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Old 02-07-2014, 03:36 PM   #61 (permalink)
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Default I may have the answer your looking for based on experince

I feel for the dog and the OP here and I hope you look at the fact this is my first post in a contribution manner..? I dealt with my wife's dog having open sore's when we first met in 1992 and found the cause pretty quickly when "Spankie" would have puss, bleed, lick and itch all day and night. I am reluctant to post a vet's name here as I do not know the rules regarding this. But he is an allergy specialist and he has/had a list of celebrity clientele everybody know's as; "Captain Kirk." Inside of 5 weeks "Spankie" started growing eyelashes and the sores healed over. It may have to do with a hormone called Cortisol levels..? I am not the doctor. I am simply saying if you wish to PM me.. I will direct you to the Vet of my choice in this dilemma.. Although, I read your on the East Coast and he is on the West Coast. He can be contacted on his website or at the Clinic. He's the best that ever walked and talked on allergy..

Interested in knowing the changes good and bad that have taken place with the GSDs since the late 1980s.


Hope this works out so the fun can continue...
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Old 02-07-2014, 04:22 PM   #62 (permalink)
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Panzer looks exactly like my Dante.

But Dante lost all of his 'mane' around his shoulders as well and ALL of his skin from his testies to his pits had turned black, thick and rough.

Stop the allergy shots. Do not use any more "medicine" on him. Stop the baths. Let his skin heal.

Do not even give him his yearly shots right now.

Get a pet balm, like Bag Balm, or pet vet balm. It is thick, will give his skin a barrier between everything and will stay on through the licking. It wont hurt them either if they digest it.

Yes I went through a TON of Bag Balm. I put it on so thick it looked like he was ready for cooking. On his feet I globed it on, covered it with children's socks and then topped it off with Vet Wrap.

For his ears, get an ear rinse that promotes drying out the ear. Use it as recommended and ABSOLUTELY ANY TIME he is outside in wet conditions(rain, snow, sprinklers), after bathing, or water sports. Not an antibiotic rinse. Just a normal Over the counter rinse.

You want to get all foreign invaders OUT of his body and let it 're-boot' it's healing.

Now the ugly part. The diet. I do not like touching most of the meat they have to eat, but, they sure do love eating it.

It is gross, both inside and out. Panzer will likely have disgusting bowel movements and they will scare the bee geesus out of you. Right now IMO only worry if you see blood, because everything coming out needs to come out. It is all the bad stuff his body has been dealing with.

Now you know your dog best, and if he seems to be getting worse of course you should consult a vet. But for starting this new diet, give it time and have some faith.

Dante was 60 lbs at the worst of his symptoms. He had lost 15 lbs and he was supposed to be gaining at the time. And he was so absolutely not feeling well that he seemed like a beaten dog. Just wanted no one to touch him and no attention because he looked as well as felt terrible.
Dante still watches me if I have cloths and spray bottles.

It took us three months to see MASS improvements.
Things slowly got better at the start.
First the heat and red skin receded.
Then he slowed at licking himself raw.
Dante lost ALL of his hair(about February), the first wave was his long coat and he looked bald. He was bald on his chest, tummy and shoulders. His short coat was rough.
Then he stopped weeping. His skin just had a crustiness that turned to a flaking.
Then his skin got softer where it was black and started to gray out.
He would still lick his paws, scratch his ears and go over his bald spots.
But we kept up the bag balm.
His ears were still infected and stinky and we had to work super hard on them.
By the end of that summer Dante had regrown all his hair, his skin was light gray soft and supple and he had no red, raw, hot, black or tough skin.
His ears were still infected and we had to clean them so much.

During the worst of his episodes we did not train, or play much. And during the raw diet start up we did not train or work out. My main focus was on keeping his skin clean, supple with the balm and free of sores. Plus Dante did not feel liek doing anything but gnawing or licking himself. So keeping his maw off his sore skin was a task.

Just make sure that YOU are aware of everything going in and at what is coming out of him. Make sure no one else is sneaking him left overs, or treats that are not RAW. Make sure he is staying out of the garbage and/or not sneaking any other pet's or children's foods.

Don't forget to get natural chews and treats. It is easy to over look a small biscuit or raw hide and not think they can do just as much damage as the kibble.

And please, please have some faith in the process. Your vet may or most likely will not support your decision to go RAW. And mine had scared me about trying to go raw. But the one I stuck with has seen the proof and she does not say anything bad about it now. She is utterly amazed and happy that Dante is feeling better.
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Old 02-07-2014, 04:44 PM   #63 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by Heidigsd View Post
Don't take this the wrong way but it's time for your dog to see a specialist. Do you have any dermatologists or teaching hospitals where you live?

He looks like he's suffering, I can't even imagine You have gotten a lot of bad advise so far IMHO and I will leave it at that.
completely this
raw isn't the answer to all problems
if dog's allergic to chicken, then what??
a specialist, esp. a holistic one
that dog has no quality of life at this point
if you talk to 100 people they'll give u
100 diff advice
please get to a holistic vet
i hurt looking at that dog
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Old 02-07-2014, 05:02 PM   #64 (permalink)
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Wow.

I can not believe some of the posts.

Have you NOT been reading that Panzer is seeing a Vet and an Allergy vet?

Isn't an Allergy vet a specialist? Really?

Make the owner feel worse because they ask for HELP?

What is the matter with some of you?

My Dante WAS WORSE than the images posted of Panzer. We saw a vet and a secondary vet every month and they had no idea what to do. We did blood tests, skin tests and we were going to see a specialist at WSU in Wa.

RAW/B.A.R.F. may not be the answer, but, deciding against trying it and giving it a chance (with time) is no worse then treating the symptoms improperly with medicines and treatments that have already been exhausted.

Gibby knows that he/r Panzer feels like poop and appears miserable. They don't need others rubbing it in their face when they are seeking any way to possibly improve their pet's life.
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Old 02-08-2014, 02:13 PM   #65 (permalink)
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What is the matter with some of us????? Shouldn't we be asking that question?

For certain people to diagnose and recommend treatment on here without any medical training is at the very least "irresponsible"

Nothing wrong with people sharing their stories about what worked for them but to tell people what they need to do and to stay away from conventional medicine at all cost is ridiculous.

gibby: I don't know who did the allergy testing on your boy but if it wasn't done by a dermatologist it could be wrong, therefore treatment isn't working. What do you mean by "holistic allergy injections"?

If you are only wanting to go the holistic route please find a veterinarian to help you with your dog. First you need a correct diagnosis so they can figure out a treatment plan. And as far as feeding raw I would go over to K9 Kitchen to get some help. Many of these diets (raw or cooked) that float around on the internet are horribly unbalanced.

https://groups.yahoo.com/neo/groups/K9Kitchen/info

And below you can read about the other side of feeding raw that they won't tell you about here. I just like for people to have the pros and cons so they can make an informed decision.

http://www.foodworldnews.com/articles/4822/20131220/drug-resistant-bacteria-found-in-97-percent-of-raw-chicken-sold-in-u-s-supermarket.htm

http://www.merckmanuals.com/vet/management_and_nutrition/nutrition_small_animals/dog_and_cat_foods.html

http://www.tufts.edu/vet/nutrition/resources/raw_meat_diets.pdf

http://www.csuvets.colostate.edu/pain/Articlespdf/Problems%20with%20Raw%20Meat.pdf

http://www.cvm.missouri.edu/News/backus07.htm
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Old 02-08-2014, 07:40 PM   #66 (permalink)
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I am waiting to get an answer from a local vet that has seen a dramatic rise in a particular, "new" skin problem , that has resisted every treatment . Apparently over 50 per cent , 60 or more clinic time , lately, is dealing with this.

The symptoms are a small spot which is itchy , and spreads and is flame red and oozing , skin like a bubble pack . When it heals the skin is rubbery and textured and the hair never grows back properly - length and texture different .
so far this is the only thing that works " The last shot Fraoch got was 1.5 ml of Depomedrol with the 1Duolocillin LA CANINE. The cost of both is fairly expensive . It does help though do us worth the effort" and a shampoo with " the shampoo is either one of UBA vet or Virbac epi soothe shampoo and cream rinse is Virbac‎ epi soothe cream rinse. "
Vitamin E and D seem to help .
this particular dog is a friends dog , a cobby wire haired fox terrier.
Wondering if it is some environmental or deficiency based problem.
These are experienced dog owners, 2 GSD of mine. Both husband and wife are in the medical field . Waiting for some knowledge from the vet , apparently conferencing with others in the area.
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Old 02-08-2014, 08:27 PM   #67 (permalink)
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Well I hope Gibby gets back on board soon to read Nyx posts - very encouraging!

Heidi, Gibby is doing a LID diet it it's most primal, natural form (except the meat is from Wal-Mart, so not grass fed)...how is that any different from anybody else flip flopping around diff. LID kibble foods - other then the obvious - kibble is dead and you don't know what goes into it AND there are testimonials after testimonials of people who's dogs were restored to good health from a RAW food diet.

HE doesn't need to spend $400 on an e-mail consult from some woman who makes her living designing kibble ingredient diets in a natural form. i.e carrots, rice, berries etc. etc.

What gibby needs is a holistic vet who can detox the carcinogens put into this dog who is immune compromised due to conventional methods of treatment.

Heidi: Furthermore, just because YOU don't believe in a RAW diet, doesn't mean no one else should. The sensationalism in your links is just that. Same old, same old, conventional argument - which goes back to profits, not concern for animal health (or human for that matter)

60 +% of disease can be cured with diet alone.
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Old 02-08-2014, 08:32 PM   #68 (permalink)
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" The last shot Fraoch got was 1.5 ml of Depomedrol with the 1Duolocillin LA CANINE. The cost of both is fairly expensive . It does help though do us worth the effort" and a shampoo with " the shampoo is either one of UBA vet or Virbac epi soothe shampoo and cream rinse is Virbac‎ epi soothe cream rinse. "

I can't tell on my phone, so I think I am quoting something you were quoting, my phone messes up things a lot, but.... Just to clarify and hipefully help, DepoMedrol is CHEAP, and is the Duolcillan LA. It's just penicillin. Like should be 2 pennies a CC.
Just don't want your friend to get ripped off. I am glad it's working. I must say though. That I find it hilarious that with all the new fangled high end medicine, referrals, allergy tests, yadda yadda, the thing that helping is good old steroids and penicillin.


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Old 02-08-2014, 08:35 PM   #69 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by gsdsar View Post
I can't tell on my phone, so I think I am quoting something you were quoting, my phone messes up things a lot, but.... Just to clarify and hipefully help, DepoMedrol is CHEAP, and is the Duolcillan LA. It's just penicillin. Like should be 2 pennies a CC.
Just don't want your friend to get ripped off. I am glad it's working. I must say though. That I find it hilarious that with all the new fangled high end medicine, referrals, allergy tests, yadda yadda, the thing that helping is good old steroids and penicillin.


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But that is the problem...that's not what is helping - it's what's hurting. Carmen also notes deficiency possibility. That would mean trace minerals, vitamins in bio-available form
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Old 02-09-2014, 06:41 AM   #70 (permalink)
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For certain people to diagnose and recommend treatment on here without any medical training is at the very least "irresponsible"
Wow. Really. Are you a VET?
Or are you a Vet Tech?
If it is the former; congrats on passing vet school. Are you specialized in Canine medicine?
If so then please PM Myself and Gibby to find out the more specific symptoms and all the TREATMENTS we have tried. And you can even contact my Vet and see what she has to say.
If you are a Vet Tech; then you only know what you have seen in the office and then what worked for that patient.
Basically if is walks like a duck, and quack likes a duck, then it must be a duck.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Heidigsd
Nothing wrong with people sharing their stories about what worked for them but to tell people what they need to do and to stay away from conventional medicine at all cost is ridiculous.
Did anyone say, 'STAY AWAY from the VET'? NO.
Did anyone say, 'Stay away from a specialist or derma, or (________)'?

NO.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Heidigsd
gibby: I don't know who did the allergy testing on your boy but if it wasn't done by a dermatologist it could be wrong, therefore treatment isn't working. What do you mean by "holistic allergy injections"?

If you are only wanting to go the holistic route please find a veterinarian to help you with your dog. First you need a correct diagnosis so they can figure out a treatment plan. And as far as feeding raw I would go over to K9 Kitchen to get some help. Many of these diets (raw or cooked) that float around on the internet are horribly unbalanced.
I think you MISSED the parts where Panzers mom/dad Gibby said that they WERE seeing a Vet and a Allergy Vet.

And if telling my "story" as you say helps this dog to better health and well being then I will scream it. I will post it over, and over and over and clarify what I did for my Dante and how AWESOME he is now physically.

I have a vet that has SEEN the change and she has NOTHING bad to say about the Diet and lack of medicines and steroids my dog now has to take.

and let me repeat:
Gibby and Panzer,

I have posted to you previously in your other thread.

I understand that you want to do the VERY best for your Panzer and that you have exhausted every treatment option the Vet has given you.

And I know that the Veterinarian and Vet Techs are trained professionals.

But they have no idea what the process for making commercial kibble is. (Does any one truly?)

And I can't say that the commercial kibble is sub standard or processed too much for real dietary needs of canines.

But I can attest to the change in my dog. So can my Vet.

I can tell you what I fed my dog and I can tell you exactly what my dog suffered.

And I can tell you what I tried. And I can tell you what I changed.

And I can tell you how Dante is now.

Even show you a picture, but, not having the past images does not help you.

I can tell you I am not promoting any products, brand name, vet or any supplement.

I just wanted my dog to be healthy and happy.

And Now I want to help any one who has a dog suffering similar symptoms.

GatorBytes, Carmen and Mom helped me so much. I have to give them much gratitude for my Dante, because he has never met them but his health has greatly improved by my knowing them(through this site).
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