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Old 01-05-2014, 12:34 PM   #1 (permalink)
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Default Help with IBD and diarrhea

Rainer is a little over 2 years old and we've been dealing with diarrhea the whole time. He's had maybe 4-5 episodes total of diarrhea (the type that pours out like water - it has a more slimey texture as he improves). No vomiting, no lethargy, no behavioral changes. He doesn't seem to be in pain when he "goes", but it does tire him out. The vet thinks he has some IBD issues and recommended probiotics and enzymes.

He's being fasted right now. Once his GI tract clears out (no more diarrhea) he'll get some super mushy rice with a cooked egg. This usually makes everything form. He then gets a small amount of kibble (eating Annamaet Aqualuk Grain-Free Cold Water Formula). If diarrhea comes back, he'll get more rice for another day.

So I was thinking of trying pre-made RAW once his current bag of food is finished. I don't have the freezer space to do full out raw.

Can anyone recommend premade raw foods. Also, any recommendations on enzyme/probiotic combos to help in the meantime?

Sorry for such a long post!
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Old 01-05-2014, 01:10 PM   #2 (permalink)
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have you tried other kibble brands?
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Old 01-05-2014, 01:34 PM   #3 (permalink)
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Tons...He was on Cannidae when I got him, but it made him itchy. I've tried: Acana, Fromm, California Natural, Nature's Logic. I've tried unique protein (CN was Kangaroo and Lentil). The food he's on now is all fish. Nothing seems to work. He'll go a few months OK, then all of a sudden diarrhea, then back to being OK until the next bout.

Side note: During the months he is OK, his stool is formed but not firm. Always on the softer side. Still easy to pick up though.
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Old 01-05-2014, 02:22 PM   #4 (permalink)
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Hi Rainer,
So sorry your boy, and you trying to help him, has had so much trouble!
A GREAT Digestive Enzyme and ProBiotic is called Sunday Sundae (Carmspac here on the blog). It has helped dogs with gut related problems and allergies. You can purchase it here: Sunday Sundae Nutritional Supplement Sunday Sundae has four direct sources of digestive enzymes and probiotics. One source is a 14 strain digestive enzyme blend plus goat whey matrix. The whey powder provides electrolytes, minerals and digestive enzymes. Probiotics are provided by an 11 strain blend plus lacto fermented goat protein powered. Digestive enzymes and probiotics to optimize nutrition and balance the immune system.

Because of his gut issues, always check for the fat content as too much will irritate his system further. For commercially prepared raw food, Northwest Naturals example:
BEEF
Beef, Beef Heart, Beef Liver, Ground Beef Bone, Broccoli, Carrots, Beef Kidney, Romaine Lettuce, Apples, Ground Flaxseed, Salmon Oil, Apple Cider Vinegar, Blueberry, Cranberry, Inulin, Dried Kelp, Potassium Chloride, Sodium Chloride, Ginger, Parsley, Garlic, Zinc Proteinate, Iron Proteinate, Vitamin E Supplement, Copper Proteinate, Manganese Proteinate, Mixed Tocopherols (as preservative), Vitamin D Supplement.
CA/PH 1.68/1 36%DMB
80% Meat; 18.15% Fruits/Vegetables; 1.85% Supplements
Crude Protein (12% min) Crude Fat (10% min) Crude Fiber (2.0% Max) Moisture (72% max)
Calorie Content: 43kcal per oz
Nuggets Find a store near you: http://cms.nwnaturals.net/raw/index...._3=1&Itemid=48

Another choice would be The Honest Kitchen DE-Hydrated products which are 100% Human Grade Ingredients prepared in a 100% Human Grade Facility. This is the ONLY pet food in the USA that the FDA legally allows the words “HUMAN GRADE” to be used on its packaging and advertising. This food has helped countless dogs with issues such as yours. A 10# box re-hydrates to approx. 35-40 pounds. I would highly suggest the GRAIN FREE versions: Embark, Love, or Zeal. www.thehonestkitchen.com
Find a store near you: Where to Buy Honest Kitchen - Honest Kitchen Stores | The Honest Kitchen


Don't forget to transition slowly.


Good luck!
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Old 01-05-2014, 02:33 PM   #5 (permalink)
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Forgot to mention a homeopathic remedy that helped save my dogs life, who had similar issues.
Company Name: Prof. Compl. Health FormulasDIGESTIVE ENZYME DROPS: No food or water 20 minutes before dosing, then give remedy and wait 10-20 minutes before putting food down.)
Provides homeopathic aid in support of digestive disorders, enzyme production, and tissue rejuvenation.
Vagus nerve 6X, Gallbladder 6X, 12X, 30X, Large intestine 6X, 12X, 30X, Liver 6X, 12X, 30X, Pancreas 6X, 12X, 30X, Parotid 6X, 12X, 30X, Small intestine 6X, 12X, 30X, Stomach 6X, 12X, 30X, Secretin 12X, 30X, purified water, 20% USP alcohol
2 Oz. $14 Digestive Enzyme Drops 2 oz (60 ml) by Professional Formulas
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Old 01-05-2014, 03:01 PM   #6 (permalink)
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Thank you for your response

I have the Sunday Sundae, but it didn't seem to help. Perhaps I was using it incorrectly? I put a tsp of the powder in yogurt or kefir, mixed it up and let it sit for a few minutes to come to room temp, let him have half and immediately gave him his food, then immediately gave him the other half. Is this correct?

I will look into the raw options. Thank you for the suggestions!

Poor pup has been sleeping all day - we didn't get any sleep last night. His gut seems to have calmed down a bit. I gave him some yogurt with the Sunday Sundae mixed in and added an extra probiotic (Milk-Free Probiotic Acidophilus Plus FOS Vcaps - Bluebonnet Product - Bluebonnet Nutrition) I use and it seems to have helped for the time being.

**Edit to ask: What dosage do you recommend for the drops in the second link? I believe the link gives dosage recommendation for an adult human. Rainer is about 77-78lbs and very lean. He eats twice a day.
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Last edited by Rainer; 01-05-2014 at 03:03 PM.
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Old 01-05-2014, 05:17 PM   #7 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Rainer View Post
Thank you for your response

I have the Sunday Sundae, but it didn't seem to help. Perhaps I was using it incorrectly? I put a tsp of the powder in yogurt or kefir, mixed it up and let it sit for a few minutes to come to room temp, let him have half and immediately gave him his food, then immediately gave him the other half. Is this correct?

I will look into the raw options. Thank you for the suggestions!

Poor pup has been sleeping all day - we didn't get any sleep last night. His gut seems to have calmed down a bit. I gave him some yogurt with the Sunday Sundae mixed in and added an extra probiotic (Milk-Free Probiotic Acidophilus Plus FOS Vcaps - Bluebonnet Product - Bluebonnet Nutrition) I use and it seems to have helped for the time being.

**Edit to ask: What dosage do you recommend for the drops in the second link? I believe the link gives dosage recommendation for an adult human. Rainer is about 77-78lbs and very lean. He eats twice a day.
You are most welcome!
I've been there and almost lost my dog, so I know what you are going thru!

Yes, you did it correctly according to the instructions, but I think since it wasn't working, drop the yogurt/keifer and just put it in barley warm water to set for a time, then mix in your food. Carmen suggests working up to 1 Tablespoon per meal, adjust to where the stool is firm and stick with that dose.
The BlueBonnet product looks fine, but may be too much with the SS.
He may need "bile" added to his food to assist the gut, but I'd hold on that for now.
The Homeopathic should be 10 drops per meal.
Also could be that he just needs to get off of that food.
This is what Dr. Becker says to use to give the gut a rest for a week or so:

"The bland diet I recommend is cooked ground turkey (93%meat/7%fat) and 100 percent canned pumpkin (no spices) or cooked sweet potato. This is mixed 50/50). The old-school bland diet of beef and rice isn’t as effective, in my opinion, because the beef is high in fat, which can increase inflammation and promote pancreatitis. Rice is a complex carbohydrate that tends to ferment in the GI tract, causing gas, bloating, and additional GI irritation."
Then maybe you could transition on to the HK Zeal (if he is ok with fish). "Ideal for those dogs who need a limited ingredient diet." Of course, this is the more expensive one, but considering your dogs problem, I would spend the money!
BTW, I wouldn't give him any store bought treats, only very small pieces of cooked meat (such as round steak or chicken cooked without fat or skin attached).

Feel free to pm me if you have specific questions.
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Old 01-07-2014, 07:12 PM   #8 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Rainer View Post
Tons...He was on Cannidae when I got him, but it made him itchy. I've tried: Acana, Fromm, California Natural, Nature's Logic. I've tried unique protein (CN was Kangaroo and Lentil). The food he's on now is all fish. Nothing seems to work. He'll go a few months OK, then all of a sudden diarrhea, then back to being OK until the next bout.

Side note: During the months he is OK, his stool is formed but not firm. Always on the softer side. Still easy to pick up though.
Raw could very well help, but the "cyclical" nature you suggest could be indicative of underlying giardia. Often the symptoms of giardia cycle like this-- spores are shed intermittently and the dog only has diarrhea once in a while. Giardia can be extremely difficult to catch in fecal exams, even antigen tests, and can persist for long periods in the GI tract.

Many on this site have suggested and had great luck with Kocci Free for this type of ongoing, intermittent colitis:

Amazon.com: Amber Technology Kocci Free: Pet Supplies Amazon.com: Amber Technology Kocci Free: Pet Supplies

It's not super pricey and is a natural supplement, so you never know... Might help.

Good luck. I know (from ongoing experience) how tricky these persistent GI issues can be.
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Old 01-07-2014, 07:17 PM   #9 (permalink)
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Did you get Rainer blood tested for Pancreatitis? My GSD just got diagnosed with it today (she is only 5 months old). The only way they can diagnose it is with a blood test. My pup is on 5 different medications some ranging 4 days to 2 weeks and can't eat until tomorrow. If in doubt ask your vet to perform a blood test for everything including pancreatitis.
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Old 01-07-2014, 08:03 PM   #10 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by _Zero_ View Post
Raw could very well help, but the "cyclical" nature you suggest could be indicative of underlying giardia. Often the symptoms of giardia cycle like this-- spores are shed intermittently and the dog only has diarrhea once in a while. Giardia can be extremely difficult to catch in fecal exams, even antigen tests, and can persist for long periods in the GI tract.

Many on this site have suggested and had great luck with Kocci Free for this type of ongoing, intermittent colitis:

Amazon.com: Amber Technology Kocci Free: Pet Supplies

It's not super pricey and is a natural supplement, so you never know... Might help.

Good luck. I know (from ongoing experience) how tricky these persistent GI issues can be.
Not familiar with the Giardia cycle. How long would the diarrhea episodes generally last if it is Giardia? The past couple of times he got the squirts it only lasted one day (fasted that day), then back to normal once he got some food in him.

I'm trying out some homeopathic enzymes and pro-biotics that were recommended (thanks again, Momto2GSDs!) along with a meat blend to see how he does. He's currently eating cooked ground turkey with pumpkin just to give his gut a break. Hopefully I will make a separate thread on raw soon....I've been trying to research as well as figure out some logistics.

Will look into Kocci Free if the enzymes/probiotics don't work

GI issues are beyond frustrating. Drives both of us crazy since it only seems to start up before bedtime and then we're both up all night so I can run him outside.

Quote:
Originally Posted by stellagirl View Post
Did you get Rainer blood tested for Pancreatitis? My GSD just got diagnosed with it today (she is only 5 months old). The only way they can diagnose it is with a blood test. My pup is on 5 different medications some ranging 4 days to 2 weeks and can't eat until tomorrow. If in doubt ask your vet to perform a blood test for everything including pancreatitis.
If he still has issues with the diet change, I will take him to the vet for blood work. I've spoken to the vet about this and he seems to just think he has IBD, recommended enzymes/probiotics. Also recommended I switch to a raw diet...
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Kitty Cat Monsters
Ashes- AKA "Queen Bia"
Mish Mish - Mr. Cuddle Bug

Last edited by Rainer; 01-07-2014 at 08:05 PM.
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