign it.
I get the responses of "Well she looks good, I don't see how it would hurt".
This is the same specialist, that gave her a 6 month window of a "good" life back in 2012 and here it is almost 2 years later and my dog is still walking around thankfully. I attribute much of delaying the onset of the disease to following the suggestions made by Dr. Clemmons after helpful people on this site directed me to his articles 2 years ago. Needless to say, I would regret vaccinating her again if it made her worse. She is not even due until August, but apparently NJ law states in order to issue a dog license the rabies vac can't be due in the same year. And now the town has issued me a summons on not renewing her license.

Looking for any advice, suggestions, of anyone who may have information on this. Maybe you've gone through this situation previously, or know of a holistic vet in NJ that may be able to help me. I have reached out to Dr. Clemmons but so far been unable to get a response. Many of his articles were from 5-10 years ago so I am not sure if many of the research done back then has changed. Thank you!
Mrpuck is offline   Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
Old 02-28-2014, 01:52 PM   #2 (permalink)
Knighted Member
 
Chip18's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2014
Location: Dayton NV
Posts: 2,033
Default

My Boxer (Struddell) got full blown DM at 8.5 she couldn't walk for the last 2 yrs of her life. We took care of her 24/7 for two years but I had to let her go in Nov of 2013.

You can do a titer test, results would at least give you grounds for a good argument.
Blood Test for Dogs to Test Immunity; Don't Over-Vaccinate! | Truth4Dogs

I'm Gunther over here more info on and sources for DM:
Thatcher has DM. Anyone use Dwanecart wheelchair? - Page 6 - Boxer Board

And if I can ask what did the DM test cost where you are?
Chip18 is offline   Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 02-28-2014, 02:07 PM   #3 (permalink)
Junior Member
 
Mrpuck's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2004
Location: New Jersey
Posts: 34
Send a message via AIM to Mrpuck
Default

Thanks Chip, I can see if they will accept the titer test in court. May be tough but we'll see if it gets to that.

The DM test, if I recall was around $200 or so. But it was back in 2012 so my memory on it may be a bit hazy as it cost me $2,000+ before they even got to that test. (Xray's, multiple Dr. visit's, etc.)
Mrpuck is offline   Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 02-28-2014, 02:43 PM   #4 (permalink)
Knighted Member
 
Chip18's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2014
Location: Dayton NV
Posts: 2,033
Default

Thanks for the info, I'll use the lower number till I find out otherwise.

How is your guy doing? First outward symptom as I know now! Usually left rear foot starts. You ca hear the toe nails click on hard surfaces, so keep an eye on the tops of the rear toes.
Chip18 is offline   Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 02-28-2014, 03:03 PM   #5 (permalink)
Junior Member
 
Mrpuck's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2004
Location: New Jersey
Posts: 34
Send a message via AIM to Mrpuck
Default

She started showing signs in August 2012, we came home from vacation and the house/dog sitter we had checking in and taking her out said the house was a complete mess.
She became incontinent during our trip, and every time she would lay down she'd leak.
Needless to say our house was a mess.

We took her to the vet upon returning, and he sent us to a neurologist after trying a few antibiotics thinking it was some type of urinary tract infection.

Specialist saw her, and then pointed out how her rear nails were all worn completely down.
And sometimes how her legs would cross a bit in the rear. I guess I had never really noticed it but when she pointed it out it was definitely there. She did Xrays etc. and blood tests and finally ordered the special test for DM to go out which I believe she said goes to Indiana University or something similar. Little over a week later got back the news she was DM positive and there was nothing we can do. Dr. said keep her as active as much as possible to prevent further onset and gave her about 6 months of having a good life left. Where we'd then wind up wheel chairing her, or putting her to sleep.

I researched the **** out of the disease, since even the specialist admitted it's relatively "new" to them and there are still a lot of unknowns except they say it's not painful to the dog, and they feel it's genetic. We changed her diet to full raw diet, except for kibble in the morning (Orijen) so we could begin giving her vitamins as I read online.
She now gets Kibble with 4 squirts salmon oil, Missing Link (Vet Strength), Vitamin E 2000iu, Vitamin C, and Super B-Complex.

It's been 18 months now since she was brought in having issues walking, and incotinent.
About a month after I started the diet change, she stopped having incotinent issues. And she appears to have much more strength in her legs. She runs around the yard still daily like crazy. It's almost like she is a different dog.

Needless to say, Dr's don't always know everything. We're greatful for every additional day we get with her but also realize it could come back at any time.

Sorry for the long winded response, but I like sharing it. Often times it's not as nice of a story.
Mrpuck is offline   Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 02-28-2014, 08:34 PM   #6 (permalink)
Knighted Member
 
GatorBytes's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2012
Location: Southern Ontario
Posts: 3,188
Default

I would ask the vet to refer to the manufacture's insert in the vaccine that advises against at any time of illness.

Then I would ask them to sign a waiver with explicit clause that they will pay for all treatment costs post vaccine.

Then I would ask them again to write a vaccine waiver.

If they still won't - tell them that they will be summoned for your hearing.
__________________
He is your friend, your partner, your defender, your dog. You are his life, his love, his leader. He will be yours, faithful and true, to the last beat of his heart. You owe it to him to be worthy of such devotion. - Unknown
GatorBytes is offline   Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 02-28-2014, 09:26 PM   #7 (permalink)
Knighted Member
 
Chip18's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2014
Location: Dayton NV
Posts: 2,033
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Mrpuck View Post
She started showing signs in August 2012, we came home from vacation and the house/dog sitter we had checking in and taking her out said the house was a complete mess.
She became incontinent during our trip, and every time she would lay down she'd leak.
Needless to say our house was a mess.

We took her to the vet upon returning, and he sent us to a neurologist after trying a few antibiotics thinking it was some type of urinary tract infection.

Specialist saw her, and then pointed out how her rear nails were all worn completely down.
And sometimes how her legs would cross a bit in the rear. I guess I had never really noticed it but when she pointed it out it was definitely there. She did Xrays etc. and blood tests and finally ordered the special test for DM to go out which I believe she said goes to Indiana University or something similar. Little over a week later got back the news she was DM positive and there was nothing we can do. Dr. said keep her as active as much as possible to prevent further onset and gave her about 6 months of having a good life left. Where we'd then wind up wheel chairing her, or putting her to sleep.

I researched the **** out of the disease, since even the specialist admitted it's relatively "new" to them and there are still a lot of unknowns except they say it's not painful to the dog, and they feel it's genetic. We changed her diet to full raw diet, except for kibble in the morning (Orijen) so we could begin giving her vitamins as I read online.
She now gets Kibble with 4 squirts salmon oil, Missing Link (Vet Strength), Vitamin E 2000iu, Vitamin C, and Super B-Complex.

It's been 18 months now since she was brought in having issues walking, and incotinent.
About a month after I started the diet change, she stopped having incotinent issues. And she appears to have much more strength in her legs. She runs around the yard still daily like crazy. It's almost like she is a different dog.

Needless to say, Dr's don't always know everything. We're greatful for every additional day we get with her but also realize it could come back at any time.

Sorry for the long winded response, but I like sharing it. Often times it's not as nice of a story.
Thank you it will be shared and to be clear..so she is still up and running?
Chip18 is offline   Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 02-28-2014, 11:43 PM   #8 (permalink)
Junior Member
 
Mrpuck's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2004
Location: New Jersey
Posts: 34
Send a message via AIM to Mrpuck
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Chip18 View Post
Thank you it will be shared and to be clear..so she is still up and running?
She is indeed. Kinda amazed really, she has some trouble going up and down steps. But overall she is still running around daily and showing very few signs of illness. Just turned 8 this month.
Mrpuck is offline   Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 02-28-2014, 11:46 PM   #9 (permalink)
Elite Member
 
Momto2GSDs's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2012
Posts: 1,394
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by GatorBytes View Post
I would ask the vet to refer to the manufacture's insert in the vaccine that advises against at any time of illness.

Then I would ask them to sign a waiver with explicit clause that they will pay for all treatment costs post vaccine.

Then I would ask them again to write a vaccine waiver.

If they still won't - tell them that they will be summoned for your hearing.
THIS!

Also, more reading on the subject:

The Rabies Vaccine for Dogs: Side Effects and Precautions You Can Take Your veterinarian has a legal and ethical obligation to fully inform you about the risks and benefits of any vaccination. Read what an attorney and veterinarian has to say about a vet's obligation of
Informed Consent.


Is Your Dog’s Vet a Vaccination Expert?


See line 30 for NJ Exemption RABIES LAWS IN THE UNITED STATES as of 6/16/10

Here are some registered Holistic Vets in NJ that would most likely help you with a waiver.
Name
Address
State/Province, Zip/Postal Code
Website




Buchoff, Gerald
BVScAH
HOLISTIC PET CARE, P.A.
973-256-3899
125 Paterson Avenue
Little Falls
NJ
07424
United States
www.hpcnj.com
AVIAN, EQUINE, EXOTIC, HOUSE CALLS, SMALL ANIMAL
Acupuncture, Bach Flowers, Chinese Herbs, Chiropractic, Chiropractic (AVCA), Clinical Nutrition, Conventional Medicine, Glandular Therapy, Homeopathy, Homeopathy-Classical, Homotoxicology, Nutrition, Ozone Therapy, Reiki, VOM, Western Herbs




Collins, Karen
VMD
215-687-6245
148 E. Maple Ave
Langhorne
PA
19047
United States
www.holisticpethealing.byregion.net
SMALL ANIMAL
Acupuncture, Acupuncture (CHI), Bach Flowers, Chinese Herbs (Chi Institute), Conventional Medicine, Homotoxicology, Nutrition, Reiki




Fischer, Kenneth
DVM
HILLSDALE ANIMAL HOSPITAL
201-358-6520
201 BROADWAY
Hillsdale
NJ
07642
United States
www.healingvet.com
SMALL ANIMAL
Acupuncture, Acupuncture (IVAS), Bach Flowers, Chinese Herbs, Chiropractic, Chiropractic (AVCA), Clinical Nutrition, Conventional Medicine, Glandular Therapy, Homotoxicology, Nutrition












Lounsberry, Sheila
DVM
VETERINARY ACUPUNCTURE SERVICES, INC
973-726-6414
66 WOODPORT ROAD
Sparta
NJ
07871
United States
www.drlounsberry.com
EQUINE, SMALL ANIMAL
Acupuncture, Acupuncture (IVAS), Chinese Herbs, Chiropractic, Chiropractic (AVCA), Clinical Nutrition, Conventional Medicine, Homotoxicology, Ozone Therapy, Western Herbs
Manziano, Rosemary
DVM
COLTS NECK ANIMAL CLINIC
732-780-4211
261 Rt 34
Colts Neck
NJ
07722-1714
United States
www.homeovet.com
EXOTIC, SMALL ANIMAL
Chiropractic (AVCA), Homeopathy, Homeopathy-Classical




Newkirk, Mark
VMD
Newkirk Family Veterinarians
609-645-2120
9200 Ventnor Avenue
Margate
NJ
08402
United States
www.newkirkfamilyveterinarians.com
AVIAN, EXOTIC, SMALL ANIMAL
Applied Kinesiology, Bach Flowers, Chinese Herbs, Chiropractic, Clinical Nutrition, Conventional Medicine, Glandular Therapy, Homeopathy, Homotoxicology, IAT (Immuno-Augmentive Therapy), NAET, Ozone Therapy, VOM, Western Herbs


Rodrigues, Wendy
DVM
908-892-9991
Warren
NJ
07059
United States
www.VisitingVetNJ.com
HOUSE CALLS, SMALL ANIMAL
Acupuncture (IVAS), Acupuncture (Tufts), Applied Kinesiology, Chinese Herbs (Chi Institute), Conventional Medicine, Homotoxicology, Nutrition, VOM


Stryeski, Kathleen
DVM
609-737-2800
21 Route 31 North
Pennington
NJ
08534
USA
windsongpet.com
SMALL ANIMAL
Acupuncture (CHI), Chinese Herbs (Chi Institute), Clinical Nutrition, Homeopathy, Massage Therapy, Nutrition
Tsakiris, Alexia
BVET Med
732-759-0351
P.O. Box 84
Monmouth Beach
NJ
07750
USA
HOUSE CALLS, SMALL ANIMAL
Acupuncture, Acupuncture (CHI), Chinese Herbs (Chi Institute), Western Herbs




Voynick, Brian
DVM
AMERICAN ANIMAL HOSPITAL
973-895-4999
1202 SUSSEX TURNPIKE
Randolph
NJ
07869
United States
www.americananimalhospital.com
SMALL ANIMAL
Acupuncture, Acupuncture (IVAS), Chinese Herbs, Chiropractic, Glandular Therapy, Homeopathy, IAT (Immuno-Augmentive Therapy), Nutrition, Pulsating Magnetic Therapy, Western Herbs

Good Luck!
Moms
Momto2GSDs is offline   Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 02-28-2014, 11:46 PM   #10 (permalink)
Junior Member
 
Mrpuck's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2004
Location: New Jersey
Posts: 34
Send a message via AIM to Mrpuck
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by GatorBytes View Post
I would ask the vet to refer to the manufacture's insert in the vaccine that advises against at any time of illness.

Then I would ask them to sign a waiver with explicit clause that they will pay for all treatment costs post vaccine.

Then I would ask them again to write a vaccine waiver.

If they still won't - tell them that they will be summoned for your hearing.
I like your way of thinking, because you're right they just won't sign anything. Here in NJ especially it seems vets do not want to get involved with "not" vaccinating for rabies. I mean the state even has an exemption letter that I filled out and brought to them. All they had to do was sign it, and they wouldn't. I'll look into the titer options, although I don't expect the town to buy it. And then may have to move on to your suggestions.
Mrpuck is offline   Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
Reply

Quick Reply
Message:
Options

Register Now

In order to be able to post messages on the German Shepherd Dog Forums forums, you must first register.
Please enter your desired user name, your email address and other required details in the form below.
User Name:
If you do not want to register, fill this field only and the name will be used as user name for your post.
Password
Please enter a password for your user account. Note that passwords are case-sensitive.
Password:
Confirm Password:
Email Address
Please enter a valid email address for yourself.
Email Address:

Log-in

Human Verification

In order to verify that you are a human and not a spam bot, please enter the answer into the following box below based on the instructions contained in the graphic.



Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may post new threads
You may post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are On



All times are GMT -4. The time now is 09:42 PM.



Powered by vBulletin® Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
SEO by vBSEO 3.3.2
PetGuide.com
Basset.net DobermanTalk.com GoldenRetrieverForum.com OurBeagleWorld.com
BoxerForums.com DogForums.com GoPitbull.com PoodleForum.com
BulldogBreeds.com FishForums.com HavaneseForum.com SpoiledMaltese.com
CatForum.com GermanShepherds.com Labradoodle-dogs.net YorkieForum.com
Chihuahua-People.com RetrieverBreeds.com