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Severe Itchiness that BAFFLES vet

26K views 154 replies 33 participants last post by  GatorBytes 
#1 ·
My GSD Panzer has been battling some form of allergies or skin disorder since a young pup. I've spent thousands of dollars on tests and medication and nothing seems to be working.

His skin is almost always red and irritated, and often takes on a black scaly texture in certain areas. He rubs his face constantly on the furniture to the point where the poor thing bleeds! He's itched off his belly and underarm and neck hair.

This usually goes away for a little while with a string of prednisone and antibiotics but fairly shortly after he's taken off it he gets another flare up.

I submitted his blood for allergy testing from Spectra Labs and they determined he's allergic to almost everything. Potatoes, Peas, Pork, fleas, house flies, nuts, certain trees, grass, and much more. His ears are constantly bothering him and get some sort of yeasty build up. I try to control it with the use of KetFlush which was provided by the vet.

To attempt to alleviate his symptoms he has been taking regular homeopathic allergen injection shots but they don't seem very effective, even now as he approaches the highest dosage concentration.

We also changed his dog food to one that doesn't contain any known allergens, and give him ONLY fresh spring water to drink. I'm at a complete loss here. He's been previously treated for allergy flare ups with prednisone and also the yeast with special shampoos and pills.

They checked him for mites with a sample under a microscope, and was told they didn't find anything. They also examined him for fleas and said he was clear.

I just want him to be healthy and happy. He's almost 2 years old and I've had to stop his training due to his health issues and I also have to walk him on pavement and avoid dog parks for fear the allergens will cause a flare up.

Please help. I've run out of idea's to try, and I'm still no closer to understanding what's wrong with my dog. Any insights or ideas?
 
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#2 · (Edited)
Does he smell odd -- like sweaty socks? I'm wondering if it's as a systemic yeast infection. Is that something the vet already tested and ruled out?

The reason I wonder is this: with several fosters, a vet told me itchy, black patches of skin and stinky smell was a yeast infection on the skin. On the vet's recommendation, a bottle of medicated shampoo like KetaChlor (chlorhexadene/ketoconazole) has worked wonders for several dogs (we often have to shampoo every few days for a while). It's a cheap solution too.
 
#3 ·
sounds like malassezia , systemic yeast infection - treat inside and outside - must do both.

https://www.google.ca/search?q=mala...SEIbcyQGK34DIDA&ved=0CC8QsAQ&biw=1097&bih=483

shampoo with a sulfur enhanced degreasing product - Mane N Tail PROTECT , Selsun Blue fortified --
treat skin with USNEA safe internally and externally - a strong anti fungal , immune support

add MSM - organic sulfur to diet

look to over all quality of diet --- Not so much about allergens than it is about grains , sugars (humectants) - poor quality protein , not enough overall quality to support a struggling immune system.

coconut oil massage on skin , coconut oil in diet -- the higher the lauric acid content the better. Not all coconut oil is equal.

have helped many dogs like this over the years . I wonder why your vet is baffled ?
 
#5 ·
I also agree with everyone.
Here are 2 other things you can try.

*A 50/50 mix of Apple Cider Vinegar and Purified Water rinse after a bath. Pour on and work into coat/skin in small patches, eventually covering the whole dog. Do not rinse, let drip dry. (It will burn if used on broken skin)
*Listerine Recipe For Dry/Itchy Skin
I know it sounds greasy, but it’s really not! Works well on dogs with skin issues, hot spots, dandruff, and dry skin.
In a clean spray bottle add 1/3 cup of baby oil, 1/3 cup of original Listerine (the gold colored one) and 1/3 cup of water. Shake the bottle to mix, spray lightly on dog and work into coat. Repeat during the week when you see that it has absorbed. Always shake mixture before spraying pet.


I'm sure your vet told you that in Homeopathy, it gets worse before it gets better (most of the time) but also in a small percentage of dogs, it just doesn't work.


I'm curious if your vet has considered SLIT (Sublingual Immunotherapy) In some dogs, this will work better than the injections.

Heska - New ALLERCEPT® Allergy Therapy Drops for dogs, cats, and horses.
http://www.heska.com/Documents/Allergy/White-Paper,-Sublingual-Immunotherapy-for-Dogs.pdf
A New Approach to Immunotherapy | Dermatology for Animals - Part 1
Sublingual Immunotherapy | Pet Allergy Treatment Advances



"Allergy drops work on the underlying cause of allergies, the immune system, to desensitize the patient."
The antigen's are combined on an individual basis, and administered buy a pump spray bottle, in the mouth, allowing the soft tissue to absorb it. Then the dosages are increased gradually until the patient develops a tolerance to the allergy causing substance.


Have you tried a raw diet?


I hope you find the answer. This sounds like it's been very trying for both of you!
Moms:)
 
#6 ·
I am facing the exact same thing. Phoenix has HORRIBLE flea allergies, and the fleas are VEEEERRRRRY hard to control at my house, we have carpet and clutter... But I have waged war on the fleas. I am posting mostly to see what others have said, as I have no ideas other than getting to the bottom of whatever the issue is.
(By the wa, I am using KetaChlor, and it works very well. It has steroids in it to help the skin, and it works very well, but only as long as the bottle lasts...)
 
#7 ·
Forgot to mention that you can use the ACV in your dogs food and drizzle over the kibble! If your dog doesn't like it, add a little non fat Chicken Broth to it, if he is not sensitive to chicken. Or you can add it to the water bowl.

  • 35 lbs to 84 lbs - 1 tbs;
  • 85 lbs to 134 lbs - 1.5 tbsp;
  • 135 lbs to 200 lbs – 2 tbsp.
Or, 1 Tablespoon per 16 ounces of water.

I know you did "allergy tests" but you may want to consider testing by Dr. Jean Dodds, called NutriScan. NutriScan Food Sensitivity and Intolerance Test for Cats and Dogs.


This test measures antibodies to certain foods in dog saliva. High antibody levels indicate that the dog has a food sensitivity and intolerance to that food or foods. Food intolerance or sensitivity is actually quite common whereas food allergy is rare. In fact, food intolerance is the third most common sensitivity condition in dogs and often can be easily remedied with a change in diet. Dr. Jean Dodds, NutriScan tests for the twenty most commonly ingested foods by dogs to provide you with specific results as to your dog's food intolerances or sensitivities. Since it is a salivary test, you have the convenience to complete the test at home or at your veterinarian’s office. Best of all, you can have the results in approximately two weeks to help you put your dog on the right diet.
NutriScan is novel and patented and is not testing for food allergies, but rather tests for food sensitivities and intolerance. These are different body immune responses. Food allergy is a more immediate reaction mediated by production of IgE and IgG antibodies. Food sensitivity and intolerance, by contrast, measures a more delayed body response to offending foods by measuring production of IgA and IgM antibodies primarily in mucosal secretions from the bowel.”

I'd get both panels done if you decide to do this.;)

Moms:)

 
#8 ·
#10 · (Edited)
When my shepherd itches to the point where hair falls off and skin turns black due to either some environmental allergy or insect bites (she likes to run into bushes on hikes with my blessing) I've applied the ACV and rubbed coconut oil as mentioned by other posters. It has worked great to decrease the itch and they all heal nicely. I learned to do that from this forum.
 
#11 ·
I use coconut oil as well. Topical and internally. I agree with trying to do a raw diet with very limited ingredients to start. Three months is about the time frame for seeing any change.
 
#12 ·
Is your dog on any topical (spot-on) HW/flea prevention?

DO NOT vaccinate at this time. the yeast issue is likely due to a hormonal imbalance, an immune system go awry.

Kelp
Ashwagandha (herb - works on the adrenal glands and thyroid)
Zinc
Good B-complex (B3 is natural antibacterial), B-family helps with metabolizing fats and proteins (B12 should be in Methyl form, not Cyano)...I like New Roots Ultra B50

RAW!!! Cannot emphasize enough - grass fed if you can afford. Absolutely NO sugars - this means no peas, potatos, rice, yogurt, wheat, corn, carrots, barely, honey, molasses - ANYTHING that is starch/carbohydrate(incl. fruit or vegetable) that converts to sugar

And I second the:
Coconut oil
ACV
MSM
 
#13 ·
I had a 2 year experience with this sort of symptom. They didn't find mange in the skin scraping; allergy test showed sensitivity to a gazzillion things. Allergy shots did nothing for them. Finally treated for mange and that took care of it. After my experience (the dogs were close to dying from it), I'd treat for mange to see if that took care of the problem. Only after that would I look at allergies. (BTW Prednizone is contraindicated with mange.)
 
#17 ·
Sorry guys for all the questions, but I also would like to know how to switch to a homemade raw dog food diet? What does it need it in? Any recipes? Is raw the way to go or should I cook it? Oh and I just applied coconut oil over his entire body (parts where hair is missing and is clearly itchy)

Thanks again guys for all your help

Apple cider Vinegar (ACV), get Bragg's - Raw organic - from health food store. Add tblsp. to water. Make a 50/50 solution with water and use that on itchy hairless areas allow to dry and then put coconut oil on.

You can also use veterecyn - but ACV is a lot cheaper, however, ACV may sting a bit, but then it is soothing. will kill bacteria and heal the sores.

To find your threads go to search (next to new posts), click there and click find my threads.

RAW...all you need is muscle meat, bone and organ meat. Search RAW dog ranch on here - Laurie, a moderators site for ratios for your dogs weight. Rule of thumb is 2-3% of target body weight...to keep simple, say dog is 100lbs, then feed 2-3lbs of food based on activity level, age.

I feed ground turkey and chicken frames and beef or chicken offal (organ) meat.

You may want to go really lean to start as fat can be hard to digest and you don't want to be discouraged with diarrhea as a set back and abandon RAW.

Have you started a thread under RAW forums? Get lots of good advice, make sure you mention yeasty issues as people will tell you to add yogurt or cottage cheese - DON'T do that - no sugars!
Cheers
 
#16 · (Edited)
Sorry guys for all the questions, but I also would like to know how to switch to a homemade raw dog food diet? What does it need it in? Any recipes? Is raw the way to go or should I cook it? Oh and I just applied coconut oil over his entire body (parts where hair is missing and is clearly itchy)

Thanks again guys for all your help
 
#19 ·
How often should I bathe him with KetaChlor and should I apply the ACV after the bathe and THEN apply coconut oil? And should I put some in his food as well? I'v dished out thousands of dollars at this point and I just want to make sure I'm doing everything correctly.
 
#24 ·
How often should I bathe him with KetaChlor
Ketachlor is a RX product -- please ask your vet about recommended useage based on your dog's prescription (I also recommend thinking carefully about advice to dump products prescribed by your vet without talking it through with your vet--your vet needs to be part of this conversation!)

For *my* foster dog whose situation may be different than *your* dog, the vet advised to wash with this RX shampoo at least 1x week, but up to 2x a week if needed -- and follow bottle directions exactly (leaving it on the recommended time).
 
#23 ·
Okay guys so I should bathe him, then apply ACV and coconut oil after the ACV dries......How ofter should I do this? Should ACV and CO only be applied after baths? Or more often?

What specifically should I get for probiotics??? I plan on starting him on both the RAW diet and on the "detox" ASAP. I just need a clear plan of attack......

What to give him, how often, and when......etc etc....Thanks all.
 
#25 ·
I am using KetaChlor, and intend on continuing using it. I just need to know what else I need to do and the frequencies in doing them. How often do I apply ACV and CO?

What probiotics should I give him and how much and frequently? Is there anything else I should be giving him? How frequently and how much of those?

Thanks again all
 
#27 ·
I am using KetaChlor, and intend on continuing using it. I just need to know what else I need to do and the frequencies in doing them. How often do I apply ACV and CO?

What probiotics should I give him and how much and frequently? Is there anything else I should be giving him? How frequently and how much of those?

Thanks again all
Use the ACV spritz 2-3x per day. CO at least 2x per day...Don't see any sense in using after bath w/KetaChlor as there is some ingredient in it that seals the skin, I guess to hold the "medicinal" part of the shampoo in to kill yeast (which in my opinion, you are holding the toxic elements of the shampoo in, as well as the toxins trying to leave the body, which they will need to do, via the skin, hence NEEM shampoo).

I am not sure if Momto2GSD's is on this thread or other...she has lots of suggestions on probiotics.

Carmen who is easy to find a post or two back also has a probiotic/digestive enzyme product. Click on her link in her signature.

Depending on the probiotic, label directions.

Start there (recap):
RAW
Probiotic/enzyme
AVC (external spritz - internal - tblsp. in drinking water)
CO (external/internal)
Shampoo - NEEM (or use the rx. stuff)

Will get into supplementation/liver detox once you get this in motion

Please take before pictures as WHEN this works, you will want to share to help others.;)
 
#29 ·
Not sure I understand the question:confused: Is it just the back or attached to leg quarter? I would pull fat off just to get started, as I mentioned, you don't want a set back with diarrhea. You can graduate it in as dogs need fat.

Good for you for taking the plunge!
 
#30 ·
Try... no beef and no wheat for awhile ...

Make sure no beef or wheat is in the diet for awhile just to eliminate them as suspects.
Several dog foods contain neither beef or wheat, Taste of the Wild (not the buffalo) and Innova are two we have used.
Kazar went to a veterinary dermatologist and he told us to remove wheat and beef from the diet first thing (before the vet performed any costly allergy tests).
He was right, it cured him.
Miss Molly showed early signs of the same problem and we removed beef and wheat from her diet and it worked for her too.

Poor Panzar, he must be miserable.
Good luck.
 
#31 ·
Sorry for not being clear. Me and my wife are nervous about giving Panzer chicken bones in general. Or any bones for that matter. We've only given him beef marrow bones in the past which he can only gnaw on and not actually eat it in pieces.

Is there anything special I need to do to give him the bones? I just bought some chicken quarters to start with. Do I give it to him whole? Bones and all?

Can the bones hurt him? I mean can it cut him internally and cause internal bleeding? Thanks all


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